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Old 07-20-2012, 06:24 PM   #521
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Originally Posted by anitram

I don't mean to minimize it but surely other people end up having careers in your field without the benefit of having covered Big 10 athletic teams? I mean I know some of those people so obviously it does happen. And you've had 3 years of experience there - you can't possibly think that your career is over before you've even walked out the door, even if a death penalty happens this September (probably unlikely)? I just think that's an unwarranted pessimistic view.
What I mean is: if the season is canceled I lose almost four months of work, replaced by essentially nothing. And my experience in my first two years was limited because seniority rules. They tell you to wait for your senior year to get the big opportunities. Now it is here, and it is in jeopardy.

I can't go elsewhere. This is where I can work. I can't try and transfer. I can't replace it with more of other sports: I am already doing as much as I can with other sports.
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Old 07-20-2012, 06:33 PM   #522
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What I mean is: if the season is canceled I lose almost four months of work, replaced by essentially nothing. And my experience in my first two years was limited because seniority rules. They tell you to wait for your senior year to get the big opportunities. Now it is here, and it is in jeopardy.

I can't go elsewhere. This is where I can work. I can't try and transfer. I can't replace it with more of other sports: I am already doing as much as I can with other sports.
Welcome to the real world.
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Old 07-20-2012, 06:57 PM   #523
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I'm done.
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Old 07-20-2012, 08:34 PM   #524
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I'd say I was sorry for you... and I am... but you've made it abundantly clear that you don't want said sympathy.

I still think Penn State football should get as harsh a penalty as the NCAA is capable of handing down.

You are an innocent victim of the crimes of Sandusky, Paterno, Curley, etc.etc.etc. The are at fault here, for everything.

And if the NCAA drops the hammer on Penn State? Yea... it's not the NCAA's fault, or the media's fault, or those of us who want it to happen's fault...

It's Sandusky's fault. Paterno's fault. The administration's fault.

Much like it wasn't fault of the average schmo at Enron or Goldman Sachs who lost everything... it was the fault of those in charge... but it still happened none the less.

I do feel for you, whether you want that sympathy or not I really don't give a shit. I do. It still doesn't change my opinion on what should happen to Penn State. I think that the experiences you've had at PSU will do nothing but help you in the future... there's much more to be said for the experience of going through real tragedy than there is from interviewing a 19 year old in a towel about what his thoughts were on third down. I think, and I hope, that you'll realize this some day.

But Penn State football should receive the death penalty. Somebody earlier said that there shouldn't be a direct comparison between what happened to SMU and what will happen to Penn State. And I agree... Penn State should get more than what SMU got. But I am a realist and know that will not happen.
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Old 07-20-2012, 10:18 PM   #525
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What a fascinating saga. Only in America.

One thing that confuses me: are people asking for the whole university to get shut down or just Penn State's involvement in all things football?
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Old 07-21-2012, 01:43 AM   #526
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The NCAA is an athletics organization.
Punishing the university directly has to come from elsewhere.

But Penn State football nets about $50 million a year last I checked. Only behind Texas.
So that is a significant blow no matter how you slice it.

The death penalty might be a useless penalty in this context. Because it will be considered so significant (only ever given once), that it will not be accompanied by much else (in the way of severity). They'll be saying "come on folks, it took SMU 20 years to come back from it"...which is a distortion. SMU was a different situation. Forget about how that ESPN documentary wanted to pin their 20 year slump on the death penalty. They hired a bunch of shit coaches and got squeezed out of the Big 12 and into mediocre conferences. They could have been back by about...'95 or '96 otherwise. Especially had they got Baylor's spot in the Big 12...and had a commitment to football again, rather than running away from it for fear of their bad rep. PSU wouldn't run from a commitment to football and neither would anyone else. Too much fucking money on the table.

The real penalties come from bowl and TV bans. Because then you are talking about real money. Like most of that $50 million they net per year is TV and Bowl revenue. What is it for the Big Ten? Close to $25 million from TV alone?

And taking Penn State off of TV for...let's say 5 years, might even get them booted out of the Big Ten. Another HUGE financial blow. Meanwhile, trying to recruit top athletes with no bowl games and no TV time will be...um, difficult to say the least. With the death penalty, you might see the TV ban only covered by the years the program is DOA. Because the penalty might be seen as severe enough on its own.

TV and Bowl bans for 5 years would sink the program to obscurity for at least a decade and likely more.
Meanwhile allowing the community around Happy Valley to continue in their economic circles. Not punishing local vendors and retailers and actually turning it into a question of loyalty towards the school and program and away from idol worship.

The death penalty, probably no more than 3 years, would be accompanied by overlapping sanctions and after...let's say 5 years, they fire O'Brien (nothing but a stop-gap hire) and get a real coach and by 2018, Penn State is in reasonably decent shape and still raking the money in almost like nothing happened. They can then say "we were hammered hard we deserve to put it behind us" and move on with a certain amount of credibility.

The other route puts them in a really serious bind for a long while. In other words, the NCAA ought to avoid the death penalty and punish Penn State by more or less forcing the Big Ten to kick them out. 5 years without Penn State TV inventory probably does that. And on top of that, the prospect of trying to get high level D1 players to come play at PSU with no bowls and TV in their future. That's what I would do.

Of course this doesn't address the issues with the university...I have no idea about that.
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Old 07-21-2012, 09:30 AM   #527
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The death penalty has been handed down 5 times...

Kentucky men's basketball, SW men's Louisiana basketball, SMU football, Moorehouse men's soccer, and MacMurray men's tennis.

The only reason Baylor basketball avoided the death penalty, which they should have gotten, was because they self imposed such harsh penalties on themselves that the NCAA let them skirt the death penalty.

That case should be a lesson to Penn State administration... if they really want to avoid the death penalty they need to harshly self impose penalties... including post season bans, a ban on out of conference play, elimination of a large percentage of scholarships, firing of any and all staff involved, and a complete reorganization of their entire athletic department... which are all things that Baylor did.
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Old 07-21-2012, 09:32 AM   #528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by intedomine
What a fascinating saga. Only in America.

One thing that confuses me: are people asking for the whole university to get shut down or just Penn State's involvement in all things football?
Just football... and if you believe something like this can only happen in America, yea... sure.
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Old 07-22-2012, 06:26 AM   #529
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Penn State Live - Penn State president issues statement related to Paterno statue
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Old 07-22-2012, 06:57 AM   #530
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For that reason, I have decided that it is in the best interest of our university and public safety to remove the statue and store it in a secure location.
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Old 07-22-2012, 08:21 AM   #531
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Announcement tomorrow at 9a eastern.

"corrective and punitive measures for Penn State"
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Old 07-22-2012, 08:37 AM   #532
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That it seems the NCAA is in a rush to announce the penalties before the official start of the football season says to me that the death penalty is coming.

The NCAA needs to do the right thing and allow transfers to be eligible immediately, and to allow a one year grace period for those who can't transfer immediately.

And the school should ensure that all football scholarships will be honored regardless... and that if a player were to transfer to a school and not receive a scholarship, that Penn State will pay for the student's full tuition.
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Old 07-22-2012, 09:46 AM   #533
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Is that from Raiders of The Lost Ark? Looks like it
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Old 07-22-2012, 10:40 AM   #534
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yes. it's from raiders first thing i thought of.

heard this on the radio and finally home to copy/paste:

from joe schad on twitter:

Quote:
What is unprecedented is the process through which PSU punishment handed out, not necessarily the penalties
Quote:
Penn State facing loss of bowl/s and scholarships, but not so-called death penalty
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If loss of bowls and or scholarships are significant enough it will be debated if punishment is harsher than one-year suspension of program
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Old 07-22-2012, 12:45 PM   #535
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ESPN saying no death penalty

Penn State Nittany Lions not facing 'death penalty' Monday by NCAA, source says - ESPN
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Old 07-22-2012, 12:53 PM   #536
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CNN is also saying no death penalty.

I heard a local sports radio guy say that the televisions were turned off in the student center when Louis Freeh announced the results of his report. Don't know where he got that information, but if it's true that's unbelievable. They seriously think they can do that to students and treat them like that? Just another indicator of the mindset of some people there.
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Old 07-22-2012, 01:01 PM   #537
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did a quick google search, a team gets 85 scholarships per year. i had no idea it was that many! not sure how many you have to lose before it starts to hurt.

no televised games for 3 years
no home games for 2 years

i want something creative
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Old 07-22-2012, 01:11 PM   #538
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It sounds like they're going to let the football program continue to play, but financially cripple the program.

We'll see when it comes out officially if they went far enough or not.
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Old 07-22-2012, 01:22 PM   #539
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Quote:
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did a quick google search, a team gets 85 scholarships per year. i had no idea it was that many! not sure how many you have to lose before it starts to hurt.

no televised games for 3 years
no home games for 2 years

i want something creative
Ivy League teams give no scholarships... yet they still end up getting kids to go to school for free.

The loss of bowl and TV revenue is a much bigger problem.
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Old 07-22-2012, 01:36 PM   #540
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My guess, which makes me say "wow":

65 scholarships for 3 years
No bowls for 5 years
No home games for 2 years
No televised games for 2 years

All current players can transfer without penalty
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