Why the hate?

[t8thgr8]

u2 need to get weird again

 

[last unicorn]

Some people like to see U2 go back to their past glory or - even better - be stuck in their past forever. Some people - like me - love to see the band evolving and go with them, that also means being open and excited about whatever they are going to do for their next project instead of bitching about how band things are and how bad they will be in the future. I'm excited about the band's future as much as I am about my own or that of people close to me. I don't like to be buried in the past. That's not what U2 is about.

 

[BoMac]

I think that's the problem, alot of times that statement is presented as 'fact'. It's not fact that they in fact do suck. It's an opinion, that's all, and not even a widely held one, imo.

Then would it help clarify things if people preface their comments by stating: "By the way, I'm a big U2 fan, but I much prefer their 90s output, and in my opinion they now suck."?

Because not everyone can articulate things the way they'd like to, or are often incapable of articulating things in a coherent fashion. It doesn't make their opinions any less valuable or important. I think that 99 percent of people on this board are U2 fans, to varying degrees, and not everyone likes their current output.

I'm not the rabid, obsessed fan I used to be. But I come here, not to criticize the band, but because over time I've cultivated certain friendships with people and I find it's a welcome respite from the daily rigors of "real" life. So that being said, should I just not come here anymore, since I no longer worship the ground that Bono walks on? I don't think so.

And I'm sure that the dormant U2 fan in me will awaken once the new album is released. Until then, I reserve the right to criticize where I see fit.

ETA: Oh, and because an opinion is not widely held does not make it any less right or wrong. It's an opinion, every which way you look at it.

 

[Peterrrrr]

The funny thing is that when AB was released it was the same story, alot of fans complained about the new style. The older album was better... The same when UF was released... It is just a natural thing with every artist/group fans.

Some people here resonate that they are to old to experment, they will only do safe albums. But I don't think that, I realy hope that the new album will be special. If we can call HTDAAB an safeplay album, well JT and R&H is most safeplay they done. Those two album aspecially R&H was a big fawning to the american market. AB and Zooropa is still the most brave ones:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry42AY3efqw

 

[doctorwho]

Why do some of you consider yourself to be fans of the band, and yet a lot of what I see around here is:
- How you hate a lot of songs
- How Bono's voice is bad etc
- How Larry's drumming sucks
- How bad different albums are

What do you actually like about U2?

I'll take a stab.

1) Yes, I do dislike some of U2's songs very much. And this is perfectly normal. I do not think it is healthy for anyone to love everything by another. We need to have a critical aspect in order to grow. We need to see if U2 continue to satisfy our musical tastes or not. Disliking some of U2's music actually reveals more about ourselves than it does about U2 or our love of the band. We get to grow musically through U2.

2) I have never felt Bono's voice is bad. There are some days when it's clear his voice isn't there, but that doesn't mean his voice is bad. Bono's voice is his instrument, so he can't mask some mistakes or "off days". Were there times Bono's voice appeared stronger or weaker? Yes. I felt early on, Bono's singing (or his singing style) was rather weak. He improved with UF/JT, but also screamed a lot - and used his falsetto opera voice (also known as his "Kermit voice") to hit notes. With AB, his opera voice was gone, but his high falsetto was there. He had physical limitations on the PopMart and Elevation tours, so it's tough to chastise him then when it's clear his actual voice was ailing. But now that he's recovered, I think he sounds the best ever - he can sound operatic without his Kermit voice, he can scream, he can belt out a song, he can speak - he's possibly the best ever at this point. My point, though, is that even when he was suffering, I still liked the tone and sound of his vocals over almost every other artist. He has a character in his voice that better trained and more talented singers often lack. Some may not have enjoyed Bono's weaker moments, which is understandable considering how strong of a singer he was. But now that his voice has returned, I feel he is just as strong, if not stronger, than he was before. I'm looking forward to the new album and tour.

3) Larry's drumming has gone the same path as Bono's voice. Early on, it was very simplistic. He continued to improve through JT/R&H, but there were still limitations. And I think this led to some of his physical problems. By taking lessons and expanding his horizons of what constitutes drums, U2's sound has become richer and fuller. His style is still simplistic, but he has been able to add to it tremendously, analogous to how Bono has added to his vocals (by tackling different ways of singing - not just screaming or belting out a song). Some may not like Larry's style - but that's their personal preference. This ties to #1, we can love U2, but not all aspects of them.

4) Love of an album also ties to #1 - either we like the work or we don't. What I'm not a fan of is how people just dismiss a decade (like anything post-2000) over say "Pop". Each album has weaknesses. Each album has strengths. If nothing U2 has done in the past decade interests you, then it's clearly time to move on. That doesn't, of course, mean that one still can't post here. But hopefully that person isn't just pining away for another JT or AB.

5) I've stayed a U2 fan for 25 years because it seems they have always been in some sort of musical resonance with me. In other words, U2 have been musically in sync. with me. Each time I wanted a certain sound, U2 seemed to deliver. They almost always stood out amongst the popular artists of the time, which I have loved and appreciated. Several years ago, when Edge's daughter stated that nothing on the radio sounded like HTDAAB, I was happy. Edge's daughter perhaps feared this would mean a flop - but U2's knack for standing out against the mainstream is what has made them succeed. Let's hope it happens again.

 

[Needle_Chill]

Nobody taught him to close his mouth when he chews.

 

[doctorwho]

Nobody taught him to close his mouth when he chews.

I'm just amazed at how, well, human he looked back then. I forgot that there was a time he was actually a good-looking man. Now, he seems more like something that would appear on "Doctor Who".

 

[Rosebud]

Thanks doctorwho for your post. I'm really glad someone actually answered the original question.

I think the conversation here has, as I imagined it would, turned towards whether you have the 'right' to criticize, etc, on which I think we pretty much all agree. This is a public forum, and you have the right to express your opinions. That said, I think the more interesting question is the one gluey asked at the end of her post:

"what do you actually like about U2?"

That's been my curiosity; I just don't understand why some people are active members of a current U2 fan site if you think the band sucks (either sucks nowadays, or sucks as people - i.e. Bono's a bastard, etc.). Why are you here?

I don't mean to say "take a hike" or anything like that, I'm just genuinely curious. Also, I know that it's very possible to be an avid U2 fan but not like their recent stuff (though I'd really disagree), because their music has varied so so so much over the years. But what I don't get is then, why do you still come to the forums? Does it not feel like kind of a waste of time?

 

[GirlsAloudFan]

Where is the hope?

And where is the faith?

And the love?

What's that you say to me?

Does love light up YOUR christmas tree?

 

[BoMac]

That's been my curiosity; I just don't understand why some people are active members of a current U2 fan site if you think the band sucks (either sucks nowadays, or sucks as people - i.e. Bono's a bastard, etc.). Why are you here?

I don't mean to say "take a hike" or anything like that, I'm just genuinely curious. Also, I know that it's very possible to be an avid U2 fan but not like their recent stuff (though I'd really disagree), because their music has varied so so so much over the years. But what I don't get is then, why do you still come to the forums? Does it not feel like kind of a waste of time?

In between albums I rarely visit anything outside of Lemonade Stand, except for the occasional foray into It's Official and Zoo Confessionals. The only time I come into EYKIW is when an album or single is being released, or during a tour. Or, just to have a good laugh. ( I mean, my fridge sounds like U2? Seriously?)

That being said, I enjoy coming here, to converse with others on sports or music, or just nothing at all. To me, a forum that's a massive love-in would seem like a waste of time.

 

[Salome]

I would agree that if you can't talk about U2 without complaining that a U2 forum is not the place for you

what annoys me most about the people who seem to do nothing but complain is how they make up complete crap to suit their own views
I don't mind if someone would say they don't like the direction U2 has taken, but this just isn't enough for these 100% complainers
since they don't like it it's obvious that the band must be catering to teeny bopper Britney Spears lovers and have sold their soul to the corporate devil
of course it isn't possible (not even remotely) that the band does really want to make the music they're currently making!!! nooooooooo, not when these Music Lovers don't like it!!!!

another annoying habit they've developed is the following:
- professional whines hates album X, you think album X very good= you would even applaud U2 releasing an album of farts, you obviously do not like Real Music and are an idiot
- professional whines loves album X, you think album X isn't exactly the best thing the band has ever done = you obviously don't get it, do not like Real Music and are an idiot

so to (sort of) answer the original question
I don't hate anything about U2
there are a large number of artists I don't hate anything about
this doesn't mean I love everything these people do either

 

[digitize]

I dislike that Staring at the Sun is played acoustically, and that U2 doesn't like Pop as much as I do.

 

[zuropa_fit]

I love pretty much everything about U2. I don't LOVE the last two albums, but we can't expect perfection every time.

Not only do I expect perfection, but I demand it. When U2 as a whole or a member thereof does something imperfect I cry inside. Then I usually break something.









Seriously though Gluey. Again for speaking your mind and starting what is a very interesting discussion. I liked the sports metaphor on the first page. I never understood why fans of a sports team picked them apart or "loved to hate them" but when I relate it to what happens on here when there's an actual discussion not just "it sucks" it all makes sense.

 

[JCOSTER]

People are entitled to their opinions but its more like a firing squad sometimes.

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

Does love light up YOUR christmas tree?

nah, i use regular old-fashioned christmas lights

 

[beegee]

Some people like to see U2 go back to their past glory or - even better - be stuck in their past forever. Some people - like me - love to see the band evolving and go with them, that also means being open and excited about whatever they are going to do for their next project instead of bitching about how band things are and how bad they will be in the future.

The problem with this is that U2 are no longer evolving.

 

[U2Fanatic4ever]

The problem with this is that U2 are no longer evolving.

and how pray tell can you explain this one..


just curious..

 

[gherman]

nah, i use regular old-fashioned christmas lights

Nice, but loves not a fire hazard... or is it?

 

[LemonMelon]

u2 need to get weird again

Good songs are optional.

 

[Rosebud]

The problem with this is that U2 are no longer evolving.

I think it's more that they've evolved to a place you may not like. The last two albums were explicitly about getting back in touch with their roots (which was SO necessary and perfect timing, imo), but it's still not exactly like anything they've ever done before. It may not be exciting like you may like it, but that's just a matter of style preference and personal taste. I for one LOVE the paired down, simple beauty and emotion style which they were into recently. Of course, this is only very recent in relative terms. It's actually kind of amazing if you think about it, how much variety they've shown us over the span of their career. Nearly every album sounds so different from any other (exceptions being last 2 albums and AB & Zooropa).

I would point out that none of us have any idea what direction they are going in now...

 

[ozeeko]

what i miss about u2 is their creative stubbornness. their gall to put their foot down and say "hey, were evolving, either you're with us or you're not" like they did with AB - POP. When Larry and Adam were hesitant to try new things, did Bono and The Edge cave? No, they argued and argued and fought until they won and their vision was realized. It seems that these days Bono and Edge are listening too much to the preconceived theories of what U2 "ought to sound like". That's why I had a problem with the last album, it sounded too much like trying to turn back the clock. ATYCLB was similar in that respect, but (in my opinion) the songs were, for the most part, solid...and i understood it as a strategic move on their parts...to release a somewhat obvious sounding U2 album with the intention of reentering the spotlight they missed for many years. Only problem is, they got hooked on it.. being too ordinarily U2ish. I want that AB stubborn pride back. And I'm not saying release an album that sounds like it. It could be a complete 180 as far as i'm concerned musically, but I want them to just say fuck it were evolving and this is what we have...enjoy it, hate it, fuck off, we don't care.

Unless they've already reached that point in their career where JUST playing together is good enough and creativity is secondary. I fear that might be the case.

 

[gvox]

in my opinion they now suck."?

ETA: Oh, and because an opinion is not widely held does not make it any less right or wrong. It's an opinion, every which way you look at it.

Bmac, not going to go around and around on semantics. The two statements, "imo U2 suck" and "U2 in fact do suck" are two dramatically different statements. Surely you can see that.

The second statement is presented as fact and it simply isn't. I didn't say that a minority opinion wasn't valid as such, an opinion, I was just saying that it's neither fact nor even a very popular opinion. Sometimes the minority can be right, to be sure.

 

[Trinity3000]

Ya know what I'm sick of having my sanity questioned because I love ATYCLB. I know that album has been very meaningful for a lot of people, but it gets slammed regularly on here.

I did find it strange when I came here to see so much negativity. There are enough people in the world who hate U2 and Bono in particular, I thought I'd get away from that on here.

 

[gvox]

doctorwho that was a fucking brilliant post.

 

[gvox]

- professional whines hates album X, you think album X very good= you would even applaud U2 releasing an album of farts, you obviously do not like Real Music and are an idiot
- professional whines loves album X, you think album X isn't exactly the best thing the band has ever done = you obviously don't get it, do not like Real Music and are an idiot

It's that musical / intellectual snobbery that is the undercurrent to alot of these 'opinions' that gets people all defensive, imo. It's almost as if we're made to feel dumb for liking, say, ATYCLB, or that we just aren't as seasoned or expert in the field of Real Music....I thought I was the only one who felt this undercurrent, I guess not!

 

[VintagePunk]

It's that musical / intellectual snobbery that is the undercurrent to alot of these 'opinions' that gets people all defensive, imo. It's almost as if we're made to feel dumb for liking, say, ATYCLB, or that we just aren't as seasoned or expert in the field of Real Music....I thought I was the only one who felt this undercurrent, I guess not!

No, you're certainly not alone. It's not only the opinion stated as fact thing, but it's also what you just mentioned that is implied in many of those types of posts.

I think that's why a lot of regulars don't bother posting in this subforum, the implication that if you like all music that U2 do, or almost all of it, you're a mindless sheep. It couldn't be that - gasp - all of it might actually be likable to some people? That's craziness, I tell you!

That, and, if you hang around here long enough, the same circular arguments just repeat themselves over and over ad nauseum. It does get better when there's new material though, and new things to discuss.

 

[Moser]

u2 need to get weird again

Yes.

 

[Caroni]

Gluey!! you are so brave

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

Nice, but loves not a fire hazard... or is it?

it can be if it makes you go

 

[Gluey]

Gluey!! you are so brave

Must say though, that some of the feedback here has been really really eye opening, and I really respect and appreciate you all taking the time to reply. I'm learning a lot about the different personalities and viewpoints.