One more > for Family Values???

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Thank you Mrs. Springsteen for helping me find this thread.....

I was in the Minneapolis Airport yesterday for a meeting (not in the Mens room though).

For me, the issue has moved beyond the "right and wrong" in this case, and how ANYONE can state that a judge SHOULD NOT have accepted his guilty plea. I am so puzzled by the fact that someone is saying "you are wrong for accepting my guilty plea."
 
zoney! said:
For me, the issue has moved beyond the "right and wrong" in this case, and how ANYONE can state that a judge SHOULD NOT have accepted his guilty plea. I am so puzzled by the fact that someone is saying "you are wrong for accepting my guilty plea."

I'm not justifying what he did, but judges do refuse to accept guilty pleas and it isn't exactly super rare either.
 
anitram said:


I'm not justifying what he did, but judges do refuse to accept guilty pleas and it isn't exactly super rare either.

usually from mentally challenged folks only, not dishonest politicians or law makers.

dbs
 
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MINNEAPOLIS (AP) - A Minnesota judge on Thursday rejected Idaho Sen. Larry Craig's bid to withdraw his guilty plea in an airport sex sting, a major setback in Craig's effort to clear his name and hang on to his Senate seat.

"Because the defendant's plea was accurate, voluntary and intelligent, and because the conviction is supported by the evidence ... the defendant's motion to withdraw his guilty plea is denied," Hennepin County Judge Charles Porter wrote.

Craig, a Republican, can appeal Porter's ruling. But it wasn't immediately clear if he would. Telephone calls and e-mails seeking comment from Craig spokesmen Sid Smith in Boise and Dan Whiting in Washington, D.C. weren't immediately returned.

When the charges first surfaced, Craig said he would resign by Sept. 30. But then he decided to attempt to re-open his legal case, and said he would stay at least until he found out whether he could withdraw his plea to a misdemeanor charge of disorderly conduct.

If Craig resigns, Idaho Gov. C.L. "Butch" Otter, a Republican, would appoint his successor.

Craig has maintained his innocence and said his actions in the Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport bathroom June 11 were misconstrued by the police officer who arrested him.

The officer said Craig had looked into his bathroom stall, and tapped his foot and moved his hand under the divider in a way that suggested he was looking for a sexual partner.

Craig denied that in an interview with the officer after his arrest. But he pleaded guilty on Aug. 8. He later said he "panicked" in entering his plea, believing that it would keep the matter quiet. The Idaho Statesman had been holding back an article on rumors about his sexuality, and Craig said in court papers that he feared the arrest would trigger the story.

Porter rejected that as a good reason to withdraw the plea. Any pressure Craig was under "was entirely perceived by the defendant and was not a result of any action by the police, the prosecutor, or the court," he said.

Minnesota law allows a plea to be withdrawn if a "manifest injustice" occurs, but leaves it to judges to define that. Porter ruled that none occurred in Craig's case.

"It is not a manifest injustice to force the defendant to be bound by his plea bargain and the waivers and admissions which he made in conjunction with the execution of that bargain," Porter wrote.

He also wrote that Craig hadn't produced any "newly discovered evidence" that would clear him.

Roll Call reported Craig's arrest and guilty plea on Aug. 27. Fellow Republican senators soon called on Craig to resign, and conservative groups, which had given him near-perfect approval ratings, abandoned him quickly. Craig had been elected to Congress from Idaho in 1980 and was in his third term in the Senate.

Within days Craig said he would resign by Sept. 30. He then changed his mind, saying he would stay in office until the legal case was finished.

Prosecutor Christopher Renz had accused Craig of "politicking and game playing" with the legal system, and argued that Craig was urged to hire an attorney and had plenty of time to think about his plea.

Patrick Hogan, a spokesman for the Metropolitan Airports Commission, said in a statement that the commission, which runs Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport, was pleased with the decision.

"The ruling continues to hold Senator Craig accountable for his conduct," Hogan said.
 
:up: :up: :up: :up:


Craig Vows to Serve Out Senate Term

Oct 4 04:16 PM US/Eastern
By CHARLES BABINGTON
Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) - Idaho Sen. Larry Craig defiantly vowed to serve out his term in office on Thursday despite losing a court attempt to rescind his guilty plea in a men's room sex sting.

"I have seen that it is possible for me to work here effectively," Craig said in a written statement certain to disappoint fellow Republicans who have long urged him to step down.

Craig had earlier announced he would resign his seat by Sept. 30, but had wavered when he went to court in hopes of withdrawing his plea.


In his statement, Craig said he will not run for a new term next year.

But in the meantime, he said: "I will continue my effort to clewar my name in the Senate Ethics Committee—something that is not possible if I am not serving in the Senate
 
I may be a minority here


but I think this guy is only guilty of embarrassing the GOP

they all know who their closet members are

they just don't want it out in the open
their faith-based sheep
are supposed to love the sinner, what gives :shrug:
 
Lauer To Interview Sen. Larry Craig

NBC confirms Matt Lauer will interview embattled Sen. Larry Craig next Tuesday. The interview will air in a Matt Lauer Reports primetime special. Excerpts will also run on the Today show Wednesday morning. Lauer will also interview the Senator's wife, Suzanne Craig, who will be speaking publicly for the first time about the incident and the events that followed. The special may also reair on MSNBC later in the week. ICN was first to report this story yesterday.
 
examiner.com

Yeas & Nays has obtained excerpts of Matt Lauer's interview of Sen. Larry Craig, and his wife, Suzanne, which will be broadcast on NBC Tuesday at 8 p.m.

When asked if Craig regrets his decision not to tell anyone about the July 11 incident in a men's bathroom at the Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport, Craig tells Lauer:

"It was a tough call, Matt, a very tough call....I was very, very embarrassed about it. I wrestled with it. I didn't want to embarrass my wife, my kids, Idaho and my friends. And I wrestled with it a long while. I sought no counsel. I made a very big mistake. I should have told my wife. I should have told my kids. And most importantly, I should have told counsel."

Craig's wife, Suzanne, also describes her reaction upon hearing the news. "When Larry told me that the story was going to break and he hadn't told me about it before that, I felt like the floor was falling out from under me. It happened right here in this room. And I felt like almost like I was going down a drain for a few moments."

Craig also takes to task Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney during the interview. Craig was one of two Senate liaisons for Romney's campaign before Craig removed himself from that position when news of his arrest broke. Romney later said of Craig, "He's disappointed the American people."

Craig tells Lauer: "I was very proud of my association with Mitt Romney. I'd worked hard for him here in the state. I was a co-chair of his campaign on Capitol Hill. And he not only threw me under his campaign bus, he backed up and ran over me again."

The Associated Press

BOISE, Idaho

Sen. Larry Craig says he will file an appeal Monday over a judge's refusal to allow him to withdraw his guilty plea stemming from his arrest in an airport bathroom sex sting.

In an interview Sunday with KTVB-TV, Craig repeated he will not resign his post in the Senate and said he will continue to work his legal options.

"It is my right to do what I'm doing," said Craig, an Idaho Republican. "I've already provided for Idaho certainty that Idaho needed I'm not running for re-election. I'm no longer in the way. I am pursuing my constitutional rights."
 
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okay, so i'm watching Matt Laurer interview with disgraced Senator, and i have two observations:

1. what a pathetic man. witness, all, what homophobia does to entire lives. he's from a different generation. i almost have pity for him.

2. Matt is pissing me off. gosh, Matt, you're so straight! look at how straight you are, Matt! you say, "the man said you cruised him ... whatever that means." wow! you aren't familiar with the term cruising. that must mean you LOVE pussy, Matt! good for you! you consistently say "lifestyle" -- way to avoid that liberal bias! you just call it like you see it, Matt, and you see things straight! remember to qualify any facts or observations with the phrase "members of the gay community would say ..." so that no one gets the wrong idea about you Matt, you and your fey suits and washboard abs.



it really never stops.
 
Irvine511 said:
okay, so i'm watching Matt Laurer interview with disgraced Senator, and i have two observations:

1. what a pathetic man. witness, all, what homophobia does to entire lives. he's from a different generation. i almost have pity for him.

2. Matt is pissing me off. gosh, Matt, you're so straight! look at how straight you are, Matt! you say, "the man said you cruised him ... whatever that means." wow! you aren't familiar with the term cruising. that must mean you LOVE pussy, Matt! good for you! you consistently say "lifestyle" -- way to avoid that liberal bias! you just call it like you see it, Matt, and you see things straight! remember to qualify any facts or observations with the phrase "members of the gay community would say ..." so that no one gets the wrong idea about you Matt, you and your fey suits and washboard abs.



it really never stops.

So now Matt's a bad guy?:sexywink:
 
diamond said:


So now Matt's a bad guy?:sexywink:



i'm just irritated that people can't report on something gay-related and not have to loudly announce that they're straight because, GOD FORBID!, somone might get the wrong idea.

it just furthers notions of gay shame. sure, Matt has no problems with gay people or whatever, but he'd never actually want you to think he was gay, let alone actually be gay.

i mean, ew!
 
I didn't see it, and I doubt I could bear to watch it all the way through even if I had a TV, but there is a complete transcript over at msnbc.com for anyone who's curious and missed it.

Based on the transcript, I doubt this will have changed many people's minds one way or the other.
 
yolland said:
I didn't see it, and I doubt I could bear to watch it all the way through even if I had a TV, but there is a complete transcript over at msnbc.com for anyone who's curious and missed it.

Based on the transcript, I doubt this will have changed many people's minds one way or the other.

After watching Senator Wide Stance's body language, he looked like he was hiding something and his wife was in denial-very sad.

Also the more I watch and learn about the Senator the more he comes across as a narcissist-everything is about him.

dbs
 
diamond said:
After watching Senator Wide Stance's body language, he looked like he was hiding something and his wife was in denial-very sad.

Ever wonder why?
 
I thought the whole thing was sad and uncomfortable-what was the point? Nothing new was learned.

Maybe Matt Lauer is one of those straight guys that gets all uncomfortable talking about gay issues. I don't think he's a great interviewer anyway. Did anyone see Meredith Vieira on the Today Show yesterday morning interviewing Jake Gyllenhaal-she brought up Brokeback Mountain and said something to the effect of "did you know what you were sitting on" being in that movie, then said "I probably shouldn't use that term, I apologize". I thought it was weird and inappropriate :slant: Just like practically every other interview with the stars of that movie that turned into some sort of "jokes" like that. Maybe it's telling.
 
NBC's Matt Lauer, Making the Least Of an Opportunity

By Tom Shales Washington Post
Wednesday, October 17, 2007; C01

One thing, at least, was made painfully clear by Matt Lauer's interview with Sen. Larry Craig on NBC last night: Matt Lauer is no Mike Wallace. Lauer was anything but hard-hitting or confrontational with the Idaho Republican, arrested in June for alleged homosexual solicitation in a Minneapolis airport men's room.

For Lauer, self-important co-host of NBC's "Today" show, the interview was obviously seen as a potential career- and credibility-builder, but even when he did ask an arguably tough question, he essentially apologized for it. He prefaced a question about whether the senator might be bisexual by saying to Craig, "You're going to have to forgive me for this."

What? This is a journalist practicing journalism? Lauer's like a virgin veteran, an old hand who seems inexperienced. Diane Sawyer, to name one example, would have done a much better interview. Anyone on "60 Minutes," Wallace or another member of the vaunted team, would have done a better one. Lauer's former "Today" co-host, the much-maligned Katie Couric, also would likely have done a more effective job.

Craig -- seated on a couch in what looked like the family den next to his wife, Suzanne -- pleaded guilty to nothing during the interview except having pleaded guilty (to "disrupting the peace") in the first place. "It was a very, very big mistake," he said of his hasty decision to enter the plea to a lesser charge of disorderly conduct. He should have called his lawyer immediately, he said: "I sought no counsel. I made a very big mistake."

Lauer wore his concerned, caring face throughout the interview, but he appeared to be an actor in a role, with every facial expression, gesture and use of props (a pair of glasses, a pen) calculated for effect. Craig was less than convincing in his denials, even if the airport incident did sound, as it has from the beginning, like a case of entrapment.

When in an airport bathroom, apparently, or when in any public convenience, the rule is that a man can bump feet with the person in the next stall but must never tap his foot at any time, lest he send out a signal that he wants to have sex then and there. Craig said he may have bumped the foot of the cop in the next stall when Craig sat down, but he denied ever tapping his foot. Bumping yes, tapping no; perhaps airport men's rooms should have signs posted that warn of these peculiar rules.

And never, ever reach under the wall to the next stall, which Craig said he did when trying to remove a piece of stray tissue from the bottom of his shoe. The arresting airport cop insisted that Craig reached under the divider with his left hand and his palm upward, yet another alleged gesture that constitutes a gay-sex overture.

It might be funny -- and late-night comics had a field day, as clips showed -- if it weren't, on various levels, so terribly sad.

But Lauer shied away from one of the more troubling aspects of the case. Craig, it was reported, had long been the subject of speculation as to his sexual proclivities, while in his role as a senator, he consistently opposed gay rights, including the granting of marital status to gay partners who live together. Lauer never brought up the issue of hypocrisy: the unseemly possibility that Craig essentially condemned homosexuality while partaking of gay sex himself.

Craig himself brought up his voting record and said of homosexuality, "I don't approve of the lifestyle." Lauer should have followed up; why did he call it a "lifestyle" and what about it does he disapprove of? At one point, reading from Craig's history, Lauer said the records included "a guy who claims you 'cruised' him -- whatever that is." This, it seemed, was Lauer's way of winking into the camera and saying, "I'm not gay."

You hardly have to be gay in 21st-century America to know what the phrase "cruising" means. It was even the title of a movie starring Al Pacino. Lauer needs to worry less about his own image and more about getting valuable information when conducting an interview. It seemed highly likely that Craig and his wife agreed to sit down with Lauer because they knew they had nothing, really, to fear.

Craig said he has been the victim of "gladiator politics," thrown into the arena like a Christian tossed to waiting lions, and he expressed disappointment in Republican colleagues, especially presidential candidate Mitt Romney, for abandoning and criticizing him when the story first broke. There was a touch of the crybaby to Craig's protestations, as there was to Lauer's remarks on Tuesday's "Today" show about the interview having been a difficult one for him to do.

Ah yes, this was another chapter in the Matt Lauer Story more than it was an interview at all. But those who loved it and didn't get enough in an hour-long prime-time special were advised they could see still more of the interview on NBC's Web site and on this morning's "Today" show. The interview was plugged for two nights in a row by Brian Williams on his otherwise exemplary "NBC Nightly News."

The interview should have produced some water-cooler talk, some revelation that everyone would be discussing today. But the best excuse for water-cooler talk in the interview was what a mediocre job Lauer had done conducting it.
 
I find it odd how posters have now shifted the issue from a law maker who is a law breaker in denial on various levels -to dumping on a straight reporter who was sensitive to the situation he was in.

Did you want Matt to become Larry's therapist on the spot?

Some cease to amaze me here.

Emapthy for the liar, spit on the messenger who exposed Larry for what he was -a self elevatedd liar with a co-dependent wife.

Matt did a great job with the situation he was presented with.

dbs
 
diamond said:
I find it odd how posters have now shifted the issue from a law maker who is a law breaker in denial on various levels -to dumping on a straight reporter who was sensitive to the situation he was in.

Did you want Matt to become Larry's therapist on the spot?

Some cease to amaze me here.

Emapthy for the liar, spit on the messenger who exposed Larry for what he was -a self elevatedd liar with a co-dependent wife.

Matt did a great job with the situation he was presented with.

dbs



maybe if you had a measure of compassion for people who have to deal with the fallout from the hateful attitudes you express towards homosexuals, you'd understand.

my goodness, how awful to take a look at someone's trainwreck of a life, and actually understand that it's a nuanced, complex thing, and that no one is ever all good or all bad. you've got to great, great lengths to excuse David Vitter, but is that only because he puts his penis in a vagina?

also, Craig probably didn't violate a single law, and if this ever went to court, it'd be thrown out. he was stupid, stupid, stupid for pleading guilty, and the officer is probably guilty of entrapment. but at the very least it exposed the hypocrisy that's the beating heart of the GOP as well as given us a window into the extraordinarily complex and painful lives of men who've been pushed into the closet and act out in extremely unhealthy ways due to the homophobia in society perpetuated by individuals such as yourself and social clubs like the Mormon church.
 
Irvine511 said:




maybe if you had a measure of compassion for people who have to deal with the fallout from the hateful attitudes you express towards homosexuals, you'd understand.


I think it's safe to assume that if Diamond hasn't experienced it, he doesn't understand it, and doesn't really care to.

Conservatives in general seem to view compassion and empathy as weaknesses, I know there was a lot of fear when W used that word as part of his campaign. Rest assure they didn't have to worry too much it was just a word he threw around he never acted on it.
 
Well it's oh so easy to dump on Larry Craig then it is to face the context of his situation and face that there are nuances and complexities in everyone's life (unless you're perfect and above reproach, or living some sort of revisionist history life of moral superiority). Does that context make him blameless? No. But most people can see and acknowledge that context.

I find it ironic that someone who comments on Hillary Clinton's cellulite criticizes anyone for commenting on how Matt Lauer or anyone else conducts such an interview. Which is more irrelevant and/or nonsensical?
 

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