For dog lovers Pt. 2

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Liesje said:
Are you looking for Goldens? I'll ask my friend, she has two Goldens. I can tell you what my criteria for ANY breeder would be, regardless of breed.....


I'll ask my breeder about puppy training books. She specializes in puppies. I've avoided them so far!
Click to expand...



yeah we are looking at goldens. I had a irish setter/golden retriever mix when I was younger and what a great personality she was. Great loving dog..

Labs are also wonderful and super smart.. So that's an option too. Since we have a kid, and there are lots of kids around the neighborhood I think either a lab or golden would do perfectly. I just love them anyways.. Everything about them really.

Yes, please fill me in on what the criteria for a breeder is.. I haven't much of a clue.. I suppose certification and such is a start. Good reputation, testimonials?
 
I actually do think that having or not having a fence is a bit of a bigger issue than Lies does, only because you do have a child. My family has always owned dogs and I remember when I was 10 or my brother was 10, it wasn't once that the dog got away because he saw a squirrel or whatever. The fact is also that you'd be getting a family pet, not a super-trained obedient dog like Lies has. All of our Collies were extremely well trained and responsive but they were very different personalities than Kenya, and I'd venture a guess that 99% of pet dogs are as well.

When the dog is a puppy, and you have no fence, you really have to be careful about keeping him on a leash. And even later, as an older dog, if you have kids watching him outdoors or playing with him, you'd have to ask yourself whether you trust the dog to follow the children's commands as well. Goldens have great temperament so it's not like they'd go and attack passersby or kids on bikes, but you never know how distracted they may get.

I don't think you should let the lack of fence preclude you from getting a dog, but I'd also be more careful than I would have been growing up (when we always had fenced yards).
 
I would not consider any breeder of any breed unless they met ALL of the following requirements:

- ALL breeding dogs are OFAed (hips and elbows definitely, cardiac a plus). OFAs are different than a "health certification" (a red flag term!). X-rays are submitted to the OFFA and are examined by three professionals who rate the dog. Fair, good, and excellent are suitable for breeding. Anything less, or no OFA is baaaad
- ALL breeding dogs titled in conformation (AKC or UKC) and preferably in some sport or working event, relative to the breed. For GSDs I would be expecting Schutzhund or herding, but for a Golden as a pet, I think obedience and/or agility would suffice. They are a sporting dog and thus should have SOME sporting title.
- Pups never released before 8 weeks of age (illegal in some states)
- Breeder holds first right of refusal and actually makes good on it (if I find out a "good" breeder knew of one of their dogs being surrendered to a shelter or rescue and did not take it back, I blacklist them)
- some form of contract that requires spay/neuter for pet dogs and also outlines the health guarantee and return policy
- the breeder must be able to explain to me in detail why the dam was bred to the stud. I want there to be specific goals for each and every litter produced, not just b/c "they're both champions" or "they have good temperaments". Sorry, there's millions of dogs in shelters that have good temperaments and a good chunk of them are champions too!
- the breeder actively trains, shows, and titles their OWN dogs, doesn't just purchase titled dogs. If they are not active in their breed's community, then how can they say they love the breed?
- signed their breed parent club's Code of Ethics and are on the breeder referral list of the parent club (if applicable)
- extensively interviews prospective buyers and places pups appropriately. Does not allow inexperienced people or pet homes "pick" their own puppy (meeting them and having favorites is totally find, but the breeder should make the decision b/c after all, how can stranger know enough about the pups and the parents to make an informed decision?)
- the breeder must be transparent, ie must confidently answer specific questions, allow people to visit their facility and meet their dogs, provide all paperwork, etc

BIG red flags
- dogs advertised as being registered by anything other than the AKC, CanKC, and UKC (avoid APRI, CKC (continental), WWKC)
- people using "AKC registered!!!" as their selling point. Um, if the dog is purebred and in the USA then being AKC registered should be a given and does not increase the value of any dog. The AKC is only a registry and does not guarantee quality
- people using "pedigreed" as a selling point. All dogs are pedigreed, even mutts! Like AKC registry, your dog's pedigree should also be a given
- pups being sold before 8 weeks
- dogs being bred before they are 2 years of age, min.
- the lack of anything from my previous list
 
anitram said:
I actually do think that having or not having a fence is a bit of a bigger issue than Lies does, only because you do have a child. My family has always owned dogs and I remember when I was 10 or my brother was 10, it wasn't once that the dog got away because he saw a squirrel or whatever. The fact is also that you'd be getting a family pet, not a super-trained obedient dog like Lies has. All of our Collies were extremely well trained and responsive but they were very different personalities than Kenya, and I'd venture a guess that 99% of pet dogs are as well.

When the dog is a puppy, and you have no fence, you really have to be careful about keeping him on a leash. And even later, as an older dog, if you have kids watching him outdoors or playing with him, you'd have to ask yourself whether you trust the dog to follow the children's commands as well. Goldens have great temperament so it's not like they'd go and attack passersby or kids on bikes, but you never know how distracted they may get.

I don't think you should let the lack of fence preclude you from getting a dog, but I'd also be more careful than I would have been growing up (when we always had fenced yards).
Click to expand...

As far as fences go, my initial reaction to the idea a while back was no dog unless we have a fence. But my feelings have changed after some thought and seeing a neighbor who has a golden and they do not have a fenced backyard. They do a lot of walks and supervise out in the front with the kids around when the kids are playing.

I would always make sure that either me or my hubby were outside whenever the dog was out there just because its better that way, as you have said, you never know even with goldens what could happen.

I think as long as we are extra careful and obviously use the leash whenever we go outside whether its a pup or an adult dog we should be ok.
 
Liesje said:
I would not consider any breeder of any breed unless they met ALL of the following requirements:

- ALL breeding dogs are OFAed (hips and elbows definitely, cardiac a plus). OFAs are different than a "health certification" (a red flag term!). X-rays are submitted to the OFFA and are examined by three professionals who rate the dog. Fair, good, and excellent are suitable for breeding. Anything less, or no OFA is baaaad
- ALL breeding dogs titled in conformation (AKC or UKC) and preferably in some sport or working event, relative to the breed. For GSDs I would be expecting Schutzhund or herding, but for a Golden as a pet, I think obedience and/or agility would suffice. They are a sporting dog and thus should have SOME sporting title.
- Pups never released before 8 weeks of age (illegal in some states)
- Breeder holds first right of refusal and actually makes good on it (if I find out a "good" breeder knew of one of their dogs being surrendered to a shelter or rescue and did not take it back, I blacklist them)
- some form of contract that requires spay/neuter for pet dogs and also outlines the health guarantee and return policy
- the breeder must be able to explain to me in detail why the dam was bred to the stud. I want there to be specific goals for each and every litter produced, not just b/c "they're both champions" or "they have good temperaments". Sorry, there's millions of dogs in shelters that have good temperaments and a good chunk of them are champions too!
- the breeder actively trains, shows, and titles their OWN dogs, doesn't just purchase titled dogs. If they are not active in their breed's community, then how can they say they love the breed?
- signed their breed parent club's Code of Ethics and are on the breeder referral list of the parent club (if applicable)
- extensively interviews prospective buyers and places pups appropriately. Does not allow inexperienced people or pet homes "pick" their own puppy (meeting them and having favorites is totally find, but the breeder should make the decision b/c after all, how can stranger know enough about the pups and the parents to make an informed decision?)
- the breeder must be transparent, ie must confidently answer specific questions, allow people to visit their facility and meet their dogs, provide all paperwork, etc

BIG red flags
- dogs advertised as being registered by anything other than the AKC, CanKC, and UKC (avoid APRI, CKC (continental), WWKC)
- people using "AKC registered!!!" as their selling point. Um, if the dog is purebred and in the USA then being AKC registered should be a given and does not increase the value of any dog. The AKC is only a registry and does not guarantee quality
- people using "pedigreed" as a selling point. All dogs are pedigreed, even mutts! Like AKC registry, your dog's pedigree should also be a given
- pups being sold before 8 weeks
- dogs being bred before they are 2 years of age, min.
- the lack of anything from my previous list
Click to expand...



thanks and wow! Lot's of informative material there.. I will certainly take into consideration for sure.
 
It sounds like you've thought it through and that's good. I'm of the mind that dogs shouldn't really be left outside unsupervised for longer than a few minutes even when there IS a fence. On a dog board, someone just posted about how she left two of her dogs in her yard for a few minutes and in that time, a loose dog climbed OVER the 6+ ft privacy fence and attacked her dogs. They fought back. One required two hours of surgery, and the loose dog had to be PTS b/c of his injuries.

Coke is part retriever and acts more like a Golden than anything else. Distraction is a huge issue for us, and even with all the training I do with Kenya I do not think I will ever trust him off leash in an un-fenced area. He has a 30' tie out line, so a circle 60' in diameter. He bent his original tie-out stake in half, but now I have one I'm confident will hold him (had to use a tire iron to get it in the ground, ran over it w/ a car and nothing happened). I also trained him the boundary of his tie-out so he isn't constantly charging at things and hitting the end really hard, injuring his neck. I personally don't even like tie-outs, but with some practice it works really well. Even so, he is never outside unsupervised. The nice thing about getting a puppy is you can start on recalls from day one. Coke was tied out and left alone all day everyday for over a year, so training recall and attention will take a loooong time. Since he is a rescued adult, we have to convince him that people are fun and nice to him after all. With a puppy, you are everything to them and you just need to hold onto that as they mature and push boundaries, possible go through a fear stage.
 
Again, thanks so much Lies! I was hoping that you would be the one to respond to my post because I know of your considerable amount of experience with dogs.. I truly trust your opinion. It's very much appreciated! :wink:

I have registered at that dog forum you posted and when I get approved I will venture over there and do some major dog reading.. :D
 
Woohoo, hope to see you there! I learned everything about dogs worth knowing from them, seriously. There might be some people there more familiar with Goldens.


Now for a post of my own.....

Kenya and I have been showing all weekend. It's been very stressful since the show is 1.5 hours away each way, each day, it's a big show, and there was a lot of pressure. Friday and Saturday we won our class and today we placed second. Since we qualified all three times under different judges, we also have a new title, Rally Advanced (so now the RN behind Kenya's name is replaced with RA). No more dog shows for a long time!

Friday after the show I had practice with our new club, the Working Dog Club of Michigan. Our trainer (police dog trainer) brought his dog so we can start learning bite work. Kenya's breeder has a big, insanely driven dog imported from Germany, but our trainer didn't want her biting me b/c he said he didn't have a good feel on how she bites and he promised me that HIS dog bites low on the sleeve. So my first time in the sleeve and where does his dog bite? Um....the elbow, where there is NO padding! I have lovely purple bites on my left arm. Also, I was an idiot and wore cotton track pants instead of work jeans so when she pawed all over my thigh, I got clobbered. My left thigh is now a leopard print of purple/black bruises and red gashes on flesh color. All that from a small dog that does not hit very hard! (see the vid on the previous page)
 
yolland said:
Oh, she's adorable! Looks like some kind of bully breed? There are a few of those that look like that in the early puppyhood stage and I have trouble telling them apart...
Click to expand...

Liesje said:
Aw, yeah what kind? Puppies are impossible to guess? How cute and young. Pics are from the breeder I assume?

[/url]
Click to expand...

kafrun said:
I'm assuming Staffordshire Bull Terrier since that's what Wild has already :D So precious :cute: Bully breeds :heart:
Click to expand...


Yes KAf was right

She's a Staffie :love: She'll be the 9th one in our family :love:

She's a step sister to my other girl. Yeah luckily enough my sister is a registered KC bredder so i get loads of photos and can go see her when i want :hyper:
 
<center>
<img src="http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c87/greeneyes555/233.jpg" alt="Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting"><br><br>
</center>


Here are my girls at the front door waiting for Daddy.
They will be 1yr this Friday.
 
233.jpg
 
U2F, where do you live?

I know of a Golden kennel called Malagold. I personally know some of their dogs so I can vouch for them firsthand. The two that I know the best are really great dogs. They are VERY laid back, get along with all other dogs, very gentle and affectionate, responsive to the owners and trainable. Not as energetic, smart, and drivey as a German Shepherd, but probably better "family" dogs because they are very chill about everything. My friend/training club owner got an 8 month old puppy from them recently so I see him at least once a week. I see their breeding dogs are shown and championed in the AKC ring and they all appear to be OFAed. I don't see sporting titles, but one of their dogs I know finished the Excellent level in rally. Based on what I see, I would not consider them to be good field dogs, but you wouldn't really want that in a family dog anyway. Actually, now I see the next planned breeding features a dog that is championed and has several agility titles, so that's good to see.

Contact Us at Malagold
 
Liesje said:
U2F, where do you live?

I know of a Golden kennel called Malagold. I personally know some of their dogs so I can vouch for them firsthand. The two that I know the best are really great dogs. They are VERY laid back, get along with all other dogs, very gentle and affectionate, responsive to the owners and trainable. Not as energetic, smart, and drivey as a German Shepherd, but probably better "family" dogs because they are very chill about everything. My friend/training club owner got an 8 month old puppy from them recently so I see him at least once a week. I see their breeding dogs are shown and championed in the AKC ring and they all appear to be OFAed. I don't see sporting titles, but one of their dogs I know finished the Excellent level in rally. Based on what I see, I would not consider them to be good field dogs, but you wouldn't really want that in a family dog anyway. Actually, now I see the next planned breeding features a dog that is championed and has several agility titles, so that's good to see.

Contact Us at Malagold
Click to expand...


I live in Elkridge, Maryland. I would like to find a breeder either in maryland, Virginia or Pennsylvania. We could travel by car to these areas. I really don't want to travel any farther than that.


BTW: how long did it take before you got approved for the idog forum? I still haven't received the email yet..
 
When I joined the forum was totally different so there was no approval. I'll ask Kate to approve you or check.
 
U2F, I asked my breeder about puppy materials and she said:
OK I haven't read them in a LOOONNNNNG time but there are two books that pop into my mnd. "Way to Go" by P McConnell, I sell that one and How to housebreak your dog in seven days...both are booklets.
Click to expand...
 
The dogs don't sleep with us at night (they sleep in beds at the foot of our bed), but in the mornings, often get to join us for a cuddlefest. Our Grace Kelly was certainly hamming it up this morning!

2533324107_4415d83bce.jpg


2533324117_57f2699f5c.jpg


2533324127_b826e9716f.jpg


2533324131_369d6d7a87.jpg


Stretch!

2533324145_77f1dcc360.jpg


Such a goofy girl!
 
VintagePunk said:
Lies, I love your new avatar! Congrats to you and Kenya. :)
Click to expand...

Thanks!

Here are some recent pics....

At the start line. Kenya assuming the correct position, but I think I'm trying to read the first obstacle to make sure I don't miss it!
dsc_0359.jpg


Turning back to make dang sure she jumped. We rarely do broad jumps and being a larger dog, she will sometimes just walk on it like it's junk.
dsc_0345.jpg


Entering weaves, Kenya slightly off but that doesn't matter for this sport (emphesis on handling, not precision heeling)
dsc_0354.jpg


Taking second to Charlene and Jolena
dsc_0368.jpg


Too tired to give a crap
2521716395_ce8760b6d5.jpg


Sunbathing at a pool party
2525529263_ce66d7e2dd.jpg


The Cokester - I have since taken a cat Furminator to his ears and pulled out that nasty coat
2534131025_645eabd46d.jpg


2534945212_f0cf925d65.jpg


2534945472_765890afdd.jpg
 
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