A_Wanderer
ONE love, blood, life
Maybe you will just have to start dismantling government programs and organisations.
A_Wanderer said:Maybe you will just have to start dismantling government programs and organisations.
nbcrusader said:How many people are educated by the Department of Education?
Oh, that's a state function.
Irvine511 said:yes, why would we need a national program to ensure equal access to education.
i wonder just how bad the Mississippi public schools would be *without* the department of education -- but, hey, if you're poor, that's your own fault.
nbcrusader said:Those damn states can't govern themselves. We should get rid of them.
I wonder how much better off Mississippi students would be if just a fraction of the DOE budget was actually spent on MS schools.
maycocksean said:Here's an interesting side note. I read somewhere that people in other countries often assume that Americans are all thin and beautiful (presumably because of the influence of movies and TV). One of my high school students who is from China confirmed this. She was quite shocked when I told her that most Americans are overweight. Couuldn't believe it.
blueeyedgirl said:
Actually most people I know who have visited the US have often commented on how many grossly obese people they've seen, and thought they were solely the preserve of shows like Jerry Springer, not real life
The other thing they all comment on is the excessive portion sizes of meals served in the US. No other country seems to serve up so much crap as do the US. Obviously this and my earlier point may have links.
Actually I don't understand this argument that it's cheaper and convenient to buy fast food than it is to buy fresh fruit, meat and vegetables. What is more important to you, your long term health or saving 3 bucks here and there?
blueeyedgirl said:
The other thing they all comment on is the excessive portion sizes of meals served in the US. No other country seems to serve up so much crap as do the US.
blueeyedgirl said:Actually I don't understand this argument that it's cheaper and convenient to buy fast food than it is to buy fresh fruit, meat and vegetables. What is more important to you, your long term health or saving 3 bucks here and there?
nbcrusader said:We are not victims of fast food establishments, we are simply following our tastes.
Irvine511 said:
do you think the ubiquity of fast food establishments is a concerted effort by these companies to eliminate notions of "choice"?
nbcrusader said:
When they start buying grocery stores, you may have the start of an argument.
nbcrusader said:You are arguing against individual choice.
nbcrusader said:I think you are overestimating the influence of McDonalds - there is no reduction of choice. Or are people so stupid they are just victims of all the ad campaigns?
Obviously, marketing is designed to influence choice - not as logical and reasonable choices, but choices that make us "feel" better. The choice still lies with the individual - 100%. And if it is not McDonalds, they will find some other source.
There are certain limitations on advertising - such as veracity of claims and prohibitations on hard alcohol and cigarettes. Does fast food belong in this category?
And it doesn't work in reverse? your arguing that these companies deserve harsher treatment than violent media because of supposed negative side effects.Irvine511 said:
for someone who believes in the power and influence of the media, i find it hard to believe that you're underestimating the influence of advertising, especially since you've written about the influence television has on children's behavior, how they imitate what they see on television, from sex to violence to generalized anti-social behavior. are these children so stupid that they are just victims of video games and movies? or do companies get a pass?
Irvine511 said:for someone who believes in the power and influence of the media, i find it hard to believe that you're underestimating the influence of advertising, especially since you've written about the influence television has on children's behavior, how they imitate what they see on television, from sex to violence to generalized anti-social behavior. are these children so stupid that they are just victims of video games and movies? or do companies get a pass?
Irvine511 said:yes, the individual does, in one sense, always make a choice, but i think you underestimate the extend to which companies go to influence that choice and what "availability/ubiquity" does to limit actual choice -- just look at Starbucks.
A_Wanderer said:And it doesn't work in reverse? your arguing that these companies deserve harsher treatment than violent media because of supposed negative side effects.
nbcrusader said:
Let's distinguish what could be harmful from what the government must control or regulate. I can't expect my child to play violent video games all day and not be affected by the content. I can't expect my child to eat fast foods all day and be healthy. In both cases, the responsibility lies with the parent. Are you now suggesting a violent video game tax as well?
nbcrusader said:I think you are confusing influence of choice by marketing with elimination of choice. You can't get everyone to investigate and act on all their choices.
The meaningful choice is there, and independents can thrive by providing a quality alternative. Not everyone will be a ubiquitous retailer.
Irvine511 said:no. i am saying that advertising seeks to influence choice and the ability of chain stores to blanket a market and increase their availability strives to eliminate choice. it's possible to do two things at the same time. Coca-Cola is a perfect example of this -- why do you think there's a vending machine in every conceivable location?
Irvine511 said:that's interesting -- viewing independents as their own sort of monopoly (it also strikes me a completely convenient viewpoint of big business). i think you overestimate the "uniqueness" and "customer service" and how that influences choice -- most choice is predicated upon price and convenience, and you nicely use the idealized word "should" when reality hardly plays out that way.
Irvine511 said:there are several stories of increased muggings in DC's Chinatown/7th Street Corridor precisely due to the influx of chain restaurants. this is another area that was given a shot of revitilization with an influx of chain stores. one big difference between a chain and an independent is the sense of ownership by an independent -- in very practical terms, an independent will strive to keep beggers and homeless out of their stores and off their propety, even calling the police should a threat be perceived by his customers. employees in chain stores are far less likely to do so, and thus you have an increase in muggings in the Chinatown area because people with money are drawn to this neighborhood
Irvine511 said:this i'd have to disagree with -- Starbucks deliberately targets independents in any particular neighborhod.
nbcrusader said:
On what information are you basing your description of intent (deliberately targeting)?