coemgen
Rock n' Roll Doggie
I did. I think I've never heard of him.
Must not be a big deal.
Must not be a big deal.
coemgen said:I did. I think I've never heard of him.
Must not be a big deal.
Irvine511 said:Mitt's gonna win the nomination, and get crushed in the general election when the conservative protestant evanglicals sit on their couches rather than go out and vote for a Mormon. the delicious irony of the GOP having to eat their own intolerance after wielding blind ignorance to win the 2004 election.
2861U2 said:
Incorrect. My and all my protestant friends and family would vote for Mitt in a heartbeat if he gets the nomination. We have nothing against Mormons.
2861U2 said:
Incorrect. My and all my protestant friends and family would vote for Mitt in a heartbeat if he gets the nomination. We have nothing against Mormons.
Irvine511 said:
you should dig through some of the threads about Mormonism in here. the evangelicals get ker-azy when Mormons try to claim that they are Christians of equal footing and are actually not a cult.
me? i don't give a shit. i don't care about a candidate's religon.
but is the GOP who tried to tell us that these things matter and that GWB's status as a Christian -- and remember his whole laughable crap about Harriet Miers and "knowing her heart" -- was criteria enough for his election.
you and your friends might be tolerant of Mormons, but as a group, conservative evangelical protestants are not.
diamond said:
Chistians in Christ day could have been look on as cultists.
diamond said:To keep things in perspective, Mitt is running for Commander in Chief- not Mormon in Chief, and he has made this abuntantly clear.
diamond said:And as in this post from a Evangaical some our changing their minds, maybe not enough, but it is a start:
“I am now convinced that we evangelicals have often seriously misrepresented the beliefs and practices of the Mormon community. Indeed, let me state it bluntly to the LDS folk here this evening: we have sinned against you. The God of the Scriptures makes it clear that it is a terrible thing to bear false witness against our neighbours, and we have been guilty of that sort of transgression in the things we have said about you. We have told you what you believe without making a sincere effort first of all to ask you what you believe... Indeed, we have even on occasion demonised you, weaving conspiracy theories about what the LDS community is really trying to accomplish in the world, and even at our best, we have, and this is true of both our communities, talked past each other, setting forth over-simplified and distorted accounts of what the other group believes.”
melon said:
Ironically, you can substitute "LDS" and "Mormon" with "gay," and it's equally true. Unfortunately, both evangelical and Mormon alike seem to get a kick out of demonizing, weaving conspiracy theories, and "bearing false witness" against the gay community.
diamond said:Melon old boy, I think you got it wrong, here is my Church's stance on Homosexuality; I see no demonizing by my Church's statement:
Check this:
http://www.lds.org/portal/site/LDSO...M100000176f620a____&hideNav=1&contentLocale=0
President Gordon B. Hinckley has promised that those with same-gender attraction who do not express these inclinations may “go forward as do all other members of the Church”
martha said:PEOPLE, dammit, PEOPLE
Quit with the ppl bullshit already.
Irvine511 said:
that's fascinating.
are we misunderstanding you, diamond, or are you saying that an individual who is gay is not worth of being called a "people" just a "ppl"? that being gay is so unnatural as to revoke someone's personhood?
just curious. are we misinterpreting you?
diamond said:
Melon old boy, I think you got it wrong, here is my Church's stance on Homosexuality; I see no demonizing by my Church's statement:
Check this:
http://www.lds.org/portal/site/LDSO...M100000176f620a____&hideNav=1&contentLocale=0
Although it is still not exactly what Gays are hoping for, I think as a culture our tone is much friendly to same gender attraction people, admittingly that it still doesn't please everybody, but there are a lot of gay Mormons that still choose to stay in the Church for one reason or another.
Contrast that with this:
This is a very interesting and telling clip.
2 "Evangelicals demonstrators" debating eachother.
One hates Mormons, the other hates Gays.
Take a look, go down to the link entitled,
"Preaching Against Fred Phelps/Westboro Baptist Church"
and see 2 camps scream back and forth at eachother:
http://www.revivalneeded.com/video.html
As a Mormon Christian, I pity them both, and most fairminded ppl would be able to see my Church's views are less confrontational, contentious and much different than Evangalicals.
dbs
These blessings are based on obedience to eternal principles. The importance of families is one of these principles. Heaven is organized by families, which require a man and a woman who together exercise their creative powers within the bounds the Lord has set. Same-gender relationships are inconsistent with this plan. Without both a husband and a wife there would be no eternal family and no opportunity to become like Heavenly Father.
In some circumstances a person defers marriage because he or she is not presently attracted to a member of the opposite gender. While many Latter-day Saints, through individual effort, the exercise of faith, and reliance upon the enabling power of the Atonement, overcome same-gender attraction in mortality, others may not be free of this challenge in this life. However, the perfect plan of our Father in Heaven makes provision for individuals who seek to keep His commandments but who, through no fault of their own, do not have an eternal marriage in mortal life. As we follow Heavenly Father’s plan, our bodies, feelings, and desires will be perfected in the next life so that every one of God’s children may find joy in a family consisting of a husband, a wife, and children.
Same-gender attractions include deep emotional, social, and physical feelings. All of Heavenly Father’s children desire to love and be loved, including many adults who, for a variety of reasons, remain single. God assures His children, including those currently attracted to persons of the same gender, that their righteous desires will eventually be fully satisfied in God’s own way and according to His timing.
diamond said:So please in the future do not say that my Church demonizes gay ppl, because they do not and the premise is inflamatory, nor does Mitt Romney who the thread is about.
A decade has passed since the excommunication which ended 20 years as a devout convert member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Two decades of the three of my adult life was spent as a Mormon. I was missionary, congregational leader, sunday school teacher, missionary leader and more. Twenty years ended in one day. One day that was presaged by a few years, but it ended in one day.
I was excommunicated on January 7th, 1997, but the day that started in motion the occurances that would lead to that excommunication day was August 16th, 1996. You see, on that day I was in Salt Lake City, Utah giving a talk at a Sunstone conference. I had never been to a Sunstone conference, but they asked me to speak as a gay man, as a Mormon and as a molecular biologist on a panel. The panel was discussing a new change to the Church's social service booklet about homosexuality. This booklet was given to Church psychiatrists to help them deal with LGBT members. The booklet was filled with factual errors and errors of omission. The panel consisted of myself, a medical doctor and a psychiatrist and we criticized the new booklet.
I almost didn't go. I was in the middle of writing my dissertation in Rochester New York and was frantically trying to finish up experiments. I also was, at that time, an "active" Mormon and though I could have been considered quite a liberal Mormon (I was openly gay, though celibate, at the time) and only attended church a couple times a month, I wasn't sure I wanted to give the talk. So I called them and said I couldn't go. But then my mother called me and told me I absolutely had to go. Though she didn't know what, there was a reason I had to go. I told her I couldn't afford the last minute fare. She was so sure I had to go she paid the fare.
...
Up to that point I hadn't told anyone in the Church about Guy. It was a don't ask, don't tell policy. The missionaries took that news back to my bishop.
The bishop asked me in our discussion that day about this 'boyfriend'. Up to that point I had been a celibate, active Mormon. He wanted to know if that had changed. I wasn't about to lie about the man I was going to spend my life with, so I said it had indeed changed.
He wasn't sure what to do with that, so we set up an appointment with the Stake President. After discussing the situation (talk in Utah, a boyfriend, etc), he decided that we would have to hold a 'court'.
Yes, a court. You sit before 15 men, the stake president, his two counselors and 12 stake councilmen, and hear 'evidence' against you and defend your membership.