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Old 12-27-2004, 09:18 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2DMfan
Organized religion is the antithesis of what Jesus taught.
I agree that not going to church doesn't make you any less religious, but can you give some examples for how you've arrived at the above conclusion?
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Old 12-27-2004, 09:59 PM   #17
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This article and research looks at suicide in religion. Not religion in suicide.

Still, positive developments indeed.
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Old 12-27-2004, 10:04 PM   #18
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"What's the use of religion / if you're any good?" --Bono, "Mercy"

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Old 12-27-2004, 11:28 PM   #19
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People of faith have something to look up to, and a deeper value for life. If humanity is our only hope, sit here and let me dig up a pistol.
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Old 12-27-2004, 11:33 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
If humanity is our only hope, sit here and let me dig up a pistol.
so this is what your faith has left you with?
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Old 12-27-2004, 11:40 PM   #21
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I'm saying humanity is not my only hope.
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Old 12-27-2004, 11:42 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
People of faith have something to look up to, and a deeper value for life. If humanity is our only hope, sit here and let me dig up a pistol.
this sounds like your faith has caused you to distain humanity


humanity is a good thing
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Old 12-27-2004, 11:50 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
People of faith have something to look up to, and a deeper value for life. If humanity is our only hope, sit here and let me dig up a pistol.
That's condescending as all hell.

How many times have "people of faith" as you call them said "oh well, it's God's will" and put it out of their pretty little heads when something like the disaster in Asia happens? "Deeper value for life" my ass. Some do, some don't -- just like everyone else.

Perhaps "people of faith" are just more frightened of going to hell if they commit suicide. Atheists know it doesn't exist, so if life is hell, suicide ends that hell.
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Old 12-27-2004, 11:51 PM   #24
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More like, my faith has allowed me to realize that humanity alone cannot make us virtuous. Humanity can be a good thing, but the world as a whole is a pathetic, miserable place. It's more interested in materialism than helping others. Let's market depression, after all, it sells.

I know a couple who went to a village in India as missionaries. In this village, the men have a 60% suicide rate. That's how low their economic status is out there. They have never heard of the gospel, and my guess is that they would have much more hope if they had more to live for.
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Old 12-27-2004, 11:57 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2DMfan
Religion is the artiface to faith.
You can have faith with no religion.
As far as I understand, faith is essential to belief.
And religion means nothing, as far as faith.

it's just more socially adherent or whatever.

Organized religion is the antithesis of what Jesus taught.
But whatever, you can't tell this to people who have been going to church all their lives. It's not that going to church is a bad thing, it's that NOT going to church isn;t a bad thing either.

So it's an artifice to the faith. Always has been.
I agree with this. You have to wonder why we have a certain set of standards set by an organized religion. You have to look at the real things Jesus taught - about judging others, helping the poor, and living a pure and decent life. Also, he taught about doing good deeds out of the goodness of your heart, rather than out of a forced routine.
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Old 12-28-2004, 12:04 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by indra


That's condescending as all hell.

How many times have "people of faith" as you call them said "oh well, it's God's will" and put it out of their pretty little heads when something like the disaster in Asia happens? "Deeper value for life" my ass. Some do, some don't -- just like everyone else.

Perhaps "people of faith" are just more frightened of going to hell if they commit suicide. Atheists know it doesn't exist, so if life is hell, suicide ends that hell.
I would strongly disagree with those people you are referring to. I definately hate tragedies, and yes, it has me questioning my faith at times. However, I would argue that there could be meaning behind it - NOT TO SAY WE SHOULD JUST SIT THERE AND WATCH THE WHOLE WORLD DIE OUT. I think of ups and downs as an opportunity to make something positive happen.

The suicide point is interesting. In my teen years, I had some suicidal thoughts, but I overcame them. I don't know why your wording appears that you think suicide is "a way out of hell." Suicide is horrible, it brings everyone you know down, and scars them for life. They will feel that they are to blame for it.
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Old 12-28-2004, 12:05 AM   #27
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The thread title is about religion, not Christianity.

or am I missing something?

As a matter of fact, Judaism, mentioned in the article, was included, and they have managed without the Gospel.

From the article:

[Q]
"If someone acknowledges being religious, all else being equal, they are at lower risk to act on suicidal thoughts than someone who does not acknowledge religious affiliation," study co-author Dr. Maria A. Oquendo told Reuters Health.

Further, she added, "it does not appear to make a difference what religion they state their affiliation for." [/Q]
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Old 12-28-2004, 12:07 AM   #28
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[Q]Perhaps "people of faith" are just more frightened of going to hell if they commit suicide.[/Q]

Almost EXACTLY what the article said.
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Old 12-28-2004, 12:09 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
[Q]Perhaps "people of faith" are just more frightened of going to hell if they commit suicide.[/Q]

Almost EXACTLY what the article said.
Ah! So are they really happier, or just damned if they do?
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Old 12-28-2004, 12:10 AM   #30
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[Q]"It appears that people who state they have a religious affiliation are more likely to have moral objections to suicide and may not act on suicidal thoughts because they think it is wrong to do so," Oquendo said. [/Q]
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