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Old 02-21-2007, 03:21 PM   #31
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Originally posted by Liesje


It's sort of like this in the US. For example, if I'd gone to OU after all, my tuition would be $14,000 while OK residents would pay $5,700. For UofM, I would pay $4,700 b/c I'm a resident, but non-Michigan residents would pay $14,500.

I'm not really sure why this is. I'm guessing b/c the schools get their $$$ from state taxes? It still seems really unfair.
It's like this because in state tuition doesn't cover the cost of education; it only covers about 50% of the average cost of education, so the out of staters have to make up for the loss by paying much higher tuition, over 100% of the average cost of education.
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Old 02-21-2007, 03:23 PM   #32
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School should be for free period and I say if corporations want to sponsor their product which means free education to anyone with good teachers then so be it.
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Old 02-21-2007, 04:37 PM   #33
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Originally posted by anitram


Which has always been a source of contention in English Canada.

If I come to Quebec to law school, I have to pay 3x as much tuition as you. If you come to Ontario, you will pay the same as me, who is a resident. So my taxes subsidize your education and the Quebec government will not subsidize mine. It is an incredibly insulting system, and you can bet that if English Canada treated Quebeckers this way, the provincial government of Quebec would cry foul in about 2.3 seconds and litigate the matter all the way to the SCC.
Agreed. I understand what you're saying. The system is unfair and that's why it needs to be changed and it is changing, albeit, very slowly.
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Old 02-21-2007, 04:43 PM   #34
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Originally posted by Justin24
School should be for free period and I say if corporations want to sponsor their product which means free education to anyone with good teachers then so be it.
How does this work?


I'm not asking for it to be free, or even close to free, I just don't get why people should have to save for 20 years so their kids can go. I went to the same school as my mom. Same place, same buildings, same professors (sometimes)...but my tuition was about four times as much. We have added new buildings and facilities, but the way my school works is that tuition never ever pays for these additions. ALL the money comes from donors, including the cost needed for maintenance and upgrades later on. So why does it cost so much more?
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:03 PM   #35
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why shouldn't education be free? i cant see a valid reason why education should not be a basic right. it is an expense which should take priority over many things in a federal budget.
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:10 PM   #36
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I paid for everything myself.

I took out loans.
I joined the service.
I worked 40+ hours a week midnight shift on top of school.
I became a graduate assistant.
I took out more loans.

I busted my ass. I am happy to say I am one year away from repaying ALL of my loans for undergrad and grad school.
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:12 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
I paid for everything myself.

I took out loans.
I joined the service.
I worked 40+ hours a week midnight shift on top of school.
I became a graduate assistant.
I took out more loans.

I busted my ass. I am happy to say I am one year away from repaying ALL of my loans for undergrad and grad school.
I think that's awesome Dreadsox. I really respect what you've achieved.
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:13 PM   #38
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be proud, sure, but i dont think anyone should have to go through this just because they want to take education further. i think we've lost some key priorities in this user-pays system we are drowning in.
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:19 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liesje




I was thinking we'd start saving for retirement, maybe a house or even a car...but saving for my non-existent kids' ed. when I'm not even done w/ my own sounded pretty absurd at the time. The news people should have interviewed some couples OUR age.
No No No

you got it all wrong

the President wants you to have a "Medical IRA".

You know, over your working career you put away a spare couple of hundred thousand dollars that would not be taxed that is the key, you pay less taxes.

Well, if you ever get sick you can take this $200,000 or so and give it to the Medical and Pharmaceutical companies so you can live a few extra years.

This is program the GOP should be real proud of, just one plank of their "ownership society."
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:21 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
I paid for everything myself.

I took out loans.
I joined the service.
I worked 40+ hours a week midnight shift on top of school.
I became a graduate assistant.
I took out more loans.

I busted my ass. I am happy to say I am one year away from repaying ALL of my loans for undergrad and grad school.
congrats,

that is great

it sounds like it was a struggle

I wonder if costs have gone up since you finaced your education
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:26 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep


congrats,

that is great

it sounds like it was a struggle

I wonder if costs have gone up since you finaced your education
I think you know the answer to that.

It was a struggle. In particular the year I was called to the bursar's office and told to go home (december of my Jr. year). Apparently my father did not fill out the FAF for because he did not file his tax return. So all of the financial aid and student loans fell through.

Because I was at an evangelical college, they were very forgiving about the money I owed and sent it to a collection agency.

The toughest part was getting any college to recognize me as independant from my father. At the time, and my god I hope it is not this way today, you needed your parents to sign everything. I had to prove I was financially on my own for x amount of years (two or three) before I could get back into school because my father still refused to pay his taxes.

It was a long road. The ARMY helped tremendously.
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Old 02-21-2007, 05:31 PM   #42
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i am amazed at how people are able to work and go to school, and i am ever thankful to my parents for being able to afford to pay for college.

what i remember from college was spending days in class and nights and weekends in the library (and, yes, the odd party friday and saturday nights). but classes and athletics took most of everything i had.

i cannot imagine working 40+ hours on top of everythying else that was going on.

so, my hat's off to all of you.
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Old 02-21-2007, 06:37 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox

The toughest part was getting any college to recognize me as independant from my father. At the time, and my god I hope it is not this way today, you needed your parents to sign everything. I had to prove I was financially on my own for x amount of years (two or three) before I could get back into school because my father still refused to pay his taxes.

I'm not sure if this is true for all, but my school basically goes by taxes. If you are a "dependent", then you MUST go by the parent's tax information. My parents and I got into a big fight Jr. and Sr. years because they still wanted to claim me, but I wanted to claim myself so I'd get more taxes back and more aid. If you file as an independent and your parents aren't claiming you, they can't force you to provide any financial info for your parents. I ended up losing the fight w/ my dad b/c I needed him to co-sign my CitiAssist Loans. In return, I let him continue claiming me on his taxes, even though it meant less aid and a smaller tax return for me.
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Old 02-22-2007, 12:06 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liesje


I'm not sure if this is true for all, but my school basically goes by taxes. If you are a "dependent", then you MUST go by the parent's tax information. My parents and I got into a big fight Jr. and Sr. years because they still wanted to claim me, but I wanted to claim myself so I'd get more taxes back and more aid. If you file as an independent and your parents aren't claiming you, they can't force you to provide any financial info for your parents. I ended up losing the fight w/ my dad b/c I needed him to co-sign my CitiAssist Loans. In return, I let him continue claiming me on his taxes, even though it meant less aid and a smaller tax return for me.
I think public universities should be free in exchange for two years of full-time service to the state or federal goverment (could be military, peace corps, Red Cross...etc).

I said in another thread 2 year service should be mandatory. I think paying for a public university or a scholarship of equal dollar value to a private university would be a fair exchange and would be very beneficial to our society.
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Old 02-22-2007, 01:39 AM   #45
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^ That's an idea I've heard floated many many times, including by myself, from academics who are distressed by all the financial stresses we watch our students struggle and sometimes collapse under. And also because we find the idea of such tradeoffs very appealing (contrary to our apparent smash-the-idols reputation, academics in general and perhaps social scientists in particular tend to be suckers for civic virtue cultivation regimens , even if much of our research deals in problematizing and critiquing). In a recent post I sketched out some reasons why tuitions have increased so much over the last several decades; the modern research university is a dauntingly complex animal financially, and there will be no easy answers to bringing those costs down.

However, we're also very jaded at this point (especially those of us at public colleges) from years of watching our shares of state budgets keep shrinking and shrinking. It is very hard to be optimistic about any approach that assumes the government will willingly foot the bill. It is also very hard to be optimistic that service to organizations like Peace Corps or Red Cross would ever be rewarded that generously.

As far as the general topic of the sacrifices various posters in here have made to get themselves through college...I suppose it is fair to say that most of us feel we got something worthwhile out of them, whether that's the discipline of military service or knowledge of a trade. In my case I wound up getting 5 years of retail management out of it and that has proved helpful to me in all kinds of ways, probably will even more so if I seek academic administrative positions in the future. However, all in all, I would rather not have had to spend thousands and thousands of hours in which I was already exhausted from TAing (did that too) and my studies to earn that experience. A couple thousand would have sufficed! And I did miss out on many excellent research opportunities, conferences, and socialization time, which is all part of the experience...sad to say, unlike most of my colleagues, I'm in touch with hardly anyone from my college or grad years nowadays, in fact I can barely remember most of them, because I never had time to go out for a beer or join the impromptu roadtrips for Mardi Gras or St. Paddy's or just kick around the dorm self-indulgently speculating about the perfect theory to explain life, the universe and everything that you're always certain lies just around the corner when you're that age. No one needs to binge drink or attend a football game every weekend, but I would prefer my kids not miss out on all that as totally as I did. Above all, I wouldn't want them to repeat my experience and still have mountains more debt than I wound up with anyway.

I too expect to be all paid off within the year Dread.
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