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Old 08-25-2009, 05:14 PM   #361
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Originally Posted by Diamond
Another bigoted view?
I would argue an article that starts with the following is indeed, prima facie, bigoted:

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The politics of charisma is so Third World. Americans were never going to buy into it for long.
Are you implying that because his name is Mr Ajami that he's exempt from the charge of anti-black racism? How curious.

But, regardless of whether its a bigoted view or not, the above quote is pure Alice in Wonderland stuff. But, that's no surprise - neo-cons like Ajami are permanent residents of Wonderland: the beliefs they hold are demonstrably false and they operate in a realm of fantasy.

Most of the rest of the world believes, wrongly or rightly, that a significant proportion of Americans quite frankly do buy into 'the politics of charisma' to an extent that's very unhealthy, but funnily enough it isn't, by and large, Democrat Presidents who are linked to this - au contraire, it is people like Bush II and - yes - Reagan, that are most frequently cited as evidence for this thesis.

How quickly some forget 2003.

Dixie Chicks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Those who forget are doomed to repeat the past, as is always the case.
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Old 08-25-2009, 05:21 PM   #362
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I don't see what difference a photo would make, the cell phone user could just as easily walk out of the establishment and phone 10 friends and tell them that they just saw the president's family at X location.

Cell phone cameras are a fact of life now. To me, it really does seem like going too far when phones are confiscated from the public just because the Obamas arrive at a public place.


because they can be tracked as they go down the road from one location to the next -- it's effective 24 hour surveillance, and the children of a president are heavily guarded for obvious reasons, and they're both preteens.

i don't think that Obama wanted the cell phones confiscated. i think that it was a decision made by the Secret Service, who likely has good reason.
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Old 08-25-2009, 05:24 PM   #363
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No, Obama didn't "create" the deficit, and I don't hear anyone on the conservative side saying that. Bush absolutely created the deficit. What I do hear legitimate criticism of, and rightfully so, is the great extent to which Obama has increased the deficit, and the fact that he has spent more money than anyone in history, and in such a short amount of time, no less.
Legitimate criticism from consistent conservative sources who also criticised the Bush deficit is certainly valid - and I agree with such criticisms.

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You sure you want to go down this path? Because the people making this argument only seem to end up looking like fools, using the race card themselves. Did you hear what David Patterson said the other day?
I agree with you, certainly, that elements of the liberal left focus on race and identity politics to an extent that is unhealthy.

But when the most recent link posted is an article penned by a self-hating Arab who thinks that the 'politics of charisma' are only a factor in backwards, Third World countries inhabited by brown people - then, yes, I'd argue racism - or, possibly, post-colonial self loathing (pace Fanon Frantz Fanon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) is a factor in some reactions to Obama.
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Old 08-25-2009, 05:52 PM   #364
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because they can be tracked as they go down the road from one location to the next -- it's effective 24 hour surveillance, and the children of a president are heavily guarded for obvious reasons, and they're both preteens.

i don't think that Obama wanted the cell phones confiscated. i think that it was a decision made by the Secret Service, who likely has good reason.
I'm not really sure how cell phone pictures would enable better tracking of his family in a public place than word of mouth via telephone calls (but it's very possible I'm missing something here, I'm entering day two: the headache, and I'm probably dense at the moment).

I just think that they have secret service with them at all times, and that should be sufficient without having to take away cell phones. That said, in the grand scheme of things, either way, it's not a huge deal, there are far more pressing things for the nation to be concerned about at this point.
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Old 08-25-2009, 06:02 PM   #365
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By the way, they do withhold U.S. federal taxes before the state lotteries pay out. Feel free to bury the rest in the backyard for all they care.

DUH!

I meant what was left, so it would never happen again the next year, or ever again.
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Old 08-25-2009, 07:27 PM   #366
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That's not how it works...
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Old 08-25-2009, 09:07 PM   #367
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I haven't see a word from you before about the deficit. I didn't see a word from you about the deficit during the Bush years.
Sorry financeguy! The article piqued my interest and I put it up.

Of course administrations are interconnected and Bush handed over a deficit of more than $1 trillion.

But it's no surprise the White House's deficit projection came in much lower than CBO's...around the same time the White House was pushing a controversial $800 billion stimulus, cap & tax, and health care overhaul.
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Old 08-26-2009, 10:43 AM   #368
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I saw some of that yesterday, it was sad. They booed and jeered when this woman asked why Gitmo was closed and he said that abuses went on there.

YouTube - McCain Booed By Arizonans For Saying Obama Respects Constitution
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Old 08-26-2009, 10:46 AM   #369
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That's not how it works...
Not how what works? Sorry but there is no way they can prove how much you owe on if you have it buried in jars.
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Old 08-26-2009, 01:14 PM   #370
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Not how what works? Sorry but there is no way they can prove how much you owe on if you have it buried in jars.
They know how much you won, period. So you will be taxed.
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Old 08-26-2009, 01:19 PM   #371
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I saw some of that yesterday, it was sad. They booed and jeered when this woman asked why Gitmo was closed and he said that abuses went on there.
They should be proud of themselves... A new low for being uninformed and disrespectful at the same time has been hit.
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Old 08-26-2009, 04:05 PM   #372
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They should be proud of themselves... A new low for being uninformed and disrespectful at the same time has been hit.
Should we be giving McCain a pass? He was great in this clip, he said the right thing and he ignored the idiots in the crowd, but he's saying "let's be respectful" of the president when his tactics during the campaign last year were at times quite disrespectful of Obama. His convention last year was one of the most vitrolic and sickening political events I've ever seen, and he implicitly endorsed every speech given at that convention by not vetoing any of them. You think he didn't know the gist of what Giuliani and Palin were going to say there? Anyway, I'm straying from the topic. Yes, the people in that crowd appeared to be quite stupid and making asses of themselves.
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Old 08-26-2009, 04:46 PM   #373
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McCain was not the same McCain we had seen in the past. I think he lost a lot of respect from moderates and independents because he allow his party's tactics to take over his campaign. Unfortunately he's lost a lot of respect from the kook right as well for being someone that's been willing to compromise and reach across the aisle.
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Old 08-26-2009, 04:50 PM   #374
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McCain was not the same McCain we had seen in the past. I think he lost a lot of respect from moderates and independents because he allow his party's tactics to take over his campaign. Unfortunately he's lost a lot of respect from the cook right as well for being someone that's been willing to compromise and reach across the aisle.

cook right?


these guys?

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Old 08-26-2009, 04:57 PM   #375
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