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Old 04-02-2007, 11:11 AM   #16
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Beacause you are a feminist controlled cyborg

Oh yeah.

Seriously I think this whole thing has been brought on by men themselves. And usually the ones bitching about it have been the worse in contributing to this image. We live in a society where if you take care of yourself it's considered feminine, if you don't care you're macho.

That's why I find this whole thing quite ridiculous. We've developed these gender roles that don't allow people to be themselves. You stated earlier about how you are confused about your role in today's world. If you want to be a stay home father, then do so. Why not.

Display less masculine qualities? What does that mean? If you don't like drinking beer and getting fat, then don't. If you'd actually like to be healthy and go to the gym then do so. If your father dies and you feel like crying, why hold it in? What benefit does that have for you?

And as far as cartoons or kids programing; there are still plenty. I have two nephews both obsessed with Batman and TMNT, and they also watch gender neutral cartoons like Veggie Tales, in addition to female strong roles like Dora. Which I think is a pretty well rounded viewing.
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Old 04-02-2007, 07:30 PM   #17
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OK, King of Queens, Tool Time and The Simpsons aren't really very positive about the image of men, but on the other hand you have Al Bundy still airing
I find it funny that we look at these of examples of bad man stereotypes, but fail to address the women in these shows. Every leading female character on those shows makes me cringe. They're as negatively portrayed as the men.
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Old 04-02-2007, 08:24 PM   #18
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Yeah, but for them there are Peggy and Kelly Bundy

I only know a few episodes of King of Queens and Simpsons, but you are right, neither is portrayed exactly as the positive role model.

I don't know about what the Times and the Guardian write that creates such a negative picture of men. Of course it might be right that men don't get reflected as they would like to be, but as far as I've seen it those negative stereotypes about men and women only get emphasized in Sitcoms or cartoons such as the Simpsons.

I haven't seen or heard of any men feeling bad about themselves in my surrounding, so it would be interesting if there was anyone who really got a bad feeling when watching too much TV.

Then again, in the more serious movies and TV series' I think neither gender gets portrayed that.

I wasn't addressing the female characters here that much because the topic was the negative picture of men. But of course the character Leah Remini plays in King of Queens has some very bad aspects either.
But it's a Sitcom and it's meant to exaggerate these aspects.
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Old 04-02-2007, 08:54 PM   #19
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I should have written that differently, as I know you personally are probably well aware of that. It seems the men who complain in general miss the alternative that Leah Rimini's character is a pain in the arse, the Bundys are all insane, Marge Simpson is a borderline idiot, etc.
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Old 04-03-2007, 09:58 AM   #20
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Oh yeah.

Seriously I think this whole thing has been brought on by men themselves. And usually the ones bitching about it have been the worse in contributing to this image. We live in a society where if you take care of yourself it's considered feminine, if you don't care you're macho.

That's why I find this whole thing quite ridiculous. We've developed these gender roles that don't allow people to be themselves. You stated earlier about how you are confused about your role in today's world. If you want to be a stay home father, then do so. Why not.

Display less masculine qualities? What does that mean? If you don't like drinking beer and getting fat, then don't. If you'd actually like to be healthy and go to the gym then do so. If your father dies and you feel like crying, why hold it in? What benefit does that have for you?

And as far as cartoons or kids programing; there are still plenty. I have two nephews both obsessed with Batman and TMNT, and they also watch gender neutral cartoons like Veggie Tales, in addition to female strong roles like Dora. Which I think is a pretty well rounded viewing.
Ah I'm not confused about what role i'm playing in today's world, I'm somewhere inbetween, a hippy that loves moisturiser. I was just saying something that i've read a bit about lately, that men in general seem to be unsure what they are meant to be now that they are not usually the sole provider for their families (this is mainly for 30-50 year old men).......they should just be themselves whatever that individually entails, I do agree that gender roles are too stringent in society.

By the way sorry if the feminist cyborg comment offended twas menat to be good natured joke, relating to financeguy's assertion in the women's equality thread that there is a feminist conspiracy...
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Old 04-03-2007, 10:02 AM   #21
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By the way sorry if the feminist cyborg comment offended twas menat to be good natured joke, relating to financeguy's assertion in the women's equality thread that there is a feminist conspiracy...
Oh, no, I got the joke, don't worry about it.

And my response was to a general 'you' not a specific 'you', for I wasn't sure where you stood...
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Old 04-03-2007, 10:27 AM   #22
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Alls well then.....my stance is we should just get on with it None of this seems to big a deal to me.
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Old 04-03-2007, 10:53 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar



That's why I find this whole thing quite ridiculous. We've developed these gender roles that don't allow people to be themselves. You stated earlier about how you are confused about your role in today's world. If you want to be a stay home father, then do so. Why not.
Exactly. These gender roles have been in place in society for centuries, but these types of articles/shows/movies don't exactly help matters. Bottom line, do what you feel comfortable with - fuck what society says you should be.

I'm printing this piece out for my Sociology class this weekend - we're discussing gender stratification, so this will tie in with the lecture perfectly.
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Old 04-03-2007, 11:16 AM   #24
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So why am I going to the gym?


so you can shower with me and AEON?


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Old 04-03-2007, 12:30 PM   #25
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
Interesting opinion piece, not very convincing to me though. Men still play the majority of roles. So yes in a movie the villian may be a man, but the majority of the heros who destroy the villians are...guess what? MEN. They completely ignore these facts throughout the piece.

Here's another piece I found interesting:

"The research found that men are also objectified in women’s magazines and popular media in the same ways that women were in male-orientated media for several generations, but which is now regarded as blatantly sexist and “politically incorrect”. For instance, Cosmopolitan magazine’s “Guy without a shirt” section features male pin-ups such as David Beckham - for example, “Want to see Becks take a free kick - naked” (October 2003). The top-rating TV program, Sex and the City has extensively portrayed men as little more than sex objects and “handbags” for women’s amusement and pleasure."

Are you serious? "Were" objectified? You've got to be kidding, for every Cosmo there is a Maxim, FHM, Details, GQ, Playboy, etc...

This alone makes it obvious this opinion piece is a piece of...
if you replace "were" with "are" that piece makes much more sense...

i can say that high school aged males today are MUCH more obsessed with self image than they were when i was in high school 10+ years ago.
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Old 04-03-2007, 12:44 PM   #26
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i can say that high school aged males today are MUCH more obsessed with self image than they were when i was in high school 10+ years ago.


wither metrosexuals?
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Old 04-03-2007, 12:47 PM   #27
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so you can shower with me and AEON?


Oh yeah!!!
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Old 04-03-2007, 12:54 PM   #28
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Oh yeah!!!


it'll be just like "300"
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Old 04-03-2007, 01:15 PM   #29
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wither metrosexuals?
some what but not quite as fabulous.

i didn't know what an ab was until i started working out more seriously for basketball late sophomore/early junior year... today middle school kids think they're fat if they don't have a 6-pack.
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Old 04-03-2007, 01:24 PM   #30
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i didn't know what an ab was until i started working out more seriously for basketball late sophomore/early junior year... today middle school kids think they're fat if they don't have a 6-pack.


but we keep getting told that all American kids, everywhere, are obese.
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