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Old 05-25-2005, 03:02 PM   #31
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come on deep, that's a bit disrespectful
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Old 05-25-2005, 03:11 PM   #32
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Is it possible?

Quote:
Originally posted by deep


This is great news for you.

Forget about the celibacy.

Go for it.

Sex is great!

You will be glad you did.

And you are already forgiven.


Katie bar the door

take the phone off the hook,

pull down the shades

and let it rip.
Just because a Christian is forgiven doesn't mean he/she can commit any kind of sin and "get away with it". As I have said in a previous post , Christians have a new nature and this nature drives them to want to be in God's will and to not want to sin. If I met someone who claimed to be a Christian yet has the attitude you present, I wouldn't be so sure that person ever really gave himself to Christ.

To address the issue of if Christians "get away with it", the answer is no. Though he forvies their sin, God also disciplines his children.
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Old 05-25-2005, 03:14 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrsSpringsteen
come on deep, that's a bit disrespectful
Thanks, Mrs. S
I thought it was a bit disrespectful, also, especially considering that this thread is someone asking for spiritual advice and that people, like you, me, coemgen and others are trying to help by giving our opinion.
Thanks for "getting my back" so much lately. It means a lot to me, it really does.
Mike
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Old 05-25-2005, 03:18 PM   #34
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Coemgen.

"you have to go to church to be forgiven"? This sounds like a Catholic talking (are you Catholic)? Assuming that in order to be forgiven by God, you first have to go through the intermediary of the Church. Ie, you can't be forgiven by God unless God's appointed rep tells Him first.

Of course that's not Biblical. The Armenian Chruch takes a curious stance on this. It is adamantly opposed to the Catholic rirual of "confession"--for the very reasons you have said: it isn't biblical. (As a side note, I shoukd mention that as a state institution--ie as being the official religion of a State, tough people of hs are freeto practice there--The Armenian Chruch is technically 13 yrs older than the Catholic Chruch. The Armenian KIng proclaimed Chrisianity the offical religion in 301 AD..Constantine converted in 314, but anyway, that' another story.

I shoul also tell you that ts in the Armenian Chruch are not only allowed but encouraged to marry. The priest's wife, literally, "Yeretzgin"--that's what the word means and that's her title--the wife of the pastor is known as "Yeretzgin Lisa" or "Yeretzgin Maria" or whatever--has a very important role to play in the local congregation, perhaps even more so than in Protestant denominations. And often she' community leader in her own right. (I'm seriously thinking of going to her to start a local "One" group--I'm warring my wristband from Saturday's show, and have done dome emiling of Senators etc.) It's only if you are thinking of becoming someone poerful in the Church, like Bishop you have to remain single and take a celibacy vow.

ANYWAY, confession. The Churh is very individualistic about things like this. Surprisingly, it allows a lot of discretion to the individual. The attitude is, IF you feel the need to confess to someone in the church, there is no way to do it except by making a generic confession before the congregation...don't tewll what your sin is, but on;y let them know you sinned. There is no one-on-one with a preist in private. But you arenot taught in SUnday school (Like Catholics are) that confession is a requirement. You can either confess before a priest, but you are also encouraged to have a private, personal relationship with God.

THe church allows adult baptisms, and at an adult baptism, you are also given an absolution. You are cleansed of sin entering the church. A lot of emphasis is placed on fellowship and prayer. I think this lax or conflicting attitude is a lingering legacy of centuries of persecution and oppression. On the one hand, during such periods, like the oppression of the Turks, when there was no Armenian government the Church became the government. Thus, the need for public ritual and communion.But the other hand, the Chruch deliberately did not want to become like other denominations. Catholics. SO they allowed a lot of doctrinal freedom. A person was encouraged to read the Bible and commune with God privately. This for situations where priests had been killed or there was no local pastor or congregation.

For example, if one is in danger of death, and there is no priest around, any one person is free to give another person last rites. THis can be as simple as making the sign of the Cross over their foreead and reciting your own version of a blessing.

IN short, while the Church is set up around striuct doctrinal lines, circumstances allow for it to be flezible. The individual is given a surprsing amount of frredom. The downside, though, is that the old chruch was very male-oriented. A lot of woemn have left.
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Old 05-25-2005, 03:34 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by 80sU2isBest

Thanks for "getting my back" so much lately. It means a lot to me, it really does.
You're welcome, I just wish things to be a bit more respectful in here sometimes.

Actually I thought it was VERY disrespectful but I was trying to be nice There's no need to mock someone's beliefs about something as personal as celibacy/sex/whatever.
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Old 05-25-2005, 03:50 PM   #36
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Teta040, thanks for that. You answered my question.
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Old 05-25-2005, 05:51 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by coemgen
verte76, I didn't mean to offend you with my post earlier. I hope it didn't come across wrong. I'm glad you don't see confession as something that you have to do to be forgiven. I disagree with us having to go through someone else to get to God. God doesn't want it that way. He wants a relationship with us. I'm not going to have a good relationship with my dad if I'm only talking to him through my mom, you know? While I don't agree with it in those terms, I do agree it's good to be held accountable. I'm just rambling thoughts here.
None taken, I just got concerned that maybe some people didn't understand where I was coming from. I don't want anyone to believe that I think the Church necessarily has to come between the God and the believer because in fact I do not. Maybe I'm not the most orthodox Catholic on the planet, but that's my belief.
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Old 05-25-2005, 06:24 PM   #38
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I'm getting to this kind of late, but I just wanted to make clear that I do think deep's comments were inappropriate.

Let's try to be more respectful of people's beliefs here.

Thanks.
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Old 05-25-2005, 08:12 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by Teta040

For example, if one is in danger of death, and there is no priest around, any one person is free to give another person last rites. THis can be as simple as making the sign of the Cross over their foreead and reciting your own version of a blessing.

From what I understand, this is also true in Catholicism.
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Old 05-25-2005, 08:17 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by pax
I'm getting to this kind of late, but I just wanted to make clear that I do think deep's comments were inappropriate.

Let's try to be more respectful of people's beliefs here.

Thanks.
Well, it might be rude, but what deep posted was what popped into my mind....

And I know many born again types who do exactly what deep posted about. Many see it as a free pass -- the "I can screw over anyone, 'cause I've been born again" idea.
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Old 05-25-2005, 08:19 PM   #41
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The last time I went to confession was in 1990 when I was on a church retreat.
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Old 05-25-2005, 08:45 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by indra


Well, it might be rude, but what deep posted was what popped into my mind....

And I know many born again types who do exactly what deep posted about. Many see it as a free pass -- the "I can screw over anyone, 'cause I've been born again" idea.
For the record, I don't see it that way. The only person I feel I've screwed over is myself and I'm trying to finally do something right with my life. Thanks for all the replies everyone. I really appreciate it. The past couple of months haven't been easy for me and it seems it's going to be a while before I feel completely better about my life right now. This is just a piece of the puzzle and I'm trying to understand it all and do it right this time.
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Old 05-25-2005, 08:46 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by indra


Well, it might be rude, but what deep posted was what popped into my mind....
Why do I not doubt that you tought that about me? After all, I am the type of Christian that makes you want to vomit.

Quote:
Originally posted by indra
And I know many born again types who do exactly what deep posted about. Many see it as a free pass -- the "I can screw over anyone, 'cause I've been born again" idea.
They may seem like the born again "type" to you, but that doesn't mean they're "born again". The Bible says that many will say "Lord, Lord" and God will say "Depart from me...I never knew you". The Bible also says that Christians will be known by their fruit. As I said, their "I don't care" attitude toward sin and their refusal to repent isn't exactly the "fruit" by which Christians are known and indicates to me that they may not be sincere. Being born again changes a person. If there is no change, that says something to me.

By the way, what are you doing in this thread? This thread was started by someone asking for Christian advice. You don't even belong here if all you are going to do is go on another of your "Christians are bad because of x, y and z" tirades.
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Old 05-25-2005, 08:48 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by clarityat3am


For the record, I don't see it that way. The only person I feel I've screwed over is myself and I'm trying to finally do something right with my life. Thanks for all the replies everyone. I really appreciate it. The past couple of months haven't been easy for me and it seems it's going to be a while before I feel completely better about my life right now. This is just a piece of the puzzle and I'm trying to understand it all and do it right this time.
Just put complete faith in Christ and trust that he will guide you. Listen for his voice speaking to your spirit, and you will hear it.

God loves you.
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Old 05-25-2005, 09:09 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by clarityat3am
For the record, I don't see it that way. The only person I feel I've screwed over is myself and I'm trying to finally do something right with my life. Thanks for all the replies everyone. I really appreciate it. The past couple of months haven't been easy for me and it seems it's going to be a while before I feel completely better about my life right now. This is just a piece of the puzzle and I'm trying to understand it all and do it right this time.
To get back to the original spirit of the thread, I think we can all agree that forgiveness is very inherent in Christianity. The fact that you do feel sorry about what you have done, I'm sure that God already knows. I wouldn't worry too much about receiving forgiveness if you're earnestly asking for it.

Melon
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