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Old 08-09-2002, 01:05 PM   #31
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Old 08-09-2002, 01:53 PM   #32
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Originally posted by joyfulgirl


My interpretation is that he was the way, the truth, the life for the people in his sphere at that time and that there is always a living son of god present serving different cultures at different times. Hence, the great masters of all religions. Sadly, they are often not recognized by the masses until they are long dead.
Then why didn't Jesus just tell it that way? I don't get the guy. Why didn't he just say, "look, I'm the way the truth and the life, no one in this culture at this time gets to the Father, except through me." For goodness sake, he said this less than 24 hours before he was killed. "His time" only had a day left. I mean, he had to know that people were gonna write this stuff down, and it would get heard by people in other cultures and other times. His own disciples started telling people from other cultures this stuff within a couple weeks of his death. It sure seems like he meant this for everyone.

And in the verse we all know thanks to the signs at every public event, John 3:16, Jesus said he was the ONLY Son of God.

I think Jesus was totally intolerant of other religions. And yet, he claimed to be all about love.

Again I ask, what's up with that?
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Old 08-09-2002, 01:58 PM   #33
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and joyfulgirl, let me be clear that if I sound a little frustrated, it's only with the enigma of Jesus, not with you or your interpretation. It's all good.
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Old 08-09-2002, 02:12 PM   #34
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Who is Jesus?

AM has said the the most clear and accurate point in this thread.
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Old 08-09-2002, 02:24 PM   #35
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Originally posted by Too Much Asleep
and joyfulgirl, let me be clear that if I sound a little frustrated, it's only with the enigma of Jesus, not with you or your interpretation. It's all good.
I hear ya.
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Old 08-09-2002, 02:30 PM   #36
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Originally posted by Too Much Asleep


Then why didn't Jesus just tell it that way? I don't get the guy. Why didn't he just say, "look, I'm the way the truth and the life, no one in this culture at this time gets to the Father, except through me." For goodness sake, he said this less than 24 hours before he was killed. "His time" only had a day left. I mean, he had to know that people were gonna write this stuff down, and it would get heard by people in other cultures and other times. His own disciples started telling people from other cultures this stuff within a couple weeks of his death. It sure seems like he meant this for everyone.

And in the verse we all know thanks to the signs at every public event, John 3:16, Jesus said he was the ONLY Son of God.

I think Jesus was totally intolerant of other religions. And yet, he claimed to be all about love.

Again I ask, what's up with that?
Maybe he did say all that. The Bible is incomplete as the Council of Nicea determined which books would be included. Many were deleted. Not to mention all its translations, etc. I can't answer your question and I feel your pain.
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Old 08-09-2002, 03:08 PM   #37
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Originally posted by Too Much Asleep


And yet there are many that do.

Jesus himself said "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

What's up with that?
Well, we Christians believe that Jesus was the Son of God. A better translation of "Son of God" might be "of the same nature as God." He was literally God incarnate. So it would make complete sense for Jesus to say something like that.

So while I believe it might be possible for persons who do not profess Christianity or profess a different religion to enter heaven, it won't be their religion that gets them in. It will be Jesus who gets them in, whether or not they recognize it.
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Old 08-09-2002, 04:48 PM   #38
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I am the way, the truth, and the light. No one gets to the Father except through me.

...that being the very first thing that came to mind upon reading this thread title.

I personally don't really understand how all religions, who all worship different gods, are all "right." If they're all "right," then don't all of these gods exist? And if all of these gods exist...oh no i've gone cross eyed.
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Old 08-09-2002, 05:40 PM   #39
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Originally posted by Se7en
I am the way, the truth, and the light. No one gets to the Father except through me.

...that being the very first thing that came to mind upon reading this thread title.

I personally don't really understand how all religions, who all worship different gods, are all "right." If they're all "right," then don't all of these gods exist? And if all of these gods exist...oh no i've gone cross eyed.
I believe there is one ubiquitous God expressing Itself in all languages, in all cultures, through different sons of God (masters, saints, teachers etc.) Devotees of many different teachers have exactly the same kinds of experiences today and throughout history with their teachers as the disciples did with Jesus.
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Old 08-09-2002, 05:52 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by joyfulgirl


I believe there is one ubiquitous God expressing Itself in all languages, in all cultures, through different sons of God (masters, saints, teachers etc.) Devotees of many different teachers have exactly the same kinds of experiences today and throughout history with their teachers as the disciples did with Jesus.
Are you sure about that?

People these days are seeing their teachers use a picnic basket to feed over 5,000 people? People are seeing their teachers walk on water? People are watching their teachers die, and then watching them walk around a few days later?

We aren't seeing those things everyday.
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Old 08-09-2002, 06:16 PM   #41
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Originally posted by KingPin


Are you sure about that?

People these days are seeing their teachers use a picnic basket to feed over 5,000 people? People are seeing their teachers walk on water? People are watching their teachers die, and then watching them walk around a few days later?

We aren't seeing those things everyday.
People are experiencing miracles with their teachers everyday, yes, and always have. I doubt Buddhism would exist were it not for the miracles Buddha's students experienced, and the same for the masters in India today and elsewhere. But no, you won't see it on TV. It's sacred.
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Old 08-09-2002, 06:36 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by joyfulgirl


People are experiencing miracles with their teachers everyday, yes, and always have. I doubt Buddhism would exist were it not for the miracles Buddha's students experienced, and the same for the masters in India today and elsewhere. But no, you won't see it on TV. It's sacred.
Well, Buddha never claimed divinity and never said that his death and resurrection would be the sole means by which humankind could be saved from sin. Jesus did. So Jesus can't possibly be one of many equal avatars. Either he was who he said he was--The Son of God--or he was something incredibly terrible, either a liar or a lunatic.
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Old 08-09-2002, 06:48 PM   #43
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Originally posted by speedracer


Well, Buddha never claimed divinity and never said that his death and resurrection would be the sole means by which humankind could be saved from sin. Jesus did. So Jesus can't possibly be one of many equal avatars. Either he was who he said he was--The Son of God--or he was something incredibly terrible, either a liar or a lunatic.
Buddha pointed the way to enlightenment and demonstrated by example. Masters/avatars/saints/sons of god have their own unique way of teaching Truth within their own culture and time period. We won't agree on this, my friend, so I don't think there's any point in going back and forth on it. I respect your views and in fact used to share them, but I don't anymore.
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Old 08-09-2002, 07:18 PM   #44
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Originally posted by joyfulgirl


Buddha pointed the way to enlightenment and demonstrated by example. Masters/avatars/saints/sons of god have their own unique way of teaching Truth within their own culture and time period. We won't agree on this, my friend, so I don't think there's any point in going back and forth on it. I respect your views and in fact used to share them, but I don't anymore.
Oh no, you can't weasel out of an argument that easily.

At the very least you have to let me continue to communicate with everyone else, even if you don't read my next post.

No matter whose doctrine happens to be "right" at any particular time, Jesus and Buddha can't be simultaneously right.

Jesus taught that our sins have fundamentally estranged us from God, that only his death upon the cross could reconcile us to God, and that after our bodies die we go either to heaven (with God for eternity) or to hell (estranged from God for eternity).

If I understand Buddhism correctly, sin is a foreign concept in Buddhism, there is no God against whom we have sinned (if there is a God, he is nothing like the God of the Judeo-Christian tradition), and our path in life is to die and be reincarnated over and over again until we reach Nirvana--total enlightenment.

And the ultimate reason Christanity and Buddhism can't both be correct? Because Phil Jackson thinks that they are.
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Old 08-09-2002, 07:43 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by joyfulgirl

sons of god
out of genuine curiosity...who are these sons?


Speedracer-
I think C.S. Lewis said that Christ could be either:
1) Demon possessed.
2) Insane.
3) God in the flesh.
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