disrespectful Canadians..... - Page 2 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 03-22-2003, 09:25 AM   #16
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS
 
speedracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 7,573
Local Time: 04:29 PM
Warning: Canadian stereotypes lie ahead.

Quote:
Originally posted by Michael Griffiths


Anyway, I find this thread's title very misleading. I find it interesting that people are saying Canadians are ignorant, because they are being just as ignorant by tarring all of us with the same brush. This happened at a hockey game, where some of the crowd of 20,000 bood the anthem -- which they should not have done. But please don't assume all Canadians would have done the same thing.
Yeah. Most Canadians are way too polite and self-effacing to ever do something like that. It must just be those obnoxious Quebecois. Maybe they should secede already, eh?

Quote:

Canada would have fully backed this effort if there had been UN security council approval, which we've been saying all along. And that's completely fair. It's not our war. It's America's. I don't know why that's such a difficult concept to grasp. Yes, we, like the rest of the world, will be greatly affected by this war, but it wasn't our choice. But you know what? We will still be there to clean up damage, to aid in humanitarian ways, and even re-construct Iraq.
Has the Canadian government gone on record as saying this? If so, excellent.
__________________

__________________
speedracer is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 09:33 AM   #17
Acrobat
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Montréal, Québec
Posts: 317
Local Time: 09:29 PM
I am a Québécois and I'd like some excuse for this word, obnoxious.

We didn't change the names that include the word 'America', unlike the French fries stuff and I'd like to see if the americans still french kiss...
__________________

__________________
Holy John is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 09:41 AM   #18
Acrobat
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Montréal, Québec
Posts: 317
Local Time: 09:29 PM
But I have to agree that it is a nice scrabble word you used to put a name on us.

But national anthems don't have their place in a sports game. You want to think about something else than your life or than this war, and they put you national anthems...
__________________
Holy John is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 09:44 AM   #19
Rock n' Roll Doggie
ALL ACCESS
 
speedracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 7,573
Local Time: 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Holy John
I am a Québécois and I'd like some excuse for this word, obnoxious.

We didn't change the names that include the word 'America', unlike the French fries stuff and I'd like to see if the americans still french kiss...
As far as I know, most places where I live that serve fried potato strips still call them French fries. Unless you're ordering fish 'n chips. It's too bad they don't serve poutine around here, really.

But in retaliation for the anthem-booing at the Canadiens game, there is a massive Celine Dion CD bonfire going on here. (No, not really.)
__________________
speedracer is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 11:18 AM   #20
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Basstrap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 10,726
Local Time: 06:59 PM
just to make note...last year the US booed our national anthem as well.
not to justify it...just...umm....lets say...hockey fans don't represent the whole population.

It's funny, ya know, how an imaginary border can change so much., My friend just got back from Nashville where he visited his girlfriend. He said it was amazing how different opinions are.
All my friends and pretty much everyone in my city is totally opposed to war. We had a house party last night with about 35 or 40 people my age (21/22) and war came up of course. Everyone just getting really annoyed with the whole thing.

Then my friend went to nashville and he said you'd be lucky if 1 in 6 people opposed the war.

it's just odd.
__________________
Basstrap is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 11:48 AM   #21
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 02:29 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Basstrap

Then my friend went to nashville and he said you'd be lucky if 1 in 6 people opposed the war.

it's just odd.
Yeah, I can believe that. Just after 9-11 and at the onset of the bombing of Afghanistan I was driving through townships near California's Yosemite National Park -- mostly farming/agriculture-based communities. I would venture to say that most homes, businesses and churches had American (U.S.) flags flying and signs posted saying "God Bless America." You're not going to see nearly as much of that where I live, i.e. L.A. In the U.S., the "God and Country" ethos seems to be most prevalent in small communities and the South.
__________________
pub crawler is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 11:52 AM   #22
Blue Crack Addict
 
MissVelvetDress_75's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: basking in my post-concert glow still mesmerized by the orbit of his hips..Also Holding Bono Close as he requested.
Posts: 25,776
Local Time: 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by pub crawler

You're not going to see nearly as much of that where I live, i.e. L.A. In the U.S., the "God and Country" ethos seems to be most prevalent in small communities and the South.
yup, it is all over the place down here.
__________________
MissVelvetDress_75 is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 11:57 AM   #23
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 02:29 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by MissVelvetDress_75


yup, it is all over the place down here.
Oy. Iris, I once belonged to a conservative church where "God and Country" was practically the guiding religious credo. That was before I was enlightened. heheh.





__________________
pub crawler is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 12:01 PM   #24
Blue Crack Addict
 
MissVelvetDress_75's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: basking in my post-concert glow still mesmerized by the orbit of his hips..Also Holding Bono Close as he requested.
Posts: 25,776
Local Time: 04:29 PM
apparently some kind soul in Vegas thinks you need to go back to church.

__________________
MissVelvetDress_75 is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 12:11 PM   #25
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 02:29 PM

LOL.
__________________
pub crawler is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 12:44 PM   #26
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Michael Griffiths's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Playa Del Carmen, Mexico
Posts: 3,925
Local Time: 09:29 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by The Wanderer
um, Michael, you're being a little hyper-sensitive about this, there really was no "blatantly off base remarks about Canadians" in this thread...
Really? So you don't think that lumping the whole country into one box based on a tiny faction isn't a little off base? Three times in this thread (up until my first post), you'll find it happening. The second post started off by saying, "It's not just Candians..." (as opposed to some Canadians), and the next post down includes this:
Quote:
True...its not just Canadians...the entire world is booing us it seems
Again, the same thing, tarring the whole country with the same brush instead referring (either implicitly or explicity) to it as a small group of Canadians at a hockey game. The title "Disrespectful Canadians" (the third time the country is lumped into a box in this thread) doesn't do much for me either. Put it this way, if a small group of Americans had decided to go on record to say that, say, all Chinese were useless people, and you saw a thread talking about how horrible these Americans were, but it was entitled, "Disrespectful Americans," wouldn't you feel a little annoyed by it's gererality? Think about it first, visualize the situation, then answer.
.
Quote:
you assert that you *know* world opinion and make comments about how people are being "spoon fed" information in the US
Hey, it's quite well known, and once you see the difference in media coverage and the difference in information being passed on, it becomes blatently clear. I could give you some more examples, but you probably won't even bother listening. Instead, you'll likely say I'm being self rightous.
Quote:
then you talk about how Canada will of course be involved in "humanitarian ways" and all the efforts to clean up of the "damage" caused by the United States
Once again, please don't put words in my mouth. This is getting ridiculous. I only said what Cretien himself said Canada would do -- that they would be there to help re-construct Iraq and to aid the country. I thought people should know that before they claim how "disrespecful" Canada is being. As for you interpreting me as saying we'll be there to clean up the damage "caused by the United States" -- that only shows a hypersensitivity on your part. I only said that this wasn't Canada's war, that we had no intention of entering it without UN support, and that we'd be there to help once it's all over. Those are all facts stated by the government of Canada. If you want to take my words and fit them to your liking, go right ahead, but you're only aggrivating yourself and disrespecting me. I really can't respect someone who would do that. Once again, for the third time, please don't put words in my mouth.
Quote:
I can't really find any other words to describe that, it reflects a great deal of righteousness in the statements made by the author of the comments
Once again, if that's your interpretation of the facts I've tried my best to lay out, that's really for you to deal with. I just wish you wouldn't resort to personal insults, because, well, I've got feelings too, and I was only stepping in defending the sentiments against Canada while also shedding some light, perhaps, on things some people haven't thought about a great deal, and certainly would not have heard about given they don't get our media. You'd think people would welcome further information, even if it means they end up rejecting it. I only gave them the opportunity to make the choice.
__________________
Michael Griffiths is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 01:28 PM   #27
Kid A
 
The Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Holy Roman Empire
Posts: 5,271
Local Time: 04:29 PM
the 2nd post by womanfish that you quoted states that it's not just Canada where people are upset with the US, but people actually in the US, and talks about specific protesters in Oregon going out of their way to be disrespectful; you cant say Canadians and the world in general overwhelming opose the war in one breath, then say that people shouldnt generalize about Canadian and world sentiment, there is nothing there saying that all canadians and world citizens boo the US national anthem and drag flags around during protests

the thread title is accurate, people who boo the national anthem at a sporting event are being disrespectful, it doesnt say ALL canadians are doing it either, and it's assumed the reader can grasp the notion that the entire Canadian population isnt at that particular hockey game; that being said, if Americans boo the Canadian national anthem they are being disrespectful as well, and it's especially foolish considering most NHL players are Canadian-born (though many now reside in the US), it could happen, if it does I will be the first to criticize

and again, you righteously spout off about how I need to look at "different" media coverage, and you make the assumption that I've never watched or read anything other than US media coverage, which I guess you think is the only excuse for my position I dunno, I dont wanna put words in your mouth! but when people are cryptic with their statements, that's what happens, vagueness leads to people having to draw their own conclusions out of the clues and hints presented

what is it that people didnt get from your media again? I mean, I heard about the coalition criticisms from Tom Daschle and other outspoken Democrats who were given plenty of network time to talk about it, I also read about it on the BBC website and in an Observor article, oh and there were editorials about it in the Washington Post, dont know about other US papers but I would be stunned if it wasnt discussed in the NY Times
__________________
The Wanderer is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 01:30 PM   #28
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Michael Griffiths's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Playa Del Carmen, Mexico
Posts: 3,925
Local Time: 09:29 PM
And here are the up to date figures of Canada's support for the war (if anyone's interested)...

http://www.torontostar.ca/NASApp/cs/...l=968793972154

Canadians back Chrétien on war, poll finds
71% approve of decision to stay out


TIM HARPER
OTTAWA BUREAU CHIEF

OTTAWA—Jean Chrétien's decision to stay out of the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq has met with widespread approval in this country and is backed by a majority of respondents everywhere except Alberta, according to a Star poll.

The poll, conducted for the Star and the Montreal newspaper La Presse by EKOS Research Associates, found 71 per cent of those polled backed the decision by the Liberal government, with 27 per cent registering their disapproval.

Although a clear majority of 60 per cent say they object to the military move by U.S. President George W. Bush, 35 per cent of Canadians back him, support that rose during the week and an indication that a significant number of voters in this country back Washington's move as well as Ottawa's decision to stay apart from it.

Chrétien's Liberal government decided to stay out of the U.S.-led invasion because Washington could not win multilateral authorization for the war at the United Nations. But Canada still has three frigates in the region as part of a war on terrorism, leading some to suggest the government is having it both ways, winning support politically for snubbing the Americans while making some assets available to support the Americans.

Chrétien's move, announced Monday, sparked a week of heated political debate here with the Prime Minister striving to paint his decision as an independent Canadian move while not criticizing Bush.

That was made more difficult with Wednesday's comments by his natural resources minister, Herb Dhaliwal. He said he felt Bush failed as a statesman and let the world down, remarks he later clarified to indicate they were not a personal criticism of the U.S. president or his administration.

The NDP and the Bloc Québécois backed Chrétien, but Canadian Alliance leader Stephen Harper has thrown parliamentary nicety out the window in his attacks on the Liberals, a government he has described as "gutless and juvenile" and one he says has turned its back on Canadian values and traditions.

EKOS interviewed 720 Canadians beginning Monday, after Chrétien made his announcement and ending Thursday evening, before yesterday's massive bombing of Baghdad and other Iraqi cities by the U.S. It says its results are considered accurate to within 3.7 percentage points, 19 times out of 20.

The poll also found almost unprecedented awareness and interest among Canadians in the war and this country's role.

EKOS president Frank Graves said Canadian sympathy for Bush's position rose during the week, likely because people in this country began to believe he might show restraint and try to force mass Iraqi desertions or a quick surgical strike at Saddam Hussein.

Yesterday's strikes on the Iraqi capital may have ended any rebound Bush was receiving in public opinion in this country, Graves said.

Graves also said part of the Canadian strengthening of support for Bush's position may have been a reaction to what voters perceived to have been some "strident antipathy" toward the Americans from Liberals, including Dhaliwal, Mississauga Centre MP Carolyn Parrish who referred to them as "bastards," and the infamous "moron" comment from Chrétien's former communications director, Françoise Ducros.

EKOS found the greatest support for the Liberal position in Quebec, among women, those who are university educated and who described themselves as Canadian nationalists.

Those most fervently opposed to the Chrétien position lived in Alberta, were among the country's most affluent and overwhelmingly are Canadian Alliance and Progressive Conservative supporters.

The polar opposite positions in Alberta and Quebec are most striking, Graves said. He added frustration in Alberta may have repercussions in the future because it seems to be constantly offside on national issues, while anti-American sentiment in Quebec was the strongest EKOS has seen in 10 years.
__________________
Michael Griffiths is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 01:36 PM   #29
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Basstrap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Posts: 10,726
Local Time: 06:59 PM
on a relevant note,
they interviewed three people who moved to canada from the US to gauge their opinion on the war.
They all expressed how moving here impacted their outlook on things. They could now objectively look at the goings on in their country. None of them were for the war.

and this is not me saying this...they said it.
paraphrased..."people in america have a tendency to thing their country can do no wrong"



Just an interesting perspective
__________________
Basstrap is offline  
Old 03-22-2003, 01:44 PM   #30
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
Michael Griffiths's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Playa Del Carmen, Mexico
Posts: 3,925
Local Time: 09:29 PM
Wanderer:

Once again, the word choice invovled was generalizing. I'm not going to beat this argument to death. If you disagree, I can't change your mind. And generalizing about Canadian sentiment in terms of opposing the war is different than generalizing it in terms of booing the US National Anthem, Wanderer. I mean, give me a break on that one. As for the thread title not being specific enough, again, same argument, one more time. It's pointless to rehash.

And I didn't assume that you don't read other sources. I simply said our media is like night and day -- which it is -- and that the stories you get are generally far different than the ones we get.

I was simply comparing CNN to CBC. It's not like I'm saying all your print media is just as bad as CNN. ABC is much better than CNN too, but that, too, is much different than what we tend to get. It's just that many rely on CNN for world matters, and I wouldn't be, that's all.

There was a documentary on the 5th Estate the other night that exposed the innacuracy of the Patriot Missiles shooting down scud missiles from the Gulf War. Many of the American news reporters were claiming direct hits, and this documentary showed they weren't hits at all. It was blatent mis-information. I don't think that documentary is being shown in the States, is it?

By the way, Craig, you're sounding very high and mighty yourself over there Are you okay? You can e-mail me if you ever want to talk. Amanda has my e-mail addy.
__________________

__________________
Michael Griffiths is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:29 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com