Death & Religion - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 02-21-2005, 07:51 PM   #1
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
VertigoGal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: I'm never alone (I'm alone all the time)
Posts: 9,860
Local Time: 05:32 AM
Death & Religion

If religious people truly know where they are going deep down, as they usually claim, why is death viewed as a bad thing? Why do we have threads dedicated to the victims of crimes, of wars, dead soliders? (and this is only hypothetical, I'm not that cold) Why do people cry at funerals? We're all gonna die, right?

And don't say that people cry only because they will miss that person until they meet them again in "Heaven" or wherever, because that wouldn't explain why people shake their heads and say "He/She died too young" and speak of death as if it's unfortunate to the person killed, not just those around him/her.

Is it possible many religious people aren't nearly as secure and completely confident in their beliefs as they'd have us think?

I've been wondering this for a while...if there's a Heaven then dying wouldn't be bad at all, y'know...
__________________

__________________
VertigoGal is offline  
Old 02-21-2005, 07:54 PM   #2
Blue Crack Addict
 
deep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: A far distance down.
Posts: 28,501
Local Time: 02:32 AM
see the movie

The Rapture (1991)
__________________

__________________
deep is offline  
Old 02-21-2005, 08:36 PM   #3
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,697
Local Time: 04:32 AM
We're human and we're selfish. We want our loved ones by our sides.
__________________
BVS is offline  
Old 02-21-2005, 08:40 PM   #4
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 08:32 PM
I think that it is that very fear of death that enforces belief ~ without the guarantee of eternal paradise or damnation many people would just go insane.
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 02-21-2005, 09:47 PM   #5
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Macfistowannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,129
Local Time: 06:32 AM
Re: Death & Religion

Quote:
Originally posted by VertigoGal
If religious people truly know where they are going deep down, as they usually claim, why is death viewed as a bad thing? Why do we have threads dedicated to the victims of crimes, of wars, dead soliders? (and this is only hypothetical, I'm not that cold) Why do people cry at funerals? We're all gonna die, right?
We cry at funerals because we genuinely embraced their presence, and in my case, there is a sense of regret - a wish that I could've reached out more to that person to comfort them and pay them more attention. Dead soldiers and crime victims alike are those who are undeserving of the card they were dealt with. Most of all, because their lives were ended too soon.

Quote:
Originally posted by VertigoGal
And don't say that people cry only because they will miss that person until they meet them again in "Heaven" or wherever, because that wouldn't explain why people shake their heads and say "He/She died too young" and speak of death as if it's unfortunate to the person killed, not just those around him/her.

Is it possible many religious people aren't nearly as secure and completely confident in their beliefs as they'd have us think?
Death is a harsh reality, especially for the living to cope with, religious or not. We need comfort, no matter how steadfast we are in our beliefs.

Quote:
Originally posted by VertigoGal
I've been wondering this for a while...if there's a Heaven then dying wouldn't be bad at all, y'know...
It wouldn't. I love a quote by Martin Luther that goes something like "If people can't laugh in Heaven, I don't want to go there." Heaven is our destiny, and we believe it will have no pain and no hurt. It will be better than Utopia.
__________________
Macfistowannabe is offline  
Old 02-21-2005, 10:02 PM   #6
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Macfistowannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,129
Local Time: 06:32 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
I think that it is that very fear of death that enforces belief ~ without the guarantee of eternal paradise or damnation many people would just go insane.
Cheers to our sanity!
__________________
Macfistowannabe is offline  
Old 02-22-2005, 04:49 AM   #7
War Child
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: uk
Posts: 633
Local Time: 10:32 AM
maybe this will answer some of your questions Vertigo girl

http://www.watchtower.org/library/w/...article_02.htm
__________________
annj is offline  
Old 02-22-2005, 11:18 PM   #8
Refugee
 
thrillme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: <---over that'a way
Posts: 1,947
Local Time: 02:32 AM
With Christianity and Judaism to some degree, death became part of the punishment, a curse for sinning against God. I'm told Jews don't really believe in an after life, (anyone correct me if I'm wrong), but in Christianity, death is just a temporary separation from loved ones. You're sad for that time of separation.

We have emotions, it's natural to feel sad when someone is gone, whether it's death, relocation away from home, that's part of being human, we miss our loved ones.

That's not a lack or insincerity about beliefs, it's more a human reaction. Now if you believe that person will not be in heaven, surely you'll be sad, but you couldn't force that person to believe. If there is no after life, then that's it, you'll never see that person again.

Whatever you believe, death will be a sad thing.
__________________
thrillme is offline  
Old 02-23-2005, 04:08 PM   #9
Blue Crack Addict
 
nbcrusader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,071
Local Time: 02:32 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by thrillme
but in Christianity, death is just a temporary separation from loved ones. You're sad for that time of separation.

Actually, death is only a time of sadness for those left behind. There are no tears or sorrow in heaven, only the joy of standing before God.
__________________
nbcrusader is offline  
Old 02-23-2005, 08:30 PM   #10
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,499
Local Time: 05:32 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


Actually, death is only a time of sadness for those left behind. There are no tears or sorrow in heaven, only the joy of standing before God.

what if you miss those you've left behind? what if you'd rather be with a beloved spouse, or child, or parent, than with God?
__________________
Irvine511 is offline  
Old 02-23-2005, 08:32 PM   #11
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
VertigoGal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: I'm never alone (I'm alone all the time)
Posts: 9,860
Local Time: 05:32 AM
Thanks for your replies guys...

I'm sorry to start such a basic "why are we here" thread, I'm not an expert at the ol' mathematically proving we don't exist or whatever...I'm just really confused.

Thanks annj, that was interesting to read, an interesting viewpoint at least.

I hear what a lot of you are saying, that people are sad when a loved one dies, because they will be separated from them till they theoretically meet up again in this "Heaven." That's what most Christians (and other religious people who believe in an afterlife) I've asked this have told me.

But this doesn't explain why death is seen as cruel to the actual victim, why it's sad when a 16 year old dies in a car wreck---don't they just get to skip some of the hardships of life and get straight to the Heaven bit? How does someone die "too young"? Aren't kids who die lucky? Even if they miss out on some of the joy of life, as well as the hardships, isn't Heaven sort of a utopia?

If there's such a Heaven, why are any of in the least bit scared of dying? Or at least, why do we want to live a long life? Basically, I think the fact that Christians wear seatbelts and go on diets shows that most people aren't as content with where they're going as they claim...
__________________
VertigoGal is offline  
Old 02-23-2005, 08:51 PM   #12
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
VertigoGal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: I'm never alone (I'm alone all the time)
Posts: 9,860
Local Time: 05:32 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511



what if you miss those you've left behind? what if you'd rather be with a beloved spouse, or child, or parent, than with God?
Yeah, exactly, I can't imagine a Heaven that exists in a sort of a conscious state...where we're still the same person with the same mind, just in another "place"...how could Heaven be painless and full of only joy, if you are essentially the same person? Wouldn't you miss your loved ones? Wouldn't you get bored of basking in the light of God day in and day out?
__________________
VertigoGal is offline  
Old 02-24-2005, 12:44 AM   #13
Refugee
 
thrillme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: <---over that'a way
Posts: 1,947
Local Time: 02:32 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


Actually, death is only a time of sadness for those left behind. There are no tears or sorrow in heaven, only the joy of standing before God.
Ah thanks for clarifying that. That's what I meant, sometimes I think faster than I type.
__________________
thrillme is offline  
Old 02-24-2005, 01:17 AM   #14
Refugee
 
thrillme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: <---over that'a way
Posts: 1,947
Local Time: 02:32 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by VertigoGal
Thanks for your replies guys...

I'm sorry to start such a basic "why are we here" thread, I'm not an expert at the ol' mathematically proving we don't exist or whatever...I'm just really confused.

Thanks annj, that was interesting to read, an interesting viewpoint at least.

I hear what a lot of you are saying, that people are sad when a loved one dies, because they will be separated from them till they theoretically meet up again in this "Heaven." That's what most Christians (and other religious people who believe in an afterlife) I've asked this have told me.

But this doesn't explain why death is seen as cruel to the actual victim, why it's sad when a 16 year old dies in a car wreck---don't they just get to skip some of the hardships of life and get straight to the Heaven bit? How does someone die "too young"? Aren't kids who die lucky? Even if they miss out on some of the joy of life, as well as the hardships, isn't Heaven sort of a utopia?

If there's such a Heaven, why are any of in the least bit scared of dying? Or at least, why do we want to live a long life? Basically, I think the fact that Christians wear seatbelts and go on diets shows that most people aren't as content with where they're going as they claim...
Actually the desire to live forever, according the Bible, is ingrained in us. That was the intention. This could veer off into more deeper questions, deeper discussion, but it's nothing to do with lack of confidence in what Christians believe.

Also, many areas consider it a violation of law, to not use a seatbelt.

Bible also says the body is a temple, something to be taken care of, not to be abused. Eating a healthy diet is acceptable.

There are things in this life, that won't happen in Heaven, so perhaps when people say someone was too young, it's that they didn't experience certain things, good things in this life, love, friendship...seeing a certain band live.

There's nothing wrong with enjoying this life being a Christian, it's okay, but at the same time, you realise it could all end.

Guess it depends on the religion though.
__________________
thrillme is offline  
Old 02-24-2005, 05:33 AM   #15
Blue Crack Addict
 
nbcrusader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Southern California
Posts: 22,071
Local Time: 02:32 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511



what if you miss those you've left behind? what if you'd rather be with a beloved spouse, or child, or parent, than with God?
Think of it as a scale. You'd rather be with friends instead of strangers. You'd rather be with loved ones instead of friends.

I would suggest that the joy of being in the Lord's presense would surpass any notion of missing those left behind.

I acknowledge that it is difficult to grasp while on earth (especially the "won't you get bored after a while" questions). But that is the glory of heaven - far beyond what we can comprehend here on earth.
__________________

__________________
nbcrusader is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com