New Album Ideas

[LJT]

If we all liked the same things, that'd be boring

I agree, and I'd also like to add that Pop is the greatest album ever, and that's a fact

Sorry second greatest

U2s best rock album though

But Achtung rules supreme

Especially belting out the Fly as you get out of school...nothing beats that...though i have taken to shouting MOFO in empty rooms for echo effect...its very very cool

 

[Earnie Shavers]

For arguments sake...what if its the other way around? As in those who really like those two albums do see what you believe to be missing from ATYCLB and HTDAAB but you are the one not getting it this time around?

Well, that all depends on what they see in albums previous and whether that is there for these ones or not, and what I see in albums previous and whether that is there for these ones or not. Of course we may have always seen different things, and that's why there's a different appreciation and acceptance. I'm not the greatest with words, so it's hard to describe, but the simplest way I can say it is I see a significant drop in songwriting, soul, patience, delicacy, detail, passion and most importantly spirit from a song like, say, Running To Stand Still to a song like Miracle Drug. Now someone may turn around and say "what are you talking about! They sound like they could be off the same album!" and I'll roll my eyes and say "See? Looking at their songs in different ways." Accurately describing the spirit of a U2 song in a few sentences is damn hard, and I'd suggest it would take half a book to even come close, but feeling it is easy. Some people will feel it with anything by U2 that sounds familiar, has that magic formula that is the sound of those 4 playing together. That is true to a degree for me, no matter how much of a weak song I think it is, when I'm sitting here at work and hear Sometimes cut through on the radio it's like a nice little relief runs through me - the sound of U2, that distinctive voice, guitar etc it's beautiful and calming no matter what the song. But there is something else that is really hard to summarise in words. People in here are desperately trying to put their finger on it. Is it that they're trying too hard to be commercial? Is it their age? Is it the production? Is it Bono's multiple jobs? Is it Larry demanding safety? A combination? What is it? Plenty of people feel that despite the high technical quality that they can still churn out like noone else, that something has left the building and U2 are maybe worse off for it. Clearly that's not everyone though, and that's because different people look for different things in the music to begin with.

 

[AtomicBono]

Sorry second greatest

U2s best rock album though

But Achtung rules supreme

Especially belting out the Fly as you get out of school...nothing beats that...though i have taken to shouting MOFO in empty rooms for echo effect...its very very cool

Well I could almost agree with you, Achtung is very much the brilliant record... and The Fly and One are both in my top 5 but for me it's all about POP... however I see no point in arguing about Pop and Achtung since they're both almost-equally brilliant, as long as we both agree they rule then...

Back to arguing. Um, whatever Earnie says is probably right. Even though I love How to Dismantle.

 

[RademR]

I think at this stage in their careers, I'm afraid u2 are on cruise control. Not meaning that's bad, I love HTDAAB and it's in my top 4 of u2 albums.

I just don't think we're going to see any more experimentation like in the 90s for sure.

u2 want to be the biggest band in the world, and they have to make radio friendly poppish tunes to get that and sell records.

So don't expect a lot more "Gone's" in the future, especially after his comments toward POP in that recent article with that Chicago journalist.

 

[RademR]

either way, I can't wait til they go back to the studio. the rumors, leaks, and all that good stuff leading to this album was a great time on interference.

 

[AtomicBono]

So don't expect a lot more "Gone's" in the future, especially after his comments toward POP in that recent article with that Chicago journalist.

Do you happen to have a link to that article?

"The songs on that record are great songs, and we, you know, still love that album, but it could've been a better record had we had a bit more time to do what we normally do . . . which is rearrange certain songs and rework them to get the best version of them. " -Edge on POP from the Dave Fanning interview

I'm guessing the mixes on the Best Of indicated where the songs may have ended up with more time...still brilliant songs, but not nearly as good as the album versions as far as I'm concerned. So it's true, U2 may not be willing to take risks again...but I do think that whatever they do it will be somewhat of a new direction, and I have faith that it will be good. Will it top Pop and Achtung? Probably not, not for me, but I don't NEED to top them. I just want a good record, which U2 has consistantly delivered.

 

[U2DMfan]

I like the idea of going to a location to try and create some vibes.
Miami and Berlin worked pretty well, I think.

This time, get Brian Eno and go to Africa for 2 months
Let Eno work with tribal music, and try to incoporate it into U2's sound. Have choirs and African drum beats, chanting, along with Eno's moog synthesizer, Edge playing a heavily distorted Wah, and Adam playing driving beats like the 80's and Larry bang on the marching drum snare.

U2 go Jungle

It might happen.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

I definitely think they should go somewhere for a month and make sure Bono stays there for the whole time (non stop). Not just for the desperately needed inspirations sake, but also simply for continuity.

 

[zwervers2]

You are asking too much, at this stage of their career Bono and the band have their carpet slippers on and are easing down on the gas pedal slowly drifting towards retirement.zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

retirement

 

[LemonAid]

I don't really care what the sound it, it's all in the spirit of it to me.

The main problem I hear in the last two albums is that they are trying too hard to be U2 (in the biggest boldest brightest writing). This whole 'biggest band in the world' thing, and their hunger for commercial success - particularly in the US - after Pop is all tied in with that. It's kind of like they are confused about their own identity, they are trying too hard to be what they think 'we' (not just hardcore fans in here, but anyone with ears who has heard of U2) want them to be.

The truth is U2 have always been at their best when they are facing their biggest musical and creative challenges. That's where this God walking into the room thing comes in. You don't really hear much of that on these last albums.

Edge is an amazing guitar player. I'm sure the guy could knock us all up enough riffs for an album of Vertigo's and Elevation's in a week. But do you want that? Or do you want him to try and relate an emotion, a feeling, through his guitar. Do you want his guitar to essentially pick up the pieces that Bono can't describe in words? Which do you want his challenge to be: Edge! Give us a killer riff for the radio! - or - Edge! Create a guitar part that winds through a song and tells a story in such a magical way that that song really doesn't even need lyrics for us to feel what it is about. I want the second one.

Bono is a great, great meaningful songwriter and lyricist and singer. I'm sure the guy could knock out a dozen Original of the Species and Miracle Drugs in a week. Is that what you want? Those screaming for the sake of screaming songs, or do you want him to whisper and croak when it's needed, stretch that voice out when it's needed, soar when it's needed. I love the howling on Love and Peace, as it's pretty much the only song on the album that sounds like it has a bit of Bono's real emotions behind it - something that lacks from 7 or 8 of the songs on that album, but previously never, ever did. Do you want him to be that direct with his lyrics? I think it's not natural to him and thats why they've suffered so much. Do you not understand what he's talking about in songs like One, that still have all the poetry, but are as direct as they come? Or do you want more of the moles digging in holes and the sniffing of babies heads?

Do you want them to set themselves musical challenges, essentially trying very hard to convey a thought and feeling into music, or do you want them to be trying really hard to write hit songs?

If U2 were to really show that they had balls now, they would take the risk of NOT being the biggest band in the world. They are the biggest band of the last 25 years. Others have come and gone in the short term, but there's no denying that U2 are the biggest overall in that period. They did that naturally. I don't know why they feel they have to force it now. I don't know why they have such a confidence problem now that they are afraid to just release what comes naturally. It has never failed them.

I want them to go into that studio and let it all fall out of their heads straight into the album. I don't want Larry to force them into restructuring everything so that it will be played on the radio and sell. I'd rather a lead single like Stateless - which would sell 0 copies and play 0 times on the radio - then another tacky Vertigo. They would STILL be the biggest band of the past 25 years if they did that and STILL sell out the following arena tour, but I suspect we'd hear their real spirit back again and get a far more honest, intelligent and emotional album.

I don't believe for a second that they don't have it in them anymore. Bono probably has more interesting stories to tell then ever before - for example, did we really need to just get his interview with Oprah Winfrey set to music on Crumbs, or would you like him to REALLY get angry and put to music the racism he feels is behind the lack of response to his African challenge? I doubt Edge will ever get tired or bored with tinkering with that guitar and making it speak in new ways. Adam and Larry are technically getting better and better with age.

Get back to writing and recording from the heart, not the head.

PERFECT!!!!!

 

[LemonAid]

that literally was the perfect post Earnie...i read thru this site everyday...multiple times a day and the writing is always passionate and insightful by you guys and girls.....thats why i only feel compelled to write something myself when the frustration just BOILS over completely, and its usually because of the, yes, U2-Lite of the last few years....

...i wont even go into my own opinions now because Earnie has written them more perfectly than i ever could. So much for 'not being great with words' eh?

....the only sad thing is how true every word is that he said...

....but the uplifting thing is his analysis of U2's ability to easily outdo the music they have done for the past 5 years....and I think everybody here at this forum will agree, they can EASILY do better.....

...I dont think there has ever been a band that i could confidently say has the ability in their mid-forties to still, EASILY create a seminal album.....

obviously I could wander on, but it'd just take away from my point....which was 'Fantastic post Earnie'......if only we could send it to the boys....

 

[zwervers2]

I don't really care what the sound it, it's all in the spirit of it to me.

The main problem I hear in the last two albums is that they are trying too hard to be U2 (in the biggest boldest brightest writing). This whole 'biggest band in the world' thing, and their hunger for commercial success - particularly in the US - after Pop is all tied in with that. It's kind of like they are confused about their own identity, they are trying too hard to be what they think 'we' (not just hardcore fans in here, but anyone with ears who has heard of U2) want them to be.

The truth is U2 have always been at their best when they are facing their biggest musical and creative challenges. That's where this God walking into the room thing comes in. You don't really hear much of that on these last albums.

Edge is an amazing guitar player. I'm sure the guy could knock us all up enough riffs for an album of Vertigo's and Elevation's in a week. But do you want that? Or do you want him to try and relate an emotion, a feeling, through his guitar. Do you want his guitar to essentially pick up the pieces that Bono can't describe in words? Which do you want his challenge to be: Edge! Give us a killer riff for the radio! - or - Edge! Create a guitar part that winds through a song and tells a story in such a magical way that that song really doesn't even need lyrics for us to feel what it is about. I want the second one.

Bono is a great, great meaningful songwriter and lyricist and singer. I'm sure the guy could knock out a dozen Original of the Species and Miracle Drugs in a week. Is that what you want? Those screaming for the sake of screaming songs, or do you want him to whisper and croak when it's needed, stretch that voice out when it's needed, soar when it's needed. I love the howling on Love and Peace, as it's pretty much the only song on the album that sounds like it has a bit of Bono's real emotions behind it - something that lacks from 7 or 8 of the songs on that album, but previously never, ever did. Do you want him to be that direct with his lyrics? I think it's not natural to him and thats why they've suffered so much. Do you not understand what he's talking about in songs like One, that still have all the poetry, but are as direct as they come? Or do you want more of the moles digging in holes and the sniffing of babies heads?

Do you want them to set themselves musical challenges, essentially trying very hard to convey a thought and feeling into music, or do you want them to be trying really hard to write hit songs?

If U2 were to really show that they had balls now, they would take the risk of NOT being the biggest band in the world. They are the biggest band of the last 25 years. Others have come and gone in the short term, but there's no denying that U2 are the biggest overall in that period. They did that naturally. I don't know why they feel they have to force it now. I don't know why they have such a confidence problem now that they are afraid to just release what comes naturally. It has never failed them.

I want them to go into that studio and let it all fall out of their heads straight into the album. I don't want Larry to force them into restructuring everything so that it will be played on the radio and sell. I'd rather a lead single like Stateless - which would sell 0 copies and play 0 times on the radio - then another tacky Vertigo. They would STILL be the biggest band of the past 25 years if they did that and STILL sell out the following arena tour, but I suspect we'd hear their real spirit back again and get a far more honest, intelligent and emotional album.

I don't believe for a second that they don't have it in them anymore. Bono probably has more interesting stories to tell then ever before - for example, did we really need to just get his interview with Oprah Winfrey set to music on Crumbs, or would you like him to REALLY get angry and put to music the racism he feels is behind the lack of response to his African challenge? I doubt Edge will ever get tired or bored with tinkering with that guitar and making it speak in new ways. Adam and Larry are technically getting better and better with age.

Get back to writing and recording from the heart, not the head.

Stop whining!!!!!!!!! You are not a U2fan, EVERYBODY loves VERTIGO esp twice!!!!...If you don't like it don't buy their albums!!

In all honesty. This is a top 10 post on this forum thus far..
Comes very close to how I feel about the band right now.
Excellent work there Earnie!!!!

 

[RademR]

Stop whining!!!!!!!!! You are not a U2fan, EVERYBODY loves VERTIGO esp twice!!!!...If you don't like it don't buy their albums!!

that made me laugh (in a good way).

Great post, Earnie, the last line is great.

Also, about the rhytm section. Larry is still there as always, but Adam has become a truly great bass player.

 

[U2girl]

I half to agree somewhat with U2girl.

The biggest problem I see with the anti-2000's U2 fans is that you/they simply don't like the last two albums. If you strip away all the other bullshit everyone on these boards used to trash or even defend the band, it all comes down to one question. Do you like the music? Don't get me wrong, it works both ways. Many people here, and I'm not naming names, just really like the new album and automatically think anyone who doesn't like it is a troll or fucking moron or whatever they want to call them. Sometimes, people are fucking morons, and then I'd be the first to say so.

However, what I started to say was that some people simply don't like the new album, but it's wrong to just say that U2 don't give a shit about the music anymore or the fans or whatever. That right there is just ignorance. For example, I don't really like October or War. I do however recognize that they are great albums worthy of any praise they get from people here, I just don't really like them. So the truth is, HTDAAB and ATYCLB ARE great albums. If someone doesn't like them that's just fine, but it's ignorant to say that it's U2-lite. Because what the fuck does that even mean.

That said, it does work both ways, and I'm not an advocate of blind praise, as I also try to view anything with a critical eye. I can see that ATYCLB and HTDAAB have flaws. I can also see that War, Achtung Baby, and POP all also have their flaws. But they are all still strong albums, and albums that U2 poured their heart and soul into making.


Well, I don't know how coherent that came out, but I hope my point was made.

 

[U2girl]

Finnaly someone that gets my point!! Thank you, dude!
What has people against ATYCLB and mainly HTDAAB??? Can't you understand that artists are not always the same? Do you know the word "diversification"?
I think that you didn't realy see that there's a phase in an artist's career that he wants to get back to its origins and make a reunion of everything he has learned since its beggining... That's what is happening to U2 now... If you can't accept it... shit happens! That's why you don't understand a bit of musical industry and the thing about create music...
I like the way U2 is flowing and in my point of view that's why HTDAAB is its best album...
I accept that there's people that don't like the album, what I do not accept is the censure to the others tastes... And forums to bash this or that... that's a revelation of lack of musical culture.

Great posts both of you.

 

[U2girl]

You're just gonna defend U2-Lite to the bitter end aren't you?

Earnie is right. Perhaps it's more difficult to see when just focusing on HTDAAB, but if you take the concepts he(and others, including myself) are talking about and apply them in the context of other albums or songs, it becomes glaringly obvious.

I'll give you one example. On the behind-the-scenes thing on the DVD that came with limited edition copies of HTDAAB, there is a clip of Lillywhite talking about Sometimes. He says, very directly, that he first heard the version of the song where the chorus was soley the line 'sometimes you can't make it on your own'. And that he told the band that that wasn't a chorus, that it was the payoff of a chorus. That it needed something before it. And that Bono knocked out 'it's you when I look in the mirror/it's you when I don't pick up the phone' in five minutes. FIVE MINUTES. I'm sure it wasn't easy for Bono to write the rest of the song, given the subject matter, but that little bit of it? That's EASY for Bono, methinks. And Lillywhite said that, because he was speaking on behalf of the ADD American music listening public(and I AM American so don't get pissed off at me for saying that). So yes, I think U2 took Lillywhite's advice and took the easy way out and made the song more radio-friendly.

But what if a similar scenario unfolded during the recording of 'One'? What if a producer said, 'we get to carry each other, one' isn't a chorus, that it needed something before it? And what if Bono had obliged and written some sing-songy chorus for it? I can see it now...

we walk together strong
son, daughter, father and mother
we walk together strong
and we get to carry each other
one
(or some equally cheesy/obnoxious block of chorus lyric like that)

They add some crap sing-song-y chorus like that to 'One' and the song never becomes what it is. It wouldn't be nearly as good.

See what I'm saying?

You're just gonna moan about people who like the last albums won't you?
Some people - I think you know who you are - need to lay off the "we will tell it like it is and only we know what U2 should do" shtick.

I agree with Lillywhite, I think that line alone doesn't make a good chorus. Unlike the falsetto one that works great.

 

[U2girl]

bravo!

Umm, I don't mention the sound at all from that point on....

Edge's playing and Bono's singing you so strongly despised in your post I quoted aren't a part of the U2 sound on Bomb?

 

[Earnie Shavers]

When I said "I don't care what sound" I meant ; a lot of the posts in here are things like "I want another all out rocker like Achtung" etc. I don't mind whether it's sonicaly experimental (Zooropa, Pop) a rocker (Achtung) or the much promised sound of four guys playing in a room etc. That's what I meant by sound. If they hand me the tribal African thing suggested above, that's cool. Don't mind.

The Edge/Bono comments aren't about sound. I would like Edge to be let loose again, the last two albums ARE very restrained from The Edge. And I thought that in the 80's Bono found his voice, in the 90's Bono learned how to use it to it's best effect (know when to whisper, when to scream, when to croak and strain etc) and now in the 00's he seems to have forgotten all that. His voice and more particularly his writing are far weaker on the last two albums, I think few would argue that (I'm not saying bad, just far weaker).

 

[LJT]

Well from the live recordings Bono's voice is at its best in my opinion since 93...on the album not so that i will agree on but as people have already said thats probably because his voice was strained after so many takes on the songs...

hmm songwriting wise? i think One Step Closer, Fast Cars and others like Mercy and Smile are brilliant..Sometimes i think is lyrically great too just due to the openess of the song...and Man and a Woman..granted the others songs are not up to the standard he has done in the past but i don't think that is because he has lost his touch or anything i think its rather he was trying to get some effect but didn't quite work out for him........someone who writes something of lyrical genius like Acrobat, Bad, Wake Up Dead Man just doesnt lose such a gift if his gift had gone he would be writing very pretty lyrics but they would have no meaning eg 'the towers hovered in the clouds, hiding his face like a shrowd'....bad example i know but that is meaningless fluff....i would feel worse if he was writing lyrics which meant nothing to him....

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Yeah, I don't mean Bono's voice is shot these days or anything. You're right, live he sounds brilliant at the moment. In some parts on the album it sounds bad - "The songs/I've had" on Miracle Drug sound like a dog barking, on Original "Everywhere.." it sounds so thin. And there are parts on the album where it sounds bad, but aren't necessarily his fault. For example, they've doubled up his voice on many, many songs before, and it sounds great, but on All Because Of You it sounds awful and that's all in the production/mix. I can't stand the first couple of minutes of that song, partly because of the vocal, but looooove the last minute from Bono's "Heeeeeyaaaaah's" on. I actually skip the whole song to that part. But ANYWAY what I mean about his singing on the album is that he doesn't use any of the finesse touches that bring an emotion out well, rather he just goes for the punch from the beginning. Miracle Drug would be way better if it built, rather than just him belting that at full voice from the start. Just a personal observation, but I thought Bono was always excellent at knowing that if you just hit that one note at the right time with the right emphasis, it gives far more of an emotional feel to a song then screaming your way through the whole thing - the first mistake of many Bono imitators. It's that combined with the way the band are doing the same thing (going for !bang! right from the start), and their massive rush in these songs to get to the hook everytime (particularly Miracle Drug and Original where you feel like you are listening to an edit it gets there so quickly) that make me label the songs as too over eager to please, and not sounding 'natural'.

But, they are pop songs. There's a difference between pop songs and songs that use pop sensibilities. As others have said, U2 have always used pop sensibilities, but these are out and out pop songs. There's a difference, and you'll realise that in 15 years when people are still talking about when they were first slapped in the face by the sound of The Fly cutting through the radio, but no-one will talk about Vertigo like that. Or when people are still disecting the story told in Stay, but not the one in Original. Or when people are still talking of the chills they get from Bono's quiet falsetto in Running To Stand Still, but not any feeling received from his screaming through Miracle Drug. Pop songs are pop songs.

 

[LMP]

That Africa idea would be great

U2 doing their own kind of Graceland would be very cool and interesting

 

[LJT]

To Earnie

Right i can see what you mean in how Miracle Drug is sung or Vertigo...but i think some of the other songs are sung excellently like Man and a Woman, Love and Peace (live again it sounds brilliant) One Step Closer...i know your not a fan of Sometimes but to me that is also sung brilliantly...it alternates between the softer singing verse wise then the falsetto of the chorus and lastly the full on operaticness (im making up words here ) of the final segment...I honestly believe that these songs will become known as U2s hidden gems (along with Fast Cars)

I'm just hoping if a new album is due soon then Mercy will be on it.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Yes, I love the way he sings on Love & Peace. LOVE it.

 

[namkcuR]

Yes, I love the way he sings on Love & Peace. LOVE it.

LAPOE has got to be the best song on the record, imo.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Without a doubt. It stands out quite seperately in many ways, and that song and vibe is what I wish the whole album was built around. Open with that and then flow through 10 other tracks with a theme loosely based around the state of the world today, but with far more thoughtful and intelligent writing. Bono, himself, is actually in one of the more unique and interesting positions anyone has been in in recent history. I want to hear about that, not in the way he tells it on Oprah or in Time Magazine in snappy soundbites for Middle America to remember, but the way he thinks about it all when he's alone in the middle of the night. I want all the anger and hate and confusion and frustration that the world is feeling to be heard in Edge's guitar. I want the pain Bono hears coming from Africa to be translated to us via Edge's guitar. To say that the inspiration might not be there anymore because they're settling with age and kids is crazy. Bono should, really, be overflowing. I doubt the Edge will ever stop being inspired by that instrument and what it can possibly do.

I do truly believe that if they take the time and have the balls, that illusive third masterpiece could be in there.

 

[RademR]

well unlike many others on this forum, I have enjoyed every u2 album and will go as far to say as I LOVE every one of them (except maybe "October")

So I know u2 will do a record I enjoy a lot. But will they make another masterpiece like Earnie mentioned?

Let's see.

 

[AtomicBono]

well unlike many others on this forum, I have enjoyed every u2 album and will go as far to say as I LOVE every one of them (except maybe "October")

So I know u2 will do a record I enjoy a lot. But will they make another masterpiece like Earnie mentioned?

Let's see.

You're not alone, I love every U2 record

I think Pop is the illusive third masterpiece but the world is probably against me on that one... I really do think U2 has it in them to create another masterpiece. If Mercy is any inidication...

and I agree with everyone who says that Love and Peace or Else rules, because it does, awesomeness from beginning to end.

 

[LJT]

hmm just wondering what everyone would think if U2 did a more openly Irish influenced album next time round? As long as they avoided the dreaded trap of cheesiness...hmm maybe it could be along the lines of Tomorrow on October?

Good Irish music can be very ambient...so what be everyones thoughts at that? I've just been thinking its bound to happen at some point.....

 

[RademR]

interesting idea....will never happen because it won't sell records like HTDAAB or ATYCLB.

 

[AtomicBono]

It would be interesting certainly, could be good...I love Tomorrow Whatever U2 does I'm sure it will be great, but it would be nice if it was different. An Irish-influenced album would certainly be different. Of course I lean more toward the industrial techno dance influences of the 90's, but I guess if they went back to that it wouldn't be DIFFERENT. They need to start a new path...