HTDAAB...lame duck?

[Snowlock]

If its their REAL opinion then .... Y E S.

Yeah, I'm looking for quotes for you, but they considered this album as at the least an uncompleted experiment and they definately were't satisfied with it. Evidence of this is the single versions of Please, LNOE, and IGWSHA. They attempted to rework even more songs with the 90's Best Of with Disco, SATS, & Gone. Plus Larry is rumored to be reworking Pop as a side project. Certainly if they were satisfied with this album, all of the reworking of songs wouldn't have occured.

 

[bathiu]

Ranking means nothing. Didn't say it didn't gross money. I said it didn't make money. The cost of the tour wasn't recovered by the box office.

...and I didn't say your post is BS, but now I see I should've said that...
You might have a better picture outside of the POPera bashing bandwagon, you know...

http://www.u2world.com/news/article.php3?id_article=306

U2 $138.5mln
Rolling Stones $89.4mln
Micheal Jackson $83.5mln

...let's see... the cost of one show $200,000... PopMart had 95 shows... that's 19,000,000... 138,5mln-19mln is 119,5mln$$$...
hmm, still #1...

Any questions?

 

[AtomicBono]

Come on, let's please not turn this into another POP debate...

Pop rules, that's all you guys need to know. The band feels it was unfinished but that it contained some of their best songs. Bono has been cited as saying Please is one of the best songs they've ever written (and he's damn right). I think a lot of U2's comments about Pop stem from the fact that the album didn't do nearly as well as they would have liked...had it been a success you would have heard Bomb-esque comments like "possibly our best album" "as good as Achtung Baby" ect.

POP life!!!!!!

 

[yimou]

Yeah, I'm looking for quotes for you, but they considered this album as at the least an uncompleted experiment and they definately were't satisfied with it. Evidence of this is the single versions of Please, LNOE, and IGWSHA. They attempted to rework even more songs with the 90's Best Of with Disco, SATS, & Gone. Plus Larry is rumored to be reworking Pop as a side project. Certainly if they were satisfied with this album, all of the reworking of songs wouldn't have occured.

The fact that they still want to work on the songs just show how much they love them. Who would spend time fixing an old album unless they really loved those songs ???.. The album might have failed in some peoples opinion, but its far from being a weak album. The album cover should have been a photo of a pair of balls, because thats exactly what it took from U2 to release that album.

Anyway i think its time i explained what i meant with my orginal post. I meant that U2 should release something that have a pair of balls attached to it again. I love HTDAAB and i wouldn´t mind another "bomb" to hit the shelves but i hope for something different. Our opinions are not that far apart Snowlock,,

 

[LeafsNation]

Yeah, but we weren't talking about album sales, we're talking about singles and singles is a market (at least the Billboard Hot 100) that is a reflection of young peoples' tastes. Obviously rock does well in album sales because U2 sold 2.7 million. I was trying to explain why high album sales didn't correspond to high single sales.

I certainly hope rock is not going anywhere. I have no idea what I'd listen to if it did. But just like the late 70's when music was dominated by disco, we're in a period where Rock is over shadowed by R&B.

I don't think that singles always reflect what young people listen to, though. Floyd, Zeppelin, AC/DC, the Clash, Metallica, the Ramones etc....most of their classics never hit the singles charts, but were very important to youth. I know a lot of my young cousins are listening to classic rock (even the old AC/Dc Zep shirts have become sort of a cool thing in their circles), and a lot are into the "pop" punk. Pop has always been singles driven, but I'm not so sure that rock...at least the good stuff (unless you're tallking about the more lamo stuff like Styx, Journey, Boston etc.)
...has ever really been "singles driven".

 

[TheFlyOnTheWall]

ATYCLB

Now that's what I call a good album!

 

[Snowlock]

...and I didn't say your post is BS, but now I see I should've said that...
You might have a better picture outside of the POPera bashing bandwagon, you know...

http://www.u2world.com/news/article.php3?id_article=306

U2 $138.5mln
Rolling Stones $89.4mln
Micheal Jackson $83.5mln

...let's see... the cost of one show $200,000... PopMart had 95 shows... that's 19,000,000... 138,5mln-19mln is 119,5mln$$$...
hmm, still #1...

Any questions?

The link you provide itself says "top grossing". I'm not arguing that. As to the Pop Era bashing, that's utter nonsense. I'm not bashing any of their albums. I'm relating common perceptions.

And yeah, I have a question, why so quick to get offended? Read with your eyes, not your emotions. From Wikipedia Encyclopidea:

"Pop and Popmart (1996 – 1998)
With the "Popmart Tour", U2, once again continued the "Zoo TV" theme of decadence. The show hit the road in April, 1997, the set included a 100-foot tall golden yellow arch, a large 150 foot long video screen, and a 35 foot tall mirrorball lemon. It was to be U2s most colourful show to date. The "Popmart tour" was the second-highest grossing tour of 1997 (behind the Rolling Stone's Bridges to Babylon Tour) with revenues of just under $80 million, but it cost more than $100 million to produce."

You can debate all you want. But it is a fact, how Pop did over all and even what the band thinks of it. If you like it best, good for you. If you hate it, big deal. I really don't care much either way so I don't know what you are getting so mad about.

 

[Snowlock]

I don't think that singles always reflect what young people listen to, though. Floyd, Zeppelin, AC/DC, the Clash, Metallica, the Ramones etc....most of their classics never hit the singles charts, but were very important to youth. I know a lot of my young cousins are listening to classic rock (even the old AC/Dc Zep shirts have become sort of a cool thing in their circles), and a lot are into the "pop" punk. Pop has always been singles driven, but I'm not so sure that rock...at least the good stuff (unless you're tallking about the more lamo stuff like Styx, Journey, Boston etc.)
...has ever really been "singles driven".

Well, that really doesn't prove much though. I agree with what your saying as to Zep especially; though the others were pretty singles driven bands... Thunderstruck, Back in Black, Shook Me All Night Long, Wish You Were Here, Another Brick In The Wall, Rock The Casbah and there's like 15 Metallica singles.

But anyway that's besides the point. Point is just because kids listen to other things besides singles doesn't mean that the singles market isn't dominated by kids.

 

[Snowlock]

The fact that they still want to work on the songs just show how much they love them. Who would spend time fixing an old album unless they really loved those songs ???.. The album might have failed in some peoples opinion, but its far from being a weak album. The album cover should have been a photo of a pair of balls, because thats exactly what it took from U2 to release that album.

Anyway i think its time i explained what i meant with my orginal post. I meant that U2 should release something that have a pair of balls attached to it again. I love HTDAAB and i wouldn´t mind another "bomb" to hit the shelves but i hope for something different. Our opinions are not that far apart Snowlock,,

Well, if they loved them, why not play them live? To your other point, perfectionists would spend time fixing old songs though. And U2 are definately that. And I never said it was a weak album. I said it is considered the weakest of their albums since October. To me that's like putting Superman and the Hulk next to one another and saying Superman is the weaker of the two. Doesn't mean he's weak overall, just not as strong as the other.

I would say releasing Pop took far less balls than Atomic Bomb. When Pop was released, techno dance music was king; what with the Chemical Bros, and that goofy "Firestarter" band, Garbage and others. Edge said the album had no identity, that it was designed to appeal to everyone. Atomic Bomb to me is saying "Fuck off, we'll play what we want to play" and that took the most guts of all.

 

[marik]

Garbage= techno ??????

 

[yimou]

Atomic Bomb to me is saying "Fuck off, we'll play what we want to play" and that took the most guts of all.

Well good for U2. I dont expect them to listen to us crazy forum people when they are planning a new album. They should play whatever they want, but i dont see any balls in HTDAAB and thats not the point. HTDAAB is great so no problems there. Its all down to personal preferences and i happen to like a few extra blips here and there in my music. I never meant to start a POP discussion but just said that i hoped for a more out there album the next time. And POP is the best example of something the casual fans didn´t appreciate.

Vertigo = Balls ???? Give me a break.

Mofo = HUGE balls

Do you understand what i mean now ??. I am not saying anything negative but just posting my own opinion. The balls part is again my opinion.

 

[bsp77]

HTDAAB has absolutely no fucking balls at all. It is a pussy of an album. They took no risks.

But I really like it.

 

[bsp77]

I would have to say that Coldplays latest album deserves to sell more than HTDAAB and ATYCLB as its a better album. Coldplays latest is the best album I have heard for 4 or 5 years. Probably the best since Kid A in 2000.

I wouldn't go quite as far as best album in 4 or 5 years. I liked Coldplay's Rush of Blood better and White Stripe's last two albums better, but yeah, X&Y is better than ATYCLB and HTDAAB.

 

[AtomicBono]

I would say releasing Pop took far less balls than Atomic Bomb.

No.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

No way. If HTDAAB had any balls to it whatsoever, it would have been released over a year earlier. They wanted safe, they scrapped and re-worked and re-worked and re-worked until it was a release that required no accompanying testicular fortitude at all. I'd say they slept better the night before this release then with any other album.

 

[AtomicBono]

No way. If HTDAAB had any balls to it whatsoever, it would have been released over a year earlier. They wanted safe, they scrapped and re-worked and re-worked and re-worked until it was a release that required no accompanying testicular fortitude at all. I'd say they slept better the night before this release then with any other album.

I'd have to agree with you fully there. Granted, I love HTDAAB, but I'd say it's pretty safe. The band are terrified of having another Pop...which is tragic, considering Pop was their best album. I think now, though, they are getting back on their feet again...I think they're restless...searching for new sounds, new colours, ya know!

 

[Earnie Shavers]

I think now, though, they are getting back on their feet again...I think they're restless...searching for new sounds, new colours, ya know!

Aaahh, but who is and how satisfied do you think they all are. What I mean is, perhaps Bono and The Edge are gagging to run free, and perhaps thats what their work in the studio will initially sound like, but will Larry want it knocked back down into sales? And will Bono and the Edge be happy to let him? I don't think it would be a matter of whether they want it, but how much they want it.

 

[AtomicBono]

Interesting question Earnie, and I don't know. Hopefully even Larry is ready to let go a little bit and not just play it safe...I made a really long post in another thread (the New Album one, I think?) that addressed this a little more in-depth.

 

[Snowlock]

Vertigo = Balls ???? Give me a break.

Mofo = HUGE balls

I just fail to see what took balls about Mofo. It was a techno-beats song that was made at the time when everyone was making techno-beats songs. I don't think becoming the sonic equivalent of the Spice Girls was all that ballsy.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Does everyone have a different copy of Pop to me or something?
I hear no techno beat? Did everyone else get that god-awful dance remix on their album?

Mofo took balls because it's their biggest, darkest, stormiest song. There is certainly no techno beat it in, but I know what you are trying to say (I think 'techno' has a different definition in the US?). They've doubled up the drum track, beefed it up significantly and then driven the song entirely by Adams bass. They are following the same pattern used by (exclusively electronic) acts like the Chemical Brothers, but while those type of acts use electronica exlusively, maybe occasionaly backed by a sample of a 'real' instrument, U2 simply reversed it. Real instruments backed by some electronica. It's nothing U2 hadn't done before, and nothing they haven't done since. Love & Peace is far closer to exclusively electronic. Vertigo uses a heavy electronic backing to beef up it's sound. Mofo is the same, but because that beat and bass have such hips people instantly - incorrectly - categorise it. It's rock through and through, but it's rock acknowledging that the drum and the bass' day in the spotlight had come. Sonic equivalent of the Spice Girls?

Mofo also HAS balls that Vertigo can only dream of. Vertigo is the rich kid who decides he wants to dress rock and runs off and spends a fortune at high end fashion stores to look the part, buying $400 ripped 'vintage' jeans etc. Mofo is genuinely angry. Genuinely lost. Genuinely confused. Genuinely a big fucking storm in Bono's head. A few clean cut power chords do not maketh the rock. Like I said in another thread once, if Mofo and Vertigo met in a dark alley, Mofo would have knocked Vertigo to the ground in two swift punches to the head, stolen it's wallet and made off all while Vertigo was still trying to fix it's hair to look the part (with The Fly looking on from a dark corner with a smug smile).

 

[CPTLCTYGOOFBALL]

There are alot of sweeping statements made by people in this thread that are actually only opinions, and not Gospel.
Getting back to the orignal point of the thread, no the new album is not a lame duck. There's no way an album that has sold 9 million copies in the world can be considered a lame duck. As far as singles go, U2 have never been a singles band, though they did have a few hits back in the day when singles charts were relevent but they aren't any longer. It's a different era.

 

[AtomicBono]

There are alot of sweeping statements made by people in this thread that are actually only opinions, and not Gospel.

I agree, and since I'm always right, everyone else should agree too

Good post Earnie, I agree. Doesn't stop me from loving Vertigo, but Vertigo doesn't carry the weight that Mofo does. Vertigo is a catchy rock song and does its job well. Mofo is much more. MOFO!!!!!

 

[shaun vox]

im sorry to say this but HTDAAB does not have a single true rock song.. even the stuff that has alittle guitar in it has a pop sound and feel to it!!!!!!

 

[yimou]

Earnie Shavers

 

[zwervers2]

Mofo also HAS balls that Vertigo can only dream of. Vertigo is the rich kid who decides he wants to dress rock and runs off and spends a fortune at high end fashion stores to look the part, buying $400 ripped 'vintage' jeans etc. Mofo is genuinely angry. Genuinely lost. Genuinely confused. Genuinely a big fucking storm in Bono's head. A few clean cut power chords do not maketh the rock. Like I said in another thread once, if Mofo and Vertigo met in a dark alley, Mofo would have knocked Vertigo to the ground in two swift punches to the head, stolen it's wallet and made off all while Vertigo was still trying to fix it's hair to look the part (with The Fly looking on from a dark corner with a smug smile).

finally!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Earnie Shavers: I hereby declare you my number one poster!
Please tell me you hate Vertigo twice!

 

[Lancemc]

To Shuan,

U2 has always been a pop band. They have always written pop songs. Don't kid yourself. Even Achtung Baby was a pop album. Their whole career, U2 has been trying to appeal to the people. What with the huge anthemic albums and million-dollar stadium tour productions... It's just stupid to say that HTDAAB has a pop feel to it. No shit.


P.S. Your posts still suck.

 

[MrBrau1]

I just fail to see what took balls about Mofo. It was a techno-beats song that was made at the time when everyone was making techno-beats songs. I don't think becoming the sonic equivalent of the Spice Girls was all that ballsy.

True. Pop was trendy.

 

[Layton]

True. Pop was trendy.

Pop and HTDAAB are on about the same level of trendiness, I think. Mofo came from the Prodigy school of rock. Vertigo comes from the Hives school of rock.

 

[Zoovation]

I think that HTDAAB has a lot of succes. Vertigo was a big hit worldwide, SYCMIOYO did not have big succes in the US but it was #9 on the World Charts. We have to wait where COBL will land but I don't think that it will be a big succes altought it entered the World Charts at #40.
HTDAAB sold 2,8 Mio. in the US, that's not bad at all after only 7 months. There aren't a lot of artists that sell this number of copies these days.
In Europe, HTDAAB is a big succes and the tour will boost sales in the next two months.
Worldwide, 8-9 mio. albums sold after 7 months is really huge. HTDAAb will rise this week on the World Charts.

 

[Snowlock]

Pop and HTDAAB are on about the same level of trendiness, I think. Mofo came from the Prodigy school of rock. Vertigo comes from the Hives school of rock.

Well, I don't know... U2 lately it seems as always included a trendy song or two. Sure, Vertigo is kinda trendy; though it's such a pure U2 song that I think they are copying themselves more than anyone else. But at least to me, every song on Pop with maybe the exception of Gone and Please were trendy.

With Vertigo, U2 may have tried to make a trendy song, but they went off in a lot of different directions from there after that. With Pop, song after song was just trying to appeal and fit in. More trendy

ps, yeah, this is getting silly.