Revolver Upstairs, Chapel St, Prahran, Victoria Superthread

[Axver]

Gee what a great update, don't we all feel so much more informed!

 

[Vlad n U 2]

Angry much? You didn't even need to put in the ableism there too.

Seriously, this is not even worth getting pissy about.

(in before I get called a sycophant)

 

[Axver]

I stopped taking your post seriously the moment you said "ableism".

 

[Vlad n U 2]

Seriously?

Never mind Cobbler's irrationality, you took issue with that?

 

[cobl04]

You would hate our weekly trivia night Vlad. One of the questions is 'tranny or granny'.

Spoiler

I did feel a little good about myself the other night though, when I explained to my housemates why some people might find that offensive. I opened their eyes to a whole new kind of discrimination.

 

[Vlad n U 2]

You would hate our weekly trivia night Vlad. One of the questions is 'tranny or granny'.

Spoiler

I did feel a little good about myself the other night though, when I explained to my housemates why some people might find that offensive. I opened their eyes to a whole new kind of discrimination.

At least you did one thing right! Honestly, it's a start so I may as well commend you on it.

 

[Axver]

I'm sorry, but "ableism" is a stupid made-up term used by social justice warriors and nobody else. I think, as a legally blind person, I can quite safely dismiss the term as absurd and useless, predominantly used by people looking to be offended on somebody else's behalf.

I could walk around all day talking about how ableist it is that cafes don't print their menus large enough for me to read, or bakeries put labels on food that are too small for me to see, or books are printed in a small font size, but I don't because I'm not a fucking dickhead. The world is designed for the 99% of people who don't have this or that very specific and uncommon problem, and that's the way it should be.

 

[Vlad n U 2]

Right, then. I didn't expect you to trot out the 'social justice warriors!!!' bit though. Admittedly I still don't know a lot of your positions on things, hence I get surprised.

 

[Axver]

I think my position on most things is rather well-known. It's just in this instance, "ableism" is a buzzword that seems to be used entirely by people looking for something to complain about, or by people who expect the entire planet to cater to their precise needs. For one thing it assumes the possession of a coherent pattern of discriminatory thought and behaviour, yet what it is normally used to condemn is nothing of the sort - it's at best used to refer to mildly offensive or poorly chosen language, and at worst used to refer to things that are done in a certain way because you quite literally cannot cater for every single person on earth (like some of my own everyday experiences).

 

[cobl04]

Features | SHITBOX RALLY: Father and son hit road to fight cancer

 

[bono_212]

Did I miss a page of the thread? How the hell did we go from U2 email to this?

 

[Axver]

Cobbler used the word "retard" with regards to the U2.com email, Vlad replied with the neologism "ableism", and the latter for me is like a red rag to a bull.

Features | SHITBOX RALLY: Father and son hit road to fight cancer

This is a great article, written with a good sense of humour. Was that Revs line there for us?

 

[bono_212]

Ahhh, gotcha.

I've become very desensitized to that word. Not sure if that's a bad thing...probably. But, I know that when people use it, they don't really mean it the way it's taken. Again, that may not be a good thing, but at the same time, it just seems like a more sever version of stupid used to describe something that just doesn't make common sense.

I think well all knew the definition of the word when used as slang, though.

I've had a bit too much wine.


Fuck that U2 email.

 

[cobl04]

Cobbler used the word "retard" with regards to the U2.com email, Vlad replied with the neologism "ableism", and the latter for me is like a red rag to a bull.



This is a great article, written with a good sense of humour. Was that Revs line there for us?

Thanks man. The Revs line is there for all of us.

 

[Axver]

Ahhh, gotcha.

I've become very desensitized to that word. Not sure if that's a bad thing...probably. But, I know that when people use it, they don't really mean it the way it's taken. Again, that may not be a good thing, but at the same time, it just seems like a more sever version of stupid used to describe something that just doesn't make common sense.

I think well all knew the definition of the word when used as slang, though.

I've had a bit too much wine.


Fuck that U2 email.

Yeah, it's actually kind of strange how words like "stupid", "dumb", "idiot", and "imbecile", which once referred to forms of disability or impairment, are now entirely divorced of that and are mild insults that can be used in polite company, while "retard" is now being taken in the other direction and equated with racist or sexist language by some people. I think that's especially surprising given that "retarded" does have a perfectly legitimate usage and definition that has nothing to do with any disabled person - e.g. "a fire retarded the forest's regeneration", "the political evolution of Whateverland was retarded by a series of constitutional crises", etc.

 

[bono_212]

Well, exactly, at it's basic form, the word means "Slow".

 

[liamcool]

Pappy you're the loveliest.

 

[djerdap]

Well, exactly, at it's basic form, the word means "Slow".

I was reading Ulysses yesterday and the word was used like this. The initial reaction was a slight WTF, but then again, it was a fairly mild WTF compared to a lot of other things from that book.

 

[The Sad Punk]

Great write up, Danny. Didn't really know about your mum, pretty confronting to read it, but awesome that she pulled through. Best of luck, my man. Hope the Triple M rock compilations aren't too demoralising!

 

[Alisaura]

Totally massive breaking news.

Oh yes, I did get that. I read two lines, archived it, and promptly forgot about it as even less relevant than the vouchers JB HiFi keeps sending me for giant TVs I don't need.


Also, I don't think I'd ever heard of the word "ableism" until I read those posts the other day. Not sure what that says.

Thanks man. The Revs line is there for all of us.

Nicely done, the Revs reference and the article as a whole.


Has anyone else noticed a stark lack of commentary on social media (well, FB is the only such platform I see) about the Santa Barbara shooting? I'm sure there's plenty going on in FYM and probably twitter, and maybe my news feed has hidden it all or something, but is everyone so fatigued by shootings that it doesn't even rate a sad face, or a "Sympathies to the victims' families" post? Is it passé or trite to even mention such things? I didn't want to be the only one saying something (cowardice, lack of certainty over what had happened, and knowledge that if I started it would probably devolve into a pointless rant), but ... gah.

 

[cobl04]

I'm not a big fan of this particular writer, she's too aggressive in her pursuit of feminism for me to truly appreciate (which I'm sure is misogynist of me to say) but this sums up Twitter's reaction well. Every second tweet was about it.

#YesAllWomen: Twitter's powerful reaction to the Santa Barbara Shootings

 

[liamcool]

Nicely done, the Revs reference and the article as a whole.


Has anyone else noticed a stark lack of commentary on social media (well, FB is the only such platform I see) about the Santa Barbara shooting? I'm sure there's plenty going on in FYM and probably twitter, and maybe my news feed has hidden it all or something, but is everyone so fatigued by shootings that it doesn't even rate a sad face, or a "Sympathies to the victims' families" post? Is it passé or trite to even mention such things? I didn't want to be the only one saying something (cowardice, lack of certainty over what had happened, and knowledge that if I started it would probably devolve into a pointless rant), but ... gah.

Possibly on your feed; mine has exploded (Facebook, Twitter etc.), but a lot of it is debates over whether it can be ascribed to mental illness vs. misogyny or things like that, not actual condolences or mourning. Which says a lot in itself.

 

[liamcool]

Here's an aggressive article about the #notallmen reaction.

Lauren Ingram Writes

 

[Axver]

I must admit I'm really not a fan of people who use social media to try to show how big a social conscience they have by posting some random "thinking of all teh victims!!! gone too soon <3 <3" status, when ten minutes ago they had never heard of those people or the town/state/country it happened in and they'll forget about it the moment the headlines fade.

As for the most recent shootings, the little discussion I've seen has been just a rehash of the gun control debate, which I think has left most people fatigued.

 

[bono_212]

I haven't seen as much of the gun control debate this time around, which I find strange. This time, the person DID buy the guns legally. I think part of the reason for this is that this time, he also stabbed three people to death. Pick your battles, I suppose, but I find it unfortunate that it's not being used as a stronger argument for why stronger gun control is necessary. I've already seen a few people push down an argument because, "Well he also stabbed people".

The thing that's pissing me off about all of the commentary I HAVE seen is that they're making this into a women's rights thing, and that's ridiculous, to me. I didn't read EVERYTHING he wrote, but I read enough to know that this has nothing to do with women, and more to do with him being completely detached from reality. He wanted to be cool, that's really what it was. He wanted everything given to him and that included women. He thought he was supposed to have a hot woman and that's all his brain could focus on. He hated men and women equally, possibly men more, from the way I was reading his writing.

EDIT: OH and PLEASE do not take this as me excusing him. I've never been angrier with a person in my entire life. I just don't know that it's so easy to say he was a misogynist when he didn't really seem to grasp too strongly onto anything besides what he thought was supposed to have.

 

[liamcool]

Oh man Ashley I really don't agree with the statement that "it has nothing to do with women." If you get a chance and feel like being horrified, read the 140 page document that he posted prior to going on this rampage - he states his motivations and feelings towards women very strongly in that.

As to why it's not being used as an argument for stronger gun control or mental health reform - most mass shootings are used as a platform for this because shooting people with guns usually relates to the first issue, and there's often mental illness involved. Why people are latching onto the women's rights issues is because that's not a typically explicit motivation or thread in mass shootings - but now we have this violent event that has perceptions of privilege and societal expectations of women from men at its core, the discussions should focus on these issues.

(I just woke up, excuse me if this is scattershot.)

 

[cobl04]

I agree, but he was completely detached from reality, though. "I'm the perfect guy", and all.

 

[Vlad n U 2]

Frantic parents of shooting suspect raced to Isla Vista during rampage - Los Angeles Times

Astaire said Elliot had not been diagnosed with Asperger’s but the family suspected he was on the spectrum, and had been in therapy for years. He said he knew of no other mental illnesses, but Elliot truly had no friends, as he said in his videos and writings.

He didn't have a mental illness.

 

[bono_212]

Oh man Ashley I really don't agree with the statement that "it has nothing to do with women." If you get a chance and feel like being horrified, read the 140 page document that he posted prior to going on this rampage - he states his motivations and feelings towards women very strongly in that.

As to why it's not being used as an argument for stronger gun control or mental health reform - most mass shootings are used as a platform for this because shooting people with guns usually relates to the first issue, and there's often mental illness involved. Why people are latching onto the women's rights issues is because that's not a typically explicit motivation or thread in mass shootings - but now we have this violent event that has perceptions of privilege and societal expectations of women from men at its core, the discussions should focus on these issues.

(I just woke up, excuse me if this is scattershot.)

I did read the document. I said that latching onto the idea that his resentment of women was the base of his motivations is putting too simple a motivation towards the whole thing, when his hatred of men was just as strong.

 

[cobl04]

Frantic parents of shooting suspect raced to Isla Vista during rampage-Los Angeles Times



He didn't have a mental illness.

You don't know that for certain.