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Old 04-07-2004, 01:49 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
"the Internet is more like radio than we thought. People listen to two or three songs, and if they like it, they go out and buy the CD."



IMO internet can be very handy at discovering new music; especially any non-mainstream MTV/radio stuff - I see it as a test for music, if you will - download a song or two, if you don't like the artist, fine. If you do, you will probably end up buying at least one album. I will also say bands/singers could, instead of racing for the No.1 spot on the chart with singles, put out a 30 second or so bits of their album songs on their website and let the people see how they like their music. They've got nothing to lose; the core fans will buy the album anyway, and they can only gain new fans IMO.

I don't think people download albums massively and it makes no sense to download something you were going to buy anyway. If you're a fan of a band, you will still buy their music, see them live etc...
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Old 04-07-2004, 02:01 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
The Studies are clearly flawed. When people can get something for free instead of buying it, the result will be a decrease in sales of the product. The Average person does not buy something that they can get for free. Its as simple as that.

The decrease in album sales coincides with the increase in File Sharing and CD burning. As for those who explain the decrease in sales because of "shitty music", there was just as much of that "shitty music" if not more, when sales were going through the roof. Counting for inflation, CD prices have never been cheaper.
Yeah, I know tons of people who refused to buy albums cause they could just tape the songs off the radio for free.

They should also mention that CD sales are down because of several boycotts against buying music. ALOT of people are still upset the RIAA sued 13 yr olds. $18.99 for a cd is disgusting.
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Old 04-07-2004, 02:05 PM   #18
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Oh, and today's music is shitty, real shitty.
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Old 04-07-2004, 04:16 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Moonlit_Angel


Agreed. I download music, as do my dad and sister, and we still go out and buy CDs. Downloading is a good way to help me see if I want to hear more from an artist I may be getting into. If I like what I hear, I'll gladly go out and buy the CD. Besides, once again, smaller towns do not always have the CDs you would like to get available, which is what happened to me. Now it's not so hard for me, 'cause there's a couple bigger cities nearby where there's more access to this stuff, but in the last town I lived in, the stores barely sold squat in the way of CDs by artists I liked-it was basically greatest hits compilations and maybe one or two other CDs, all of which I'd already owned (and depending on the artists I was into, with some of them, when looking around, I didn't see a single one of their CDs in stores at all). There's many factors involved in why some people may not be buying CDs.

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Quote:
u2kitten:
I agree, because I know several people, especially young guys, who went on CD buying kicks because of the stuff they found online.
i've been on one of those kicks since i first had an internet connection that allowed me to do that. despite the fact that my job sucks and i don't make a lot of money, i'm still doing that.




and i'd rather spend money on some albums i like, get the artwork with it, and everything, rather than spending a pile of cash on blank cds.

do i have burned music? hell yeah. a lot of it. but most of it is bootlegs and shit like that, or when i'm really into an album and can't wait until i have the money to buy it i'll burn a copy from someone, until i can buy my own.

i've done things like gone to 7 different record stores, even tried special ordering, in order to find an album. ok, so maybe i'm a little extreme, but there are always people out there who are like you or worse.
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Old 04-07-2004, 08:53 PM   #20
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Originally posted by IWasBored
do i have burned music? hell yeah. a lot of it. but most of it is bootlegs and shit like that, or when i'm really into an album and can't wait until i have the money to buy it i'll burn a copy from someone, until i can buy my own.
Yeah, I don't think they understand some people can't afford to go out and buy everything they like. But we eventually do if we can!

My niece and nephews are really into online music, and have found a lot of bands that way. One of my nephews only likes indie and un-mainstream stuff he found online.

I am guilty of not doing exploring online music, but it's a different world for me. I'm not a teenager or a college student, I'm a 34 yr old mom and wife with 3 kids and a lot of problems. All my online time is spent here on Interference. So that's why I'm not into new and more obscure stuff, it's not something I have time for right now. So it's great for you who do that a lot, and I understand how you enjoy it but I hope you all won't think I'm backward or only for mainstream stuff because I'm not into a lot of indie stuff right now.

Speaking of indie, there are a lot of indie stores (like Plan 9 here, don't know what you guys have) that do well on the underground and harder to find stuff. People who want that stuff usually go there, which takes away the last customer places like Tower would have (looking for stuff big chains don't carry) which again hurts them. But it's NOT because of downloading, not mostly anyway.

Quote:
Originally posted by MrBrau1
They should also mention that CD sales are down because of several boycotts against buying music. ALOT of people are still upset the RIAA sued 13 yr olds. $18.99 for a cd is disgusting.
Which is why when Best Buy, Circuit City and WalMart sell them for $12.99 it runs places like Tower out of business, but Tower's demise gets blamed on downloading

Those places can afford to undercut prices because they make it up in washers, computers, etc. Tower can't do that, so they lose out.
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Old 04-08-2004, 12:55 AM   #21
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Even though it goes against instinct, I'd have to agree that downloading music for free can't be what has the most impact on record sales.

Take me for example: when I was younger, before I was even a U2 fan, I rarely bought CDs. My family didn't have a CD player stereo until much later and I spent my early teens taping my favorites off the radio and playing them in a walkman (which I still do since the walkman is the only thing that works running/biking). I have hundreds of CDs (burned + bought) and less than 20 are ones I bought. CDs were NEVER affordable so I used them to fill my Christmas list or my friends gave me CDs for my birthday, etc. Now I download hours and hours of music, but it hasn't changed my CD buying habits at all. You can't work backwards and say "oh, she downloads a shitload of music and never buys CDs now so that must be the reason" b/c the truth is I've never been into spending over $10 for a little shiny disc. I prefer data discs of mp3s since I don't even have a stereo to play CDs with and play all my music from my desktop computer.

Downloading hasn't increased my CD buying either. I DO buy more CDs now that I'm a U2 fan (and by more I mean whenever something new comes out...once or twice a year). This has more to do with the internet and becoming a bigger fan in general, not downloading capabilities. I download U2 bootlegs that you can't buy anyway, but I don't download mp3s of studio songs (I rip my own mp3s at the quality I want).

If people want albums they will buy them, period.

If people want mp3s they will download them.

There's not as stong a correlation as people commonly assume.
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:07 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrBrau1
CD sales are dropping because music today is shit. Simple.
So not true. There's so much good music being put out every week it's almost ridiculous. Of course the only way you'll find out about it is online because the radio and the media largely ignores it. I'm not really disagreeing with you, just being specific.

Also, I think the biggest hit to CD prices is less the fault of online file trading, and more DVDs. I never used to buy VHS at all.. but now my family has a ridiculously large DVD collection. Why? DVDs are worth the money. When a DVD (a whole movie + sometimes a hell of a lot of extra features) is the same price as a CD... what would you buy? Also because a DVD is something you sit down and physically watch, put time into, etc.. it seems more worthwhile, versus a CD that's just always kinda on in the background. You don't invite your friends over to listen to your new Nickelback CD (though you may play it in the background), but you DO invite all your friends over to sit down and watch a nice new DVD. CD's problem? they need to do more, or cost less.

I do believe that music is one of the most profound and important things in existence.. so... I do think it's worth a lot of money. but it's so hard to justify spending that much money on it, even though I spend most of my soul on it. I do go to concerts though, quite more than I can probably afford to. And my current problem is that I have a portable mp3 player now, so I don't even use all the CDs that I do have... they just sit on my shelf unopened and un looked at it, unless I want to leaf through the liner notes or something.

Just some thoughts.
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Old 04-08-2004, 10:04 AM   #23
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the problem isn't crappy music... the problem is crappy set lists on the radio... someone mentioned tom petty already... his last album is great... the last dj... it's so true. today's jock isn't allowed to play what he wants to play... everything's a pre-determined list set by a program manager that sits in a corporate office somewhere taking what amounts to modern day payola. THAT is why people aren't buying CDs. there is good music out there... but if it's not readily accesable, how are people supposed to know about and thus buy it?

me, i have thousands of downloaded mp3s... but there's only one album that i've downloaded in it's entirety... the gray album... the jay-z beatles mix, which is next to impossiable to find in stores. other than that, i've done exactly what this report suggests... download a couple of songs, go out and buy the album if i like it. and when i was a kid... before this whole internet music craze started... i used to do the exact same thing... only i'd record the song on a tape off the radio rather than download it off the internet.

and fucking lars can beeeeelllloooow me... metallica's career started on fans trading tapes of the band... now people are doing the same damn thing, only with new technology, and all of a sudden it's a problem. bug off ya little shit.
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Old 04-08-2004, 10:27 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase

and fucking lars can beeeeelllloooow me... metallica's career started on fans trading tapes of the band... now people are doing the same damn thing, only with new technology, and all of a sudden it's a problem. bug off ya little shit.

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Old 04-08-2004, 03:21 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
the problem isn't crappy music... the problem is crappy set lists on the radio... someone mentioned tom petty already... his last album is great... the last dj... it's so true. today's jock isn't allowed to play what he wants to play... everything's a pre-determined list set by a program manager that sits in a corporate office somewhere taking what amounts to modern day payola. THAT is why people aren't buying CDs. there is good music out there... but if it's not readily accesable, how are people supposed to know about and thus buy it?

I have made this point to my friendís countless times. Clear Channel should rot in hell. They have ruined the radio. Their play lists and the fact that each song has to be played a certain number of times everyday makes me ill. In my opinion this practice goes against everything creative that has to do with music. Especially at stations where the major market for the music is the teen market.

We all know that the majority of people (especially teens) are highly influenced and that most people will do what others do or or what someone pumps into them. So you have the two major companiesí that own 90+% radio stations and the few big labels able to set what they want to be popular and make them money. As a result now (at lease in the US) you have little diversity presented to people at least on the stations I would listen to. Other than file sharing or another form of word of mouth there is no way for them to know about the artists. And the masses probably do not care to look outside of the 10 artists who are spoon fed to them day after day to find something new and interesting.

In my opinion the radio stations that play music should be in the job of introducing people to artists - all sorts of artists and not just the 10 on the Clear Channel heavy rotation play list - there of course would be those that are more requested than others, but imagine if DJ's were able to choose songs from a much wider pool of music. They would be exposing many more people to a vast array of musicians. I would actually listen to the radio if I did not hear Linkin Park every 5 mins on every channel. Imagine listening to the radio hearing a song you had never heard before and thinking "that ruled." Unfortunately I do not think that happens often anymore.

WHFS, which is a huge channel in the MD, DC, Northern VA area use to be so good. They were the "alternative channel" in the earyl 90's. They played all sorts of music, good music. Now they are owned by Infinity Radio Group, they still call themselves "The True Alternative" and they only play the same nonsense on every other station in the rock/alternative format does. '

In my opinion fixing the bane that is the radio right now should be what the music industry focuses on.

</endrant> which was slightly off topic of this thread.
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Old 04-08-2004, 03:42 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
The Studies are clearly flawed.
What exactly about the methodology employed by the researchers leads you to the conclusion that the study is flawed? A study reaching conclusions which you dislike does not mean that the study is flawed, it means that you disagree with the conclusions.
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Old 04-09-2004, 01:54 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
the problem isn't crappy music... the problem is crappy set lists on the radio... someone mentioned tom petty already... his last album is great... the last dj... it's so true. today's jock isn't allowed to play what he wants to play... everything's a pre-determined list set by a program manager that sits in a corporate office somewhere taking what amounts to modern day payola. THAT is why people aren't buying CDs. there is good music out there... but if it's not readily accesable, how are people supposed to know about and thus buy it?
. That album The Last DJ is awesome. My dad works in radio and he can totally relate to it. DiGi mentioned Clear Channel...heh, my dad's gone off on a few rants about them and others like them, too. Those kinds of groups have ruined many a station he's worked in.

Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
me, i have thousands of downloaded mp3s... but there's only one album that i've downloaded in it's entirety... the gray album... the jay-z beatles mix, which is next to impossiable to find in stores. other than that, i've done exactly what this report suggests... download a couple of songs, go out and buy the album if i like it. and when i was a kid... before this whole internet music craze started... i used to do the exact same thing... only i'd record the song on a tape off the radio rather than download it off the internet.

and fucking lars can beeeeelllloooow me... metallica's career started on fans trading tapes of the band... now people are doing the same damn thing, only with new technology, and all of a sudden it's a problem. bug off ya little shit.
.

Also, ditto the comments about CD prices being ridiculously high in some places.

Angela
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Old 04-09-2004, 10:51 PM   #28
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I don't know.... I believe radio setlists play what is popular unless record companies do pay stations to play songs...

I mean music is so fractured in terms genre/ taste/ etc. that to be honest I don't begrudge radio stations for playing set setlists. Radio is a business.... they got to go with what is popular and play it over and over. I blame music snobbery for the way music is today.

People ignore the business apsects of radio, as if the models that people have brought up such as a DJ playing what he wants/ likes would be the best idea...

I think that would be money-losing situation.
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Old 04-09-2004, 10:54 PM   #29
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CD prices are relatively low at Best Buy and Circuit City, however the fact that they will not carry some rare/ older CDs such as Pavement, Jon Spencer Blues Explosion, Eric Johnson, or Yeah, Yeah, Yeahs EPs is the negative aspect of that cheap price.

The music industry- I scratch my head....
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