Ellipse lottery no luck needed?

[Bono's Tart]

if it's so wrong to get a number and then leave for the day, maybe the people running the lines shouldn't be giving out numbers. when i was in milwaukee, i had actually left for quite a while because it got so cold and rainy, and i already had a pretty bad cold going on. the people around seemed kind of pissed when my buddy and i got back, but we were given numbers, which is basically permission to leave and come back. maybe we should be blaming the system rather than calling for the deaths of anyone who left and came back.

the holier than thou attitude that goes around here can be real sickening.

no one is talking about leaving for the day these "fans" didnt even queue and it was overnight!!
different thing in my book but like I said one rule for and one for another.

 

[Bono's Tart]

bono's tart...if youre talking about night one boston last week...i was there...i got there at 7am in line and was later scanned in....there is no way in hell, and i mean no way...that the people in charge of scanning the tickets actually pick and choose who they want in...thats really an unfounded statement...and i really cannot understand why you are so bitter...just relax

You opinion which you are entitled to like I am entitled to mine. You are also making unfounded statements as you keep harping on that I'm wrong prove it?
When I saw the same people being scanned in I complained to the fans I as with in front of the U2 staff and the arena security and they heard, odd that out of 6 of us complaining 3 tickets got miraculously scanned in!!

I am talking about Monday night and I'm not bitter I got barrier on the runway outside the ellipse Sunday and scanned in front row ellipse on the Monday.

And I'm very relaxed thanks I am expressing my opinion and I have to say the opinions of numerous other U2 fans who I queued with on both days.

 

[Bono's Tart]

It is NOT predetermined on the ticket. I got scanned in with a reserved ticket at one show.

It IS a random computer generated selection, but I also believe there is an override process of some sort.

and my god do they override it!!

 

[Bono's Tart]

Bono's Tart, if I remember correctly, you vehemently disagreed with those of us who said that saving spots in line for people who couldn't get there early was wrong. In light of that, it seems a little hypocritical of you to take offense to people who get a number and then leave the line for extended periods.

For the record, I think both scenarios are wrong, and immensely unfair to those who do put in the time in line. I've seen people get numbers, leave for the day, then be refused entry back into their spots. They had to go to the back of the line, just like everyone else who were just arriving. I guess it all depends on the integrity of whoever is running the line.

As for the scanning process, I've had a huge problem with it all through the 3rd leg. The rules clearly state that only two people will be allowed into the ellipse for each ticket that scans. During my string of 6 shows in a row, both my daughter and I were very sick, and for two of those shows, we opted not to camp out/line up early, so that we could stay at the hotel and get some rest. It was really disappointing to get there between 6:30 and 7:30, and to find that the scanners had been put away because the ellipse was full. Makes sense though, because if they're letting 3 and more people in per ticket, it's going to fill up a hell of a lot faster.

Don't change the rules midgame, people. And Allison? You suck.

Saving one spot in line during the day is completely different to getting a number immediately after the first show and floating off until 6.30/7am !!! I'm not talking about ONE person here Im talking about 25/30 people who incidentally a lot of them are here on this site!!! If they wanted to sleep in their hotels like I did then they should have turned up whenever and taken their chances like we did.

I'm sorry you didnt get in but this is why!!

Allison is she the woman who was telling fans how it all works?? Well she was talking to these same fans by name ..
random my arse!!

 

[VintagePunk]

Saving one spot in line during the day is completely different to getting a number immediately after the first show and floating off until 6.30/7am !!! I'm not talking about ONE person here Im talking about 25/30 people who incidentally a lot of them are here on this site!!! If they wanted to sleep in their hotels like I did then they should have turned up whenever and taken their chances like we did.

I'm sorry you didnt get in but this is why!!!

Allison is she the woman who was telling fans how it all works?? Well she was talking to these same fans by name ..
random my arse!!

Sorry, but if word got out that saving spots was okay, it wouldn't be just one or two. I think we all know what would inevitably happen. I still maintain - you want to be one of the first hundred or so in line, you have to put the time in. Working/other committments is no excuse. I rearranged my life to be there. And also, when I was sick and knew I couldn't, I opted out for a few shows. Didn't get a number and leave for ridiculous amounts of time, or have someone save a spot for me.

Yes, Allison is the one who runs the scanning process, and she comes out to speak to the line with a bullhorn just before it's time to enter. She does know many of the people, just due to the sheer numbers of shows they attend.

I'm not implying that there is anything fishy going on with people who attend lots of shows. But the one thing I do know is occuring - several people getting in on one scan - I do think that's wrong, as well, when it causes the scanners to be put away early because all the ellipse spots are taken.

 

[MysteryGirl]

They should just go back to a first come, first serve basis. It makes everything simpler and fairer. And under no circumstances should they allow you to "hold" places in the line for friends. You're either there or you're not - that's the way it should be.

I agree 300%!!!!!!!!!

 

[MysteryGirl]

if it's so wrong to get a number and then leave for the day, maybe the people running the lines shouldn't be giving out numbers. when i was in milwaukee, i had actually left for quite a while because it got so cold and rainy, and i already had a pretty bad cold going on. the people around seemed kind of pissed when my buddy and i got back, but we were given numbers, which is basically permission to leave and come back. maybe we should be blaming the system rather than calling for the deaths of anyone who left and came back.

the holier than thou attitude that goes around here can be real sickening.

Generally, what I always heard was that you could leave for up to an hour to an hour and a half and then come back. That allowed time to go take a shower if you camped out, or go for lunch, etc. But being gone for 4 or 5 hours is frowned upon.

 

[Liesje]

Saving spots REALLY pisses me off. I mean, if your a young guy and your wife is pregnant, that's one thing, but otherwise I can't stand it. And that goes for saving spots along the rails too. I won't name names but I've seen people near the front of the line get in the ellipse only to hog as much space as possible assuming their friends farther back will get in, or their friends who didn't get in will find someone to take them in or give them extra wristbands. I also hate it when people come early to get their number, but then spend the rest of the day out partying, in a hotel, or sleeping in the car. So yeah, they have a legitimate number from early in the morning, but while everyone else sits there all day in the cold and rain, they leave and sleep in a dry place and then come back at 5 all primped and ready to go. Leaving for an hour to get food or bum a shower is one thing, but when no one sees your face for 5-6 hours at a time, it's just not fair. Hopefully you know who you are and understand that's not cool.

 

[Joshua_Tree_Hugger]

Here's a question. Has anyone ever gone to a show on their own, got picked for the ellipse, and then offered to sell their "friend" spot to the highest bidder? Just curious...

 

[mcranston]

Here's a question. Has anyone ever gone to a show on their own, got picked for the ellipse, and then offered to sell their "friend" spot to the highest bidder? Just curious...

Haha, I remember my friend and I were going to offer people cash for their Ellipse spot for Toronto #3, we got scanned in so no big deal. But anyways, my opinion:

I see no fathomable way that the security doing scanning choose in any way who gets in. However, I do believe that in some cases people can try to appeal their case (i.e. two incredibly attractive girls convincing a male security for wristbands). I have seen four Vertigo shows this year. My friend got sacnned for two taking me with him, we snuck in another time (using the wristband trick), and the fourth show I went alone and did not get in.

Now, again, I'd like to reiterate that I really find it hard to believe there is any conspiracy during the scanning process. But please, don't mistake my defense of the legitimacy of the lottery for support of the lottery system. I have incredibly contempt for the lottery system. I still believe it is unfair. And I find Paul McGuiness' reasoning (same fans in the heart during Elevation every night) completely absurd. I've always stood by the notion that most people have jobs or school, but it's those who truly make an effort to get the day off to line up should be in the Ellipse. And to be honest, my Toronto experience in the Ellipse shaped my sentiments considerably. I'll never forget the lack of enthusiasm among so many people in the Ellipse during COBL. And I believe it is a valid statement to say the people who line up the longest are going to visibly enjoy the show more than those who haven't lined up and just get scanned in.

(I'm not trying to rehash the old lottery argument, sorry)

As far as the people skipping out of the line for hours at a time is concerned, yes that is frustrating. That is why I have serious disdain for apathetic arena security. At the Air Canada Centre in Toronto in September, they did an impeccable job regulating the line. There was always a good amount of security who would overlook, and there were barricades ensuring people couldn't bud in last minute ... kudos to the arena. However, in Montreal the lineup was chaos (especially for the Saturday show). Arena security didn't give a shit quite frankly, and it really didn't matter to them who was in the building first.

While people budding in line is incredibly frustrating, trust in every U2 fan is naive, you have to count on arena security.

Mike

 

[MysteryGirl]

Miami 1, people were trying to butt in line and we all banded together and held each other's hands in numerical order, and made lots of noise letting it be known we were doing that, which discouraged several who were "hanging out" near the front trying to "look casual." But then at the last minute, two guys who were in the 300s ran ahead and barged into the front. We all screamed at security to alert them of what happened, but security let them in anyway! :furious: My line partnert and I were on the rail near the foot stand that Bono stands on to lean into the crowd, the one on the right. Those two guys were in the center! We shoutred some things at them and I took their picture and threatened to post the picture on all the U2 forums so everyone could watch out for them. My line partner told me after the Miami 2 show, that one of them saw her and apologized. Said they did it because they could. Well, ain't that sweet...we know they'll do it again!

Mcranston, I agree with you. I saved money and accumulated "personal days" way in advance with this tour in mind. I made the effort. If I can do it, anyone can. It's a matter of planning ahead.

 

[ljclary]

I think one of the reasons Boston lets you get a number and come back is for a security purpose. They do not want to have 3000 or so fans hanging around all day right next to a Federal Building and also the Garden is a major commuter port for the city. Tons of people only would make it impossible for people to get their train.
I personal think the way this is done is great! It lets people get a number and then, say, go to work for the day! I do not know the fairness of it. I am sure certain people are "let" in as opposed to "scanned" it but what exactly in this world is 100% fair.
I also have no problems with the kids being let in. In Boston most of the parents with young ones hung out in th back anyway.

 

[MysteryGirl]

Just don't be putting your kid on your shoulders in front of me!!!!!!

 

[gvox]

Whenever you're all ready to stop hypothesizing and listen when NUMEROUS different tour staff tell you the truth, you will continue to line up in vain at 3am thinking that somehow gets you a better chance into the ellipse.

FOR THE FIFTEENTH BILLION TIME:

Your TICKET is either an ellipse ticket or it is not, there is no magical lottery program running and - I love this funny one - storing winning numbers locally on the laptop so that when the person comes back and scans again they get Vertigo. For each show, there is a very simple database downloaded onto the laptop. It lists the elllipse ticket upc codes and the floor ticket upc codes. Your ticket is read, noticably on THE BAR CODE. The number is matched against the database. If your ticket is an ellipse ticket, you are in. If it is not, you are on the floor. Why do you think they scan THE BAR CODE??? Your ticket bar code was already scanned for entrance validity, if they were running some ad-hoc lottery algorithm locally on each laptop, they WOULDNT need to actually scan the BAR CODE, they could scan the frickin date on the ticket and it wouldnt make a difference.

I recieved final confirmation on the fact that this is the way it works in Buffalo. Cant tell you how, you can just trust me or not trust me. I have no reason to lie, believe me. I've been in the ellipse more times than is morally acceptable LOL.

All lining up does is help you gain better position in either the ellipse or the floor.

You were either lucky or unlucky the day you (or the person whom you bought your ticket from) bought your ticket. Which was many months ago.

Although many people would consider themselves lucky just to be at a U2 show period.

 

[gvox]

It is nothing but luck. I now believe after a friend spoke to a worthy U2 crew member that the ellipse selection is pre-determined on your ticket.

My GF scanned for Buffalo........ = Ellipse entry
I scanned for Cleveland....= Ellipse entry

I have however NOT scanned for various shows.....


I have even seen people scan back to back.

In the long run it has worked out for me....however....that was after MULTIPLE shows.

*pssst* Cleveland ROCKED!

exactly

Also explains how I got lucky and scanned in on my own ticket a good 4 or 5 times in a row recently, while not even bothering to line up.

Or how a good 30 or 40 people proceeded thru the line in Buffalo and not one single scan...and then 4 or 5 in a row scanned.

but you can only tell people so much

everyone else makes up their own consipiracy theories..maybe it makes them feel better

 

[corianderstem]

If that is indeed the case, I wonder if there are "winning" bar codes on e-tickets? Has anyone here scanned in with an e-ticket?

Just out of curiosity...

 

[mabel]

So you're saying if I've got a "Vertigo!" ticket, I'd get in whether I get there at 6am or 6pm? I was kind of thinking it was more random like, whoever's 13th, 49th, 52nd, etc in line would get scanned in. If it's done by your ticket being encoded to scan in, then how does that work with cities that are letting in 4-5 people a pop? Do they just shut down scanning when they've reached capacity? Then (theoretically) people that show up at 8pm, who have a ticket that's already encoded to scan in won't get in because they're already reached capacity letting twice as many people in on a ticket than they're supposed to (or giving automatic entry to people with kids)? I suppose that's the risk you take getting there late, but still...

I don't know. While it's nice in theory for people who really can't get out of work or school, etc. I think (should they go the GA route again next tour) they should just go back to first come, first served. People are still going to camp out for hours on end, and even if they're getting a lot of the same faces in there night after night, if you're devoted enough to spend 12 hours in line, I don't think you're going to be a drag, even if it is the 10th show someone has gone to on the tour and they know the setlist inside and out.

I was lucky enough to get scanned in at my show, but I couldn't help but think that at #88, I sure would have liked knowing I was going to end up there, a la Elevation.

I also think skipping out on the line for hours on end is sketchy. Did I bend the rules a bit by having my line buddy join me in line an hour or so after I got there? I guess, but I asked the people behind me and nobody seemed to mind. That's a far cry from showing up at 8am and having your line buddy show up at 5pm, or being in a city where you're expected to wait in line all day, getting a number bright and early and disappearing for most of the day. But, what can you do? People are going to try to cheat in every city, at every show. At MSG 11/21, the GA line went down to see Bono when he came to sign around 4, and when we returned to our spot in line, there were mysteriously twice as many people in front of us. While they tried to reorganize people, some people refused to go back to their spot numerically, and the folks with the list didn't seem particularly intent of fixing that.

ETA: I got in with an e-ticket, though I didn't technically scan in. My ticket wouldn't scan either way, and they hit a button, letting me in.

 

[lemon_vr6]

I have been to 16 US shows and have gotten into the ellipse each time. There IS a pattern if you take the time to watch it. I got into opening night on dumb luck but stood by the computers to see if there was a pattern and there was. And no, it's not my place to explain it. It's easy and obvious if you take the time.

 

[mabel]

I have been to 16 US shows and have gotten into the ellipse each time. There IS a pattern if you take the time to watch it. I got into opening night on dumb luck but stood by the computers to see if there was a pattern and there was. And no, it's not my place to explain it. It's easy and obvious if you take the time.

Just curious...does this coincide with gabrielvox's comment "Or how a good 30 or 40 people proceeded thru the line in Buffalo and not one single scan...and then 4 or 5 in a row scanned"?? Because I've read several different reports from people mentioning either a long streak of people getting scanned in in a row or huge groups getting "proceed to floor" in a row. Eh, whatever. I don't know why I'm so curious about this. There are only a handful of GA shows left, and I'm not going to be at any of them!

 

[WildHoneyAlways]

I have been to 16 US shows and have gotten into the ellipse each time. There IS a pattern if you take the time to watch it. I got into opening night on dumb luck but stood by the computers to see if there was a pattern and there was. And no, it's not my place to explain it. It's easy and obvious if you take the time.

Can I ask why it's not your place to explain it?

 

[innominata8]

I have been to 16 US shows and have gotten into the ellipse each time. There IS a pattern if you take the time to watch it. I got into opening night on dumb luck but stood by the computers to see if there was a pattern and there was. And no, it's not my place to explain it. It's easy and obvious if you take the time.

i love these kind of posts, the "i know something that you don't know, and i'm not going to share" variety...

if you really did know something (and were a REAL fan...) you'd do more than just post brags about it.

 

[mabel]

i love these kind of posts, the "i know something that you don't know, and i'm not going to share" variety...

if you really did know something (and were a REAL fan...) you'd do more than just post brags about it.

You mean like the "I've got X, Y, and Z on DVD, but I'm not trading, selling, or torrenting...just wanted to let you all know"???

 

[U2Fanatic4ever]

i love these kind of posts, the "i know something that you don't know, and i'm not going to share" variety...

if you really did know something (and were a REAL fan...) you'd do more than just post brags about it.

AMEN TO THAT!!!


is this thread turning into bragging thread?

 

[lemon_vr6]

i love these kind of posts, the "i know something that you don't know, and i'm not going to share" variety...

if you really did know something (and were a REAL fan...) you'd do more than just post brags about it.

I'm not sharing because I don't want a bunch of Interference Nazis brawling over which place in line they are in. If it's truly random I should go buy a lottery ticket because there is a 1:5^23 chance that I could do it every time. Think about it. An interferencer PMed me a nice request for the info, and I gave it out. U2 didn't devise the system to have the solution distributed online.

 

[Axver]

Fancy telling us what the system was come 20 December?

 

[lemon_vr6]

Fancy telling us what the system was come 20 December?

After Portland, why not? I told a few people in some of the GA lines I was in and they almost started fights to "place" themselves in line. The trick is to have more than one person with you, because the "hit" number floats a bit, but I have never seen it strike out of a certain range.

 

[WildHoneyAlways]

So do you not believe the tickets are pre-coded to scan? (a la gabrielxox)

 

[lemon_vr6]

No, I do not believe they are, I have seen tickets double scanned accidentally and the person was given an ellipse wristband. That got a few people pissed.

 

[WildHoneyAlways]

Interesting....
Well, I'll be in St Louis on wednesday. I hope I'm lucky enough to get scanned. (or with someone who will take me in with them )

I can't stress about it though. I don't even know what time I'll be getting in line.

 

[VintagePunk]

I also find it hard to believe that it has anything to do with ticket codes, despite what Gabe was told (sorry, Gabe). Occam's Razor, people. Why would they bother with a system that involves inputting thousands upon thousands of codes when a program of intermittant beeps at random intervals would work just as well, with considerably less work?