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Old 05-20-2005, 02:41 PM   #1
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Bono on Christ

From Rockrebel.com:

Bono Testifies: From "Bono-In Conversation With Michka Assayas: Excerpts:

"I'd be in big trouble if Karma was going to be finally be my judge....It doesn't excuse my mistakes, but I'm holding out for Grace. I'm holding out that Jesus took my sins onto the Cross, because I know who I am and I hope I don't have to depend on my own religiosity...

I love the idea of the Sacrificial Lamb. I love the idea that God says 'look, you cretins there are certain results to the way we are, to selfishness and there's mortality as part of your very sinful nature and let's face it, you're not living a very good life are you?' There are consequences to actions. The point of the death of Christ is that Christ took on the sins of the world, so that what we put out did not come back to us and that our sinful nature does not reap the obvious death. That's the point. It should keep us humbled. It's not our own good works that get us through the gates of heaven.

The secular response to the Christ story always goes like this: he was a great prophet, obviously a very interesting guy had a lot to say long the lines of other great prophets, be they Elijah, Mu hammed, Buddha or Confucius. But actually Christ doesn't allow you to do that. He doesn't let you off that hook. Christ says: 'No, I'm not saying I' m a teacher, don't call me teacher. I'm not saying I'm a prophet. I'm saying 'I'm the Messiah. I'm saying: 'I am God incarnate' and people say 'no, no please just be a prophet. A prophet we can take. You're a bit eccentric. We've had John the Baptist eating locusts and wild honey. We can handle that. But don't mention the "M" word! Because you're know we're gonna have to crucify you a. And he goes: 'no, no. I know you're expecting me to come back with an army and set you free from these creeps, but actually I am the Messiah.' At this point everyone starts staring at their shoes and says 'Oh, my God he's gonna keep saying this.' So what you're left with is: either Christ was who He said He was-the Messiah-or a complete nutcase, I mean, we're talking nutcase on the level of Charles Manson."

DEVELOPING.....
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Old 05-20-2005, 02:43 PM   #2
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Thanks for this!
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Old 05-20-2005, 02:52 PM   #3
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Brilliant! He always describes things perfectly.
Thanks for the post.
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Old 05-20-2005, 02:53 PM   #4
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"Thanks for this!"


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Old 05-20-2005, 03:24 PM   #5
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I seriously need to get this book . . .
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Old 05-20-2005, 03:34 PM   #6
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"I seriously need to get this book . . ."

Have you read Walk On:The Spiritual Journey of U2
by Steve Stockman?

Published by Relevant Books
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Old 05-20-2005, 07:03 PM   #7
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Its something like what CS Lewis said in "Mere Christianity". He said Jesus was either a liar, a madman or He was what He said He was
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Old 05-20-2005, 07:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pearl
Its something like what CS Lewis said in "Mere Christianity". He said Jesus was either a liar, a madman or He was what He said He was
I had this conversation with someone recently. Yes he was either telling the truth or insane, BUT don't we still have to take what he said in context? Did he ever say he was speaking to the whole world? Did he ever say that the future word(the Bible as we know) would be the absolute truth?

When put in context he spoke to a very small population of the world.

Did he ever talk about the future of the whole universe?
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Old 05-20-2005, 07:53 PM   #9
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Thank you so much for this excerpt, the iron horse!

I've always said that Bono's sense of Christianity is something very private, individual and unique for him - none of us can box Bono's Christianity and say that we know what he believes because only Bono knows what he believes.

Bono's sense of Christianity is much broader and inclusive than many "believers" in the past have given him credit for.

ALL BECAUSE OF YOU....
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Old 05-21-2005, 02:44 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
I had this conversation with someone recently. Yes he was either telling the truth or insane, BUT don't we still have to take what he said in context? Did he ever say he was speaking to the whole world? Did he ever say that the future word(the Bible as we know) would be the absolute truth?
Perhaps it would have been a lot easier if Jesus had have clarified it for us. Like 'known' world etc.

Perhaps 'world' meant the Middle East...perhaps the Jerusalem city limits...perhaps the room He was sitting in with Nicodemus.

Quote:
John 3.16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him....

John 3:19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.....
There are two ways of interpreting context:- exegesis (what Jesus meant when he said it) and hermeneutics (what it means to us today).

When Jesus spoke to Nicodemus (John 3) it's quite obvious he wasn't refering to geographical or cultural themes when refering to the known world...he was discussing universal themes like birth, light (God/Christ/good), darkness (evil), heaven.

Hermeneutically, we discover birth, good, evil, heaven are themes involving the human condition which have not fundamentally changed over 2000 years. Read in context, Christ seems to be refering to universal themes.

Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
When put in context he spoke to a very small population of the world.

Did he ever talk about the future of the whole universe?
Taking this into consideration Christianity would only have had any relevance on the original hearers of the gospel and its message be confined to a particular historical time and location.

The fact is ...the point is moot because Christ's words are read today...they are applied today and resonate today and wherever it has been suppressed (Communist countries/Arab states) faith in Christ and the gospel of Christ continued and continues to survive and inspire people, change people's lives and the world.
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Old 05-22-2005, 10:10 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bad Templar



The fact is ...the point is moot because Christ's words are read today...they are applied today and resonate today and wherever it has been suppressed (Communist countries/Arab states) faith in Christ and the gospel of Christ continued and continues to survive and inspire people, change people's lives and the world.
But it's not everywhere. And not only because of governments. There are many places on this planet where children will grow up never even hearing the word 'Jesus'. This is the point I'm trying to make.
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Old 05-23-2005, 08:06 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar

There are many places on this planet where children will grow up never even hearing the word 'Jesus'. This is the point I'm trying to make.
That's a good question to bring up. That's why we're called as Christians to spread the "Good News" to the corners of the earth. However, you're right — there are people who probably won't hear it. The good news is God meets us all where we're at. He can reveal himself to them through nature and in other ways. They may not hear about Christ, but they can still seek him. For those of us who have heard about Christ, God still meets us where we're at. We have a decision to make.

As far as Christ speaking to the people then vs. people throughout time, just consider the sacrifice made. Why wouldn't God come to earth, die a brutal death and be resurrected for all of humanity? Why would he just do that for one time period? (I'm not saying he wouldn't, but the point was to conquer death for all who believe.)

Hey the iron horse, yes I've read "Walk On." It's a great book. I started a thread below about the new version of it coming out soon if you're interested.
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Old 05-23-2005, 08:11 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


I had this conversation with someone recently. Yes he was either telling the truth or insane, BUT don't we still have to take what he said in context? Did he ever say he was speaking to the whole world? Did he ever say that the future word (the Bible as we know) would be the absolute truth?

When put in context he spoke to a very small population of the world.

Did he ever talk about the future of the whole universe?
Jesus spent an awful lot of time expanding His world to include listeners who were men, women, Jews, Greeks, Samaritans alike -- a much bigger social context than even his followers at first cared about. That's why at the end of His ministry He says, "Go into all the world." Seems pretty clear His vision was worldwide....

Also, since He came preaching a new Kingdom, new values, and new concepts (grace and forgiveness in the face of restrictive laws) -- values and concepts drastically out of step with the time in which He lived already -- one can probably assume that His teachings weren't just for that time, since we still have such trouble implementing them today. Further, Jesus says in John 8 that "If you hold to my teaching, you are truly my disciples. Then you shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free." Jesus points to Himself as the arbiter of Truth. This is important, especially since Jesus found Himself in an unprecedented period of Hellenism -- a period similar to our own postmodernism -- where traditional Judaism was being diluted by influences from Greek and Roman thought, in addition to the influence of other smaller sects. In the midst of a period where people had a variety of options to choose from, Jesus did not preach the teaching of others, or equate other teachers with Himself. Rather, He set Himself up as the standard.

More than that, the method of salvation couldn't simply apply to that time either. Heb 13:8 says, "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever." If Jesus was the Christ, the Son of God (being by very nature God), then God's nature and character also do not change -- therefore, why would the method of salvation? The phrase "once for all" occurs repeatedly throughout the books of Romans, Hebrews, 1 Peter, and Jude in relation to Christ's death. It seems pretty clear that Jesus died once, and it was enough.

Sorry for the message....
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Old 05-23-2005, 01:23 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by nathan1977


Jesus spent an awful lot of time expanding His world to include listeners who were men, women, Jews, Greeks, Samaritans alike -- a much bigger social context than even his followers at first cared about. That's why at the end of His ministry He says, "Go into all the world." Seems pretty clear His vision was worldwide....
Yes but don't you find it a little odd that an all knowing all powerful God would leave it up to humans to spread the message? I mean it's been 2000 years and it still hasn't gotten everywhere. I just find it odd that the "only way" is actually very limited for such a powerful God.
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Old 05-31-2005, 06:38 PM   #15
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Recent statisitics show that Christianity is growing in more places more than ever before. Sure, there are still very, very remote places where people have never heard of Jesus, but that doesn't indicate any limitation of God. It all takes time. Africa, for example, was totally unexplored and untouched by missionaries until just a couple centuries ago. Now, Christianity is one of the fastest-growing religions on the continent, if not THE fastest-growing religion.

Jesus spread the message while he was here, and then he left it up to us to do the rest.

P.S. - I'm glad Bono finally spelled out his beliefs so that people don't have to debate the whole is-he-or-isn't-he thing anymore.
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