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Old 03-09-2011, 08:23 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by nathan1977 View Post
NPR asked just this question in a recent article.
Murder Case Puts Spotlight On Abortion Clinic Rules : NPR

Increasing safety regulations, particularly when dealing with a surgical procedure like abortion, would address this, but such regulations would bump up against the real or perceived increase in costs of running such facilities, as well as the real or perceived infringement on reproductive rights.
I wasn't talking about abortion at all. I was talking about health care they provide for women- such as birth control, STD related care, cancer screenings, pap tests, pelvic exams, mammograms, etc.
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Old 03-09-2011, 08:38 AM   #92
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If you believe that a fetus is a living being, like I do, then performing an abortion violates the Hippocratic Oath, no matter how you look at it.
remember, we were talking about the morning-after pill here...
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Old 03-10-2011, 12:08 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by MrsSpringsteen View Post
I was talking about health care they provide for women- such as birth control, STD related care, cancer screenings, pap tests, pelvic exams, mammograms, etc.
...Health care offered by tens of thousands of OB/GYNs and hospitals around the country, many of them at free or reduced rates for women in need.
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Old 03-11-2011, 02:50 PM   #94
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Jezebel.com spoke with retired provider Dr. Suzanne Poppema about the future of abortion, the potential consequences of defunding Planned Parenthood and how the climate of shame around abortion actually leads to more unsafe clinics.

Jezebel: Celebrity, Sex, Fashion for Women. Without Airbrushing.

The whole thing is a good read, but I wanted to specifically call out this.

On how to fight against unsafe clinics like Kermit Gosnell's:

The way to prevent that is to make abortion and good reproductive healthcare more available to more people. People go to a clinic like that because they think it's cheaper, and so I think that all insurance and all Medicaid [...] should cover both birth control and abortion. [...] And abortion is so regulated that we've had patients who came and said, "I know this is illegal but I still need to have this done." [...] So if you think it's illegal anyway, then you might as well go to a cheap one, so then we're back to the cost issue. [...] And then because women think it's a bad thing, and it's shameful, etc., they go to a clinic that looks awful, that doesn't seem professional at all, and they're not scared away. [...] Women don't expect to be treated with compassion, intelligence, professionalism, and good care when they're seeking abortion care. That's not okay.
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Old 03-18-2011, 02:18 PM   #95
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Jesus Christ.

GOP Bill Would Force IRS to Conduct Abortion Audits | Mother Jones

"In some cases, the law would forbid using tax benefits—like credits or deductions—to pay for abortions or health insurance that covers abortion. "

Or what about HSAs or FSAs? Could I not use my own damned money I'd set aside for health care costs?

Maybe I should just incorporate my uterus. Apparently then it would be worth protection.
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Old 03-20-2011, 11:12 PM   #96
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Could I not use my own damned money I'd set aside for health care costs?
No kidding. First they complain about other people's money possibly being used, but then they freak if we use our very own instead, so...what, then?

Yeah. That is about one of the STUPIDEST ideas ever. Fuck you, GOP.

Angela
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Old 04-07-2011, 11:12 PM   #97
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Seattle Post-Intelligencer, April 7
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[T]he Idaho House of Representatives passed legislation that bans abortions after 20 weeks of pregnancy. The law, which now heads to Gov. Butch Otter for signing, makes no exceptions for rape, incest, fetal abnormality, or the emotional health of the mother. The law allows post-20 week abortions only when a mother’s life or physical health is threatened.

...State Rep. Brent Crane, chief House sponsor, said the “hand of the Almighty” was guiding passage, adding: “His ways are higher than our ways. He has the ability to take difficult, tragic, horrific circumstances and then turn them into wonderful examples.”

The Idaho attorney general’s office has opined that the legislation is unconstitutional, violating the US Supreme Court’s 1973 Roe v. Wade decision on states’ limits on abortions before the fetus becomes viable.

Idaho has been down this route before...In 1990, the Idaho Legislature passed legislation that would have banned all abortions except in cases of rape reported to police within seven days, incest (if the victim was under 18), severe fetal deformity or threat to the physical health of the mother. Idaho’s last Democratic governor, Cecil Andrus, vetoed the bill even though a critic of abortion. “The bill before me clearly asserted that the life of the unborn child carried precedence over the life of the mother,” Andrus later wrote. “An element of equity and fairness—and, above all, compassion, was lacking.”
Personally, I support term limits on abortion as a political compromise, but Crane's "hand of the Almighty" dismissal of the case for exceptions here is vile. The Lord shall make an example of you for everyone else's edification and that is glorious, therefore your own experience is irrelevant.



(Also, can you imagine having a governor named Butch Otter? Think of the possibilities for disparagement...)
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Old 04-07-2011, 11:26 PM   #98
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Isn't this the legislation that is based on a fetus being able to feel pain at 20 weeks? From what I understand, that's debatable, that there's no actual scientific consensus on when a fetus can feel pain. But it wouldn't be the first bit of questionable data the anti-choicers chose to rally around to try and force their wills on women, so hey.

Oh, and you know what else causes the fetus to experience pain? BIRTH.
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Old 04-08-2011, 11:07 AM   #99
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All of the "in the womb" arguments just escape me.
I always will default to the fetus being a body part of the mother until it is born. Period.
This is one area where I don't care for nuance. My safe default to to the woman. It's between her, her body and whatever value system she lives by.

Should we do autopsies on fetuses to determine if the nervous system was advanced enough for it to feel pain?

Sorry lady, your fetus felt pain, let me read you your Miranda Rights.
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Old 04-08-2011, 12:01 PM   #100
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Not too far off from the proposed bill in Alabama (was it Alabama? it might have been another state, although I believe it was in the south) that miscarriages be investigated to make sure the woman didn't make it happen.

So ridiculous and heinous.
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Old 04-10-2011, 01:30 PM   #101
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I don't think many people (men?) realize how common miscarriages still are. It seems lately like 1 in 5 people I know or hear of getting pregnant miscarry. Some are very early on. What would there be to investigate? Some are like a heavy period. This is why most women still do not announce a pregnancy until they've reached a certain stage. For all of our advances in science and medicine, it is still so common. One family I used to babysit for had more miscarriages than they had children, and the mother was very healthy, a very careful person with no bad habits, wanted to be pregnant and have a large family, and was a nurse.
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Old 04-10-2011, 01:36 PM   #102
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YES.

This.
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Old 04-10-2011, 02:42 PM   #103
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At the end of the day, I look at the fetus as being part of the mother as well, until the little baby is slapped and the cord is cut.

Now, late-term abortions are not really something I support in most cases, but younger than that, let's get that f'in shrimp out of there and harvest its delicious stem cells to heal some folks in real need.

Should I dare bring up the contradiction that many conservatives don't want large, poverty-stricken families living off the system, yet equally want to deny the right of young women to prevent themselves from carrying a fetus to term that will put those women at a big disadvantage?
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Old 04-10-2011, 02:45 PM   #104
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Yes, I believe it's worth discussing (or at least expressing our outrage over) why so many conservatives only care about babies when they're still a fetus, often see women as little more than baby makers, and feel the need to put sarcastic quotation marks around the words "women's health."
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Old 04-10-2011, 05:16 PM   #105
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As somebody put it the other day - when are we going to be discussing men's health as a matter of social policy and fiscal responsibility?

Oh, never, right.
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