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Old 08-20-2008, 08:47 AM   #196
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“He just has to swallow hard and do what JFK did” in picking rival Lyndon Johnson in 1960, said the liberal activist and maverick presidential candidate.
Or Reagan/Bush in 1980. It's not all that unprecedented.

I can't imagine it being worse than Adams/Jefferson in 1796.
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Old 08-20-2008, 10:11 AM   #197
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On the news this morning there was a clip of Obama referring to his VP pick as "he" yesterday. So apparently it's a guy, unless he's just trying to fool us.
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Old 08-20-2008, 11:52 AM   #198
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I don't think it is Hillary simply because Obama hasn't done anything to lay out the foundation for her. I was watching to see over the last few months whether he would sort of put his "change" message in context and somehow include the Clintons in this sphere as well, saying that they brought change in the early 90s and can play a similar role in the new century, or some such. But he hasn't done or said anything like this so I would find it very surprising now if he picked her.

I am not opposed to her specifically as a VP, and truth be told I doubt he is either - it's Bill that's likely the sticking point.
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Old 08-20-2008, 12:01 PM   #199
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I don't think it is Hillary simply because Obama hasn't done anything to lay out the foundation for her. I was watching to see over the last few months whether he would sort of put his "change" message in context and somehow include the Clintons in this sphere as well, saying that they brought change in the early 90s and can play a similar role in the new century, or some such. But he hasn't done or said anything like this so I would find it very surprising now if he picked her.

I am not opposed to her specifically as a VP, and truth be told I doubt he is either - it's Bill that's likely the sticking point.
I agree completely...
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Old 08-20-2008, 12:34 PM   #200
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Again, Biden should be the choice.

What has Evan Bayh done in comparison to Biden? The only reason to pick him over Biden is the perception that having him on the ticket will give Obama a better chance of winning Indiana and maybe Ohio.

Biden is the most qualified, the most experienced of the candidates by a large margin. He's got the most gravitas. And the fact that he's a 'New England liberal' doesn't hurt either.
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Old 08-20-2008, 12:52 PM   #201
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I don't think it is Hillary simply because Obama hasn't done anything to lay out the foundation for her.
..
he does not have to vet her, he (they) know her (them) inside and out.

and Kennedy and Reagan both shocked when they chose their bitter rival, runner-up



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Originally Posted by BonoVoxSupastar View Post
I agree completely...

I don't disagree with anything you both are saying

and you probably are right.

I did post yesterday, I expect it to be Biden.


and I am TIVOing South Park so I don't miss the announcement.



But, if this is solely, or mostly about getting a more sure win in November, Hillary would be best to have on the ticket.


Whatever friction exist between Obama and the Clintons, is is less than 1/3 of what existed between LBJ and JFK in 1960. I will even venture to say that Bush 1 and Regan had a bigger gap than Obama and the Clintons.


As for Bill Clinton being the problem, that is just silly. Once Obama is elected, he very easily could sideline Bill.
And if you think he is not capable, you are supporting someone that does not have the skills to be President.


Obama's biggest danger is that his circle of advisers, that did manage to capture a Democratic Nomination for him, are still influencing him in what now is the "real world'.
Sure, they got him though 'grade school'. We are beyond that now.
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:03 PM   #202
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Two Against The One
By MAUREEN DOWD

WASHINGTON

In the dead of night in a small hideaway office in the deserted Capitol, a clandestine meeting takes place between two senators with one goal.

They grin at each other as they lift their celebratory shots of brutally cold Stolichnaya.

“Our toast to The One,” they say in unison, “is that he’s toast.”

“Obama should have picked you, Hillary,” John McCain tells her. “It isn’t fair, my friend. But it just makes it easier for me to whup him.”

“Don’t worry, John, I’ve put it behind me,” Hillary replies. “I’m looking toward the future now, a future that looks very bright, once we send Twig Legs back to the back bench.”

They chortle with delight.

“He’s a bright young man, but he got ahead of himself,” McCain says. “He needs to be taught a lesson, and we’re the ones to do it. Have you seen the new Bloomberg poll? Obama’s dropped and we’re even again. The Bullet’s getting all the credit, but you and I know, Hillary, that it’s these top-secret counseling sessions we’re having. And thanks again for BlackBerrying me the Rick Warren questions while I was in the so-called cone of silence.”

“Oh, John, you know I love you and I’m happy to help,” Hillary says. “The themes you took from me are working great — painting Obama as an elitist and out-of-touch celebrity, when we’re rich celebrities, too. Turning his big rallies and pretty words into character flaws, charging him with playing the race card — that one always cracks me up. And accusing the media, especially NBC, of playing favorites. It’s easy to get the stupid press to navel-gaze; they’re so insecure.”

“They’re all pinko Commies,” McCain laughs. “Especially since they deserted me for The Messiah. Seriously, Hill, that Paris-Britney ad you came up with was brilliant. I owe you.”

Looking pleased, Hillary expertly downs another shot. “His secret fear is being seen as a dumb blonde,” she says. “He wants to take a short cut to the top and pose on glossy magazine covers, but he doesn’t want to be seen as a glib pretty boy.”

McCain lifts his glass to her admiringly. “If I do say so myself, while the rookie was surfing in Hawaii, I ate his pupus for lunch. Pictures of him pushing around a golf ball while I’m pushing around Putin. Priceless.”

“I have a little secret to tell you about that, John. Bill made it happen. He loves you so much. He called Putin and told him that if he invaded Georgia, he could count on being invited to the Clinton Global Initiative every year for the rest of his life.”

“Wow. Should I call him? I saw your husband’s kind words about me in Las Vegas on Monday, saying I’d be just as good as Obama on climate change.”

“I think he’d like that,” Hillary smiles. “He’s still boiling at Obama. And you don’t have to worry about my army of angry women. We’ve spread the word in the feminist underground — as opposed to that wacky Obama Weather Underground — that ‘catharsis’ is code for ‘No surrender.’ My gals know when I say ‘We may have started on two separate paths but we’re on one journey now’ that Skinny’s journey is to the nearest exit.”

“But Obama’s says he’s finally ready to hit back,” McCain says, frowning. “He’s starting a blistering TV campaign and attacking me for attacking his patriotism.”

“Now, John, you know that every time he tries to get tough, he quickly runs out of gas. Sometimes in debates, he’d be exhausted by the third question. He must use up all his energy in the gym. He doesn’t have any stamina, and he certainly doesn’t have our bloodlust. Besides, you can throw that Mark Penn stuff at him that I couldn’t use in a Democratic primary about how he’s not fundamentally American in his thinking and values. While he’s up on his high-minded pedestal, you’ll scoot past him in your Ferragamos.”

“How can I ever thank you, my friend?”

“You can announce that you won’t be running for re-election because you’d be 76, and you can pick somebody really lame to run with, like your pal Lieberman. That means one term for you, and two for me.”

“It’s a deal,” McCain says, sticking out his hand to shake on it. “That was inspired to snatch his convention away — makes him look so weak. Listen, why don’t you stop in Sedona on the way to Denver? Wear a black wig and I’ll spirit you up to the cabin for the night. I’ll catch a catfish in the mill pond and grill it for you. It will be an adventure.” There’s a knock on the door. Jesse Jackson sticks his head into the meeting.

“Is it over?” he asks his co-conspirators.

“Yes, he’s over,” they respond in unison.


oh, MoDo.
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:21 PM   #203
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As for Bill Clinton being the problem, that is just silly. Once Obama is elected, he very easily could sideline Bill.
And if you think he is not capable, you are supporting someone that does not have the skills to be President.
I don't think Hillary could sideline Bill.

And I have long gotten the sense that she was not 100% okay with everything he did/said back in the primary.

My feeling is that Bill feels slighted over how he was perceived in the primary (esp. the race stuff), but I think he was also honest when he said the wished that he hadn't done certain things. So if he could not be sidelined for and by his wife....should I assume she doesn't have the skills to be President either?

Like I said, I'm not opposed to Hillary being VP at all. I am not a fan of Biden because I think he suffers from the foot-in-mouth disease a lot and that is something that they can't gamble with. But oh well, nobody is asking me anyway!
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:27 PM   #204
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But oh well, nobody is asking me anyway!
I'd ask you.

I like conversing with you.
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:30 PM   #205
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I think too much - and chemicals have turned my brain into a sponge.

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oh, MoDo.
/\ that may be a fun exercise in creative writing.

and will win some favor with people that are 'blinded' by their hatred of all things "Clinton".

but, anyone with moderate intelligence will not take it seriously.

why? just too many moving parts.


my theory for a McCain win, and it is only my theory.
but, it is more plausible. imho.

why? less moving parts.

and it is almost entirely contingent upon McCain's actions, alone.

here it is:

McCain surprises with his V P nomination, Mitt Romney.

and he pledges to serve only one term.

1. Romney won over many conservatives during the GOP primary

2. A couple of things about those Mormons, they are anti- gay marriage and strong pro-life (something the conservatives seem to agree with? maybe? )

now here is the part that you may need to prepare yourself for.


3. with the one term pledge from McCain and Romney as the V P, who would be the likely GOP nominee in 2012 ????? one guess >>>>> Romney

but he is a smelly Mormon

the Democratic Nominee would have a cakewalk

and who would the Democratic nominee be?

not Obama, he is a loser


I wonder who ???



Now, who will win the most if Romney if the nominee ????


Will PUMAS like the McCain/ Romney ticket / pledge, could some (just enough) even cast a vote for 2012 in 2008?


(it is kind of like chess, a lot of strategy and planning 5 moves ahead. )
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:31 PM   #206
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I am not a fan of Biden because I think he suffers from the foot-in-mouth disease a lot and that is something that they can't gamble with.
I would argue that that is a good thing. His foot gets in his mouth not out of stupidity or lack of knowledge but out of his tendency to speak off the cuff, off the top of his head. This, to me, makes him come across to be more like a real person, whose every word isn't calculated to please this group or that group.
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:36 PM   #207
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Biden - a typical white person, just like Grandma !

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I would argue that that is a good thing. His foot gets in his mouth not out of stupidity or lack of knowledge but out of his tendency to speak off the cuff, off the top of his head. This, to me, makes him come across to be more like a real person, whose every word isn't calculated to please this group or that group.

It will be fun to watch him introduce Obama,

Quote:
Barack Obama, "the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy."
or

Quote:
This isn't his first such lapse: In another unguarded moment last summer, Biden said, "You cannot go to a 7-Eleven or a Dunkin Donuts [in Delaware] unless you have a slight Indian accent."

is there more here than meets the eye?

Is Obama going after those "gun clinging" and "religion clinging" Hillary voters?
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:37 PM   #208
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oh, MoDo.
I read that earlier today. It was a funny piece. Almost posted it myself.
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:40 PM   #209
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Originally Posted by deep View Post
/\ that may be a fun exercise in creative writing.

and will win some favor with people that are 'blinded' by their hatred of all things "Clinton".

but, anyone with moderate intelligence will not take it seriously.

why? just too many moving parts.


my theory for a McCain win, and it is only my theory.
but, it is more plausible. imho.

why? less moving parts.

and it is almost entirely contingent upon McCain's actions, alone.

here it is:

McCain surprises with his V P nomination, Mitt Romney.

and he pledges to serve only one term.

1. Romney won over many conservatives during the GOP primary

2. A couple of things about those Mormons, they are anti- gay marriage and strong pro-life (something the conservatives seem to agree with? maybe? )

now here is the part that you may need to prepare yourself for.


3. with the one term pledge from McCain and Romney as the V P, who would be the likely GOP nominee in 2012 ????? one guess >>>>> Romney

but he is a smelly Mormon

the Democratic Nominee would have a cakewalk

and who would the Democratic nominee be?

not Obama, he is a loser


I wonder who ???



Now, who will win the most if Romney if the nominee ????


Will PUMAS like the McCain/ Romney ticket / pledge, could some (just enough) even cast a vote for 2012 in 2008?


(it is kind of like chess, a lot of strategy and planning 5 moves ahead. )



after all that,

i think you and i both agree

that the Clintons are pulling for McCain.
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Old 08-20-2008, 01:42 PM   #210
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I read that earlier today. It was a funny piece. Almost posted it myself.


i posted it for it's entertainment value. i'm pretty sure that the Clintons are trying to play this both ways, that they'll have to seem like they're supporting Obama, but, yes, they do want McCain to win.

because it's always, always about them.

and some of us were Clinton fans up until February of 2008.
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