New Album Discussion 1 - Songs of..... - Unreasonable guitar album

[Headache in a Suitcase]

it's $4.16 per month - which gets me a gift (eventually) and, when they tour, tickets.

i understand full well why people would still not want to do it and think it's a waste of time and money.

That said - it's not expensive. And simp is a bit much.

 

[Rich79]

As long as it helps the music continue...

 

[The Disciple]

I might be talking about something else entirely, but I do remember video footage of the sessions that were released before the album. I believe the footage came from a Daniel Lanois documentary, but I could be mistaken. The things that stand out in my memory are Bono singing an as-yet-unreleased song called "Tripoli" (which was apparently turned into Fez, though I don't hear the connection), and then a version of Unknown Caller. I remember being *really* excited for Unknown Caller, as I thought the chorus on the Lanois documentary sounded huge. The album version ended up sounding not so huge, and they really committed to the Apple/cell phone terminology (you know the name, so punch it in, force quit and move to trash). The original version, if I recall, was "You know the name, so shout it out." More importantly, the song sounded through the documentary as if it had more lift, dynamically speaking. The chorus sounded bigger. I remember listening to the NLOTH wondering when it was going to take off, and it just never did.

Yeah I think some of the chorus lyrics are:
“Restart and forgive yourself, come back to me.
Shout for joy, on every street.”

 

[ChurchBay]

Lately I've been watching / listening to shows from this era (Irving Plaza, Brit Awards 2001, Live From Boston) and there's a real sense of humility from the pre-tour shows they played. Bono's line "we're reauditioning for the biggest band in the world job" sums it up nicely, they were showing their worth in smaller settings and playing the corporate game by appearing on TV spots that they'd previously avoided. There was real effort in earning back the fans they'd lost along the way, and with Beautiful Day they had a brand-new evergreen classic to offer.

Compare that to the victory lap of the Bomb era. As a fan it was great to see them swagger back with the in-your-face buzz of Vertigo and making every appearance aa capital E Event. But looking back at Bono's demeanor at the time, I can see why it pissed a lot of people off. He found the venn diagram between cocky and cheesy, and swallowed it down like a haloumi baked zinger burger. Live8 performance was a banger though.

Side note on Live8, had some extended family over for a BBQ a few weeks ago and none of the 20 somethings had ever heard of it. It's been 20 years (!), are we due for another?

I totally agree. I fell in love with U2 around Atomic Bomb but re-watching some of the videos of Bono's antics on stage makes me cringe and glad I wasn't so aware of what was happening on that show. The whole 'coexist' blindfold stuff was just manna from heaven for his detractors. Banging the drum at the end of Love and Peace or Else like a ridiculous wind up monkey toy. Good mother of lord. And then there's individual moments from other shows picking out a fan for being on their phone. It's ok to tell them to put their phone away. Not ok to then mock them. Also seems to be the tour where he thought he could start preaching over the introduction of Streets. Just let the fans have that moment for themselves without Bono having to define it.

If I was Edge I'd have swung my guitar in his direction numerous times in one show, let alone the tour itself.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

"Wind up monkey toy" LOL

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Fan club membership is still cheaper than eggs, when you average it out monthly

 

[Zoo_Fly]

Yeah I think some of the chorus lyrics are:
“Restart and forgive yourself, come back to me.
Shout for joy, on every street.”

This is the clip from the Lanois doc. It was recorded at the TIFF screening so no video, just audio. Im assuming the actual video is available somewhere.

 

[namkcuR]

This is the clip from the Lanois doc. It was recorded at the TIFF screening so no video, just audio. Im assuming the actual video is available somewhere.

Thanks for posting. That just sounds so much better than the force quit/move to trash stuff. I'd love for that version to get an official release, but I'm not holding my breath. The band seems poised to bury NLOTH even deeper than Pop.

There's been one single performance of one song from the album since the end of 360(at least Elevation Tour had five Pop songs in semi-regular rotation at one point or another, Discotheque got a brief revival on the Vertigo Tour, and SATS was played on E+I). The album got no representation on SOS(Pop got IGWSHA).

 

[Irvine511]

It’s not even just the lyrics, this earlier version sounds much more buoyant and joyful, a potential classic. So much of NLOTH feels like it’s stuck in mud. There’s a lugubriousness to the album that’s odd, even in the widely hated Middle 3.

 

[dan_smee]

Ah the Tripoli clip. Such potential. I don’t care what anyone says about the song “Tripoli” becoming Fez - that is not the same song.

 

[The_acrobat]

Ah the Tripoli clip. Such potential. I don’t care what anyone says about the song “Tripoli” becoming Fez - that is not the same song.

Wow I haven't heard that clip in such a long time! But you're right, not the same song! And some reviews leading up to the album's release had "Tripoli" listed as a song title. As well as Every Breaking Wave and Winter.

 

[U2387]

This is the clip from the Lanois doc. It was recorded at the TIFF screening so no video, just audio. Im assuming the actual video is available somewhere.

Good work finding that! Thank you.

I remember that clip being one of the first things I heard when I joined here in January 2008.

It was described as an epic chorus in an overall uplifting track and I remember it launched my year long excitement for NLOTH.

I enjoyed the album at first, but it came nowhere near my expectations.

I remember my 360 shows in 2009 being disappointed at how the NLOTH songs hit live and their decision to stick with so many of them.

2011, with the AB focused greatest hits sets, were some of my favorite U2 shows! Saw 2 unreal performances in Montreal and Philadelphia. Also, my brother, a casual fan at best, was at the Salt Lake show and absolutely raved about it. I remember he woke me up at 4am with a phone call about it.

Sure, SOI was a huge missed opportunity, but to my ears, that was mostly marketing strategy. The false start/ trip back to the drawing board after the relative success of Ordinary Love and Invisible. Big missed opportunity when there was actually some appetite for new U2 in the general public. Then the whole I Phone debacle and Bono's injury. There was some tinkering , second guessing and overcooking for sure, but I think the final product, sonically and lyrically, still reflects what they were going for when they started. Very cohesive and I felt the tour especially showed that. They at least knew what they were going for and followed through.

NLOTH feels like the far bigger missed opportunity from an artistic standpoint. No one really knows what they were trying to do here and by the time the promo got going, that seemed to include the band themselves. Probably a big part of why it's less acknowledged than Pop by them.

Just listening to every clip posted above and recalling the "beach clips." The difference from early stages to final product is way more striking than I remember. I know these aren't the best quality, but songs that were missing something in their final form, namely Magnificent, Breathe and Unknown Caller, sound much more natural and like they came from the same organic place as Moment of Surrender.

 

[dan_smee]

Not to mention Diorama. That beach clip sounds way more chill/organic than crazy tonight

 

[ascender_RS]

it's $4.16 per month - which gets me a gift (eventually) and, when they tour, tickets.

i understand full well why people would still not want to do it and think it's a waste of time and money.

That said - it's not expensive. And simp is a bit much.

I've renewed - the first lyrics book was good and I've always got tickets for shows, so I'm happy to carry on for the cost, have an occasional grumble about the service but keep renewing.

 

[wolbersu2]

I've renewed my membership. After two books I hope for a cd/blu ray /dvd with rare material. Please nothing to do with Sphere, unless it's a concert video or audio.
Vinyl is allright if they let people choose between vinyl or cd/dvd/br. A download is allright WITH a physical release.

 

[JWR1992]

I've renewed my membership. After two books I hope for a cd/blu ray /dvd with rare material. Please nothing to do with Sphere, unless it's a concert video or audio.
Vinyl is allright if they let people choose between vinyl or cd/dvd/br. A download is allright WITH a physical release.

You will get lithograms of 1981 era U2 and you will like it

 

[mikal]

Actually question. If I renew, will my old gifts still be available to download? My I&E Live got corrupted and I need to download it again.

 

[dan_smee]

Not wanting to be opportunistic in the face of chaotic evil, but Bono’s post on socials about Ukraine had a pointed message at the end “more to say about this and other bewilderments later”

Could they actually make a real political album again that doesn’t dance around the problems or seem like angry rich people appropriating the fights of others?

 

[DeVaul]

Could they actually make a real political album again that doesn’t dance around the problems or seem like angry rich people appropriating the fights of others?

Their pussyfooting around on JT30 was massively disappointing. E&I could’ve used some more moments of blunt reality. Do they even have the guts to be unpopular with half the olds after coming off the successful reengagement of Sphere?

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i don't think showing Charlottesville, or the Macphisto skits, was pussyfooting around it.

on JT30 - yea, i think they could have gone a bit harder - around Bullet. the western video before Exit was fairly direct - but generally yes, i think they could have done more.

I will say this... I imagine Bono is going through one at the moment. everything that he dedicated the last 20-30 years of his life. all of it. the use of his celebrity as currency to earn favor with politicians that he would rather not be dealing with... it's all gone. all of the positives that came out of that have evaporated over night. USAID. Pepfar. it's all gone. Trump and Musk have ended all of his work in less than a month.

gone. all of it.

i couldn't imagine the anger and grief that he must be going through seeing all of the things that he's spent his non U2 time on just evaporate over night thanks to two people.

so yea - if there was ever a time for angry, political bono was going to come out - now would be that time. not saying that it is, or that it will - but it's certainly the right moment for it.

 

[Irvine511]

I thought i/e was the most overtly political tour I’ve seen by them.

 

[The John Tree]

Ah the Tripoli clip. Such potential. I don’t care what anyone says about the song “Tripoli” becoming Fez - that is not the same song.

Agreed. Unless it took some *very* wild turns, it's hard to see the genesis between this clip and what would become Fez. I can only assume that Bono had decided prior to the sessions that he'd like to try writing from the perspective of characters, and Tripoli was probably a location he wanted to fit into the songs. As a result, I'm sure he tried to shoehorn it into the early versions of many songs, similar to "Wake Up Dead Man."

This is the clip from the Lanois doc. It was recorded at the TIFF screening so no video, just audio. Im assuming the actual video is available somewhere.

Yes! Thank you for finding this.

It's funny what the mind can do. My main problem with the song is it doesn't have enough dynamic "lift," and I'd always quite preferred this version of the chorus. I put much of the blame at Larry's feet. Though listening to it again, years later, it seems as if the backing track is more or less what we got on the album. It's just muddled and so our minds can fill in the blanks and make it sound better than it actually does. I still prefer this version of the chorus, though I have to admit the memory I had of it was bigger than it actually was.

Same thing happened to Miracle Drug. I still like the song, but my imagination ran wild with the beach clip.

 

[The John Tree]

I will say this... I imagine Bono is going through one at the moment. everything that he dedicated the last 20-30 years of his life. all of it. the use of his celebrity as currency to earn favor with politicians that he would rather not be dealing with... it's all gone. all of the positives that came out of that have evaporated over night. USAID. Pepfar. it's all gone. Trump and Musk have ended all of his work in less than a month.

gone. all of it.

i couldn't imagine the anger and grief that he must be going through seeing all of the things that he's spent his non U2 time on just evaporate over night thanks to two people.

What's worse for him is that he did all this great work by extending an olive branch to conservatives and ate a *whole bunch of shit* for it from left leaning fans (and even bandmates) during the height of the Iraq War. Yet he was able to persevere and make the point that through communication, he was able to convince the Republicans to put aside our differences and accomplish life changing work for those in need.

How far away does that feel now? Light years.

 

[trevgreg]

Just listening to every clip posted above and recalling the "beach clips." The difference from early stages to final product is way more striking than I remember. I know these aren't the best quality, but songs that were missing something in their final form, namely Magnificent, Breathe and Unknown Caller, sound much more natural and like they came from the same organic place as Moment of Surrender.

I'll say that it is interesting hearing some of these again years later, after trying my hand at songwriting in that time since.

I'll throw my perspective out there in saying that some of these jam sessions do sound pretty cool. But that said, it's worth keeping in mind that most of these clips come about before the million decisions that come in finalizing a track into a 3-8 minute song. Take the Magnificent clip, for example. The tribal-sounding drums and Edge's unused guitar part are definitely standouts and seem to have a pretty interesting mix going on. That said, we don't hear are the attempts to apply a song structure or lyric on top of it. So I can't really get behind an idea that this instrumental should have automatically made the final version. It's quite possible the band and producers beat themselves up trying to make that or other sounds "work" and make an album. But if it's not coming naturally, you take stuff out or put other stuff in, and try to get something going where it is a listenable product. And that's before you even consider mixing and mastering!

Now take the Unknown Caller chorus. I don't disagree that the toplining Bono's trying to do in the clip does sound like a better direction than the final product. And while I don't hate that final chorus like some other fans do, it is a bit awkward to say the least. But again, while I do think there was potentially other ways to go about it to make it a truly epic U2 song, I can also imagine Bono or Edge struggling to find the right words to put in a better melody. Or coming back to the song with a different chorus and thinking "This just doesn't work." It doesn't necessarily make me think the final chorus is great or the best one possible, but I can sympathize with the thought process behind it a bit more.

That and it's really not hard at all for most musicians or bands to throw out terrific sounding instrumentals all day. Even for home-grown musicians that can't afford an engineer or producer, you can play around with a guitar or DAW program - then just find a chord progression, some presets that sound nice, and have something that sounds pretty interesting going in minutes. The real struggle is turning it into an arrangement that works... AND, at least in the case of acts like this one, coming up with a decent vocal/lyric over it. Moment of Surrender sounds like it was a song that just worked for everyone right away. But 99 percent of the time, it doesn't work that way!

But yeah, that's sort of my thinking. While the band (or fans) can second guess all day on these things, the clips or initial recordings do give a great insight as to how things came about. But it can't really show a firm path to what was missed exactly or what should have somehow happened. It's fun to speculate, but I'd probably leave it that!

 

[Registered Dude]

Not to mention Diorama. That beach clip sounds way more chill/organic than crazy tonight

yeah this is one hill I'll die on.



Ok - the quality is TERRIBLE (the beachiest of the beach clips) so we cant really trust our ears. But I hear the makings of a song much less forced sounding than what we got. With some nice chill wooah-oh-ohs instead of so many hiiiiiiiiiiiiiillllllllllls and mountaiiiiiiiiiiiiins (though we still get a bit of that)

and then I remember this interview with Lanois... "It always had a great vibe to it. In our absence, the U2 lads reworked the song and it became what you are hearing now." I'd like to think he's throwing some subtle shade there..

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i miss beach clips

 

[Registered Dude]

Me too


Interesting aside - recent post on their Instagram features some unreleased music and musings about the third anniversary of the invasion of Ukraine. Post caption suggests Bono has “more to say about this and other bewilderments later”

 

[MattD]

Not wanting to be opportunistic in the face of chaotic evil, but Bono’s post on socials about Ukraine had a pointed message at the end “more to say about this and other bewilderments later”

Could they actually make a real political album again that doesn’t dance around the problems or seem like angry rich people appropriating the fights of others?

If his sixth form Zelensky poem for Nancy Pelosi is anything to go by, then we're in for a treat...

 

[MattD]

Me too


Interesting aside - recent post on their Instagram features some unreleased music and musings about the third anniversary of the invasion of Ukraine. Post caption suggests Bono has “more to say about this and other bewilderments later”

If he could write lyrics inspired by Shevchenko, or like 90s Bono, wow that would be something. Generally that vibe - that ruminating, reflective, mellow vibe - is a far better look for them than 'yer da's midlife crisis' chart baiting bellowing of Get Out Your Own Way.

 

[Registered Dude]

Not wanting to be opportunistic in the face of chaotic evil, but Bono’s post on socials about Ukraine had a pointed message at the end “more to say about this and other bewilderments later”

Could they actually make a real political album again that doesn’t dance around the problems or seem like angry rich people appropriating the fights of others?

Ooop - missed that you posted this.. and here I thought I was breaking news!