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Basstrap 11-18-2002 09:54 AM

World Peace
 
it's a cliche to talk about world peace, but does anyone actually think it will happen.

it's so discouraging for me...there is so much hate in the world
everywhere you look there is a disgusting reek of unforgiving hate

mankind has little hope as I see it

will there ever be a day when the arab people love america and want to visit there and see disney land?
I find it hard to believe...they hate the west so much, and many people here hate them just as much

between arabs and jews

it seems like every country in the world has a rival whom they hate

It's a sad world and if there ever comes a time when everybody loves everybody (which is the only thing that will make world peace possible) it will be a divine intervention from God.

melon 11-18-2002 10:05 AM

As long as there are humans, there will never be world peace.

Even in the animal kingdom, there is never peace for long...

Melon

Sparkysgrrrl 11-18-2002 04:29 PM

I just hope for a day when Disneyland isn't an ideal place to want to come.

Moonlit_Angel 11-18-2002 07:01 PM

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

That pretty much sums up what I think.

Angela

LarryMullen's POPAngel 11-18-2002 07:20 PM

:hug:


I love that song, Moonlit_Angel.

U2Bama 11-18-2002 09:53 PM

I dream of and pray for world peace; it would be a great thing.

Unfortunately reality sets in, and a lyric from Metallica often rings true:

So be it, threaten no more;
To secure peace is to prepare for war.


~U2Alabama

Moonlit_Angel 11-18-2002 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by LarryMullen's_POPAngel
:hug:


I love that song, Moonlit_Angel.

Me, too. It's a great song. :).

Angela

STING2 11-19-2002 03:01 AM

With the ongoing spread of democracy and capitilism around the world in addition to other positive aspects of globalization, will have world peace in 100 to 300 years. Thats about how long it will take to bring the rest of the third world to around the level of the first world. Of course I think there will still be crime because were still human, but, I would not define that as war. Economic growth and diverse economic interdependence often has a way of ending and preventing conflict.

hiphop 11-19-2002 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by STING2
With the ongoing spread of democracy and capitilism around the world in addition to other positive aspects of globalization, will have world peace in 100 to 300 years. Thats about how long it will take to bring the rest of the third world to around the level of the first world. Of course I think there will still be crime because were still human, but, I would not define that as war. Economic growth and diverse economic interdependence often has a way of ending and preventing conflict.
I doubt that. As you can see in the thread about "development policies", post - industrialization in third world countries doesnīt help to raise the Human Development Index. As long as the gap between central and peripheral countries stays that high, the 2 billion people who live in absolute poverty will want more. And first world countries will keep needing (sometimes stealing, sometimes underpaying) the resources of the third world; to be able to continue that practise, we will have to engage in regional conflicts with states who donīt play by our rules immediately.

Already 40 years ago the same arguments about capitalism, that was expected to benefit everyone, were being used with India, like I have stated. So how can you use the same wrong phrases again and again, STING2?

Ongoing speed of democracy and capitalism - what should the millions of people in India say, who died of hunger in the last forty years? Donīt you think some conflicts could arise from that situation?

Basstrap 11-19-2002 10:53 AM

It's true, people here in the west think our model will work for everybody but it isn't the truth

if anything, attempts to capitalize and "democrasize" the third world only leads to exploitation of the poor there. Sweatshops being an example. Business people see these places as cheap places to set up and the politicians in the third world are so corrupt it makes ours look like Jesus.

THe more we try to impose our systems on them the more the arab countries and other countires will hate us.
It's people like sting, blinded by the government and by the holy "capitalism" model, who don't understand why they all hate us so much over there anyway, and that propogating our view of how the world "should" be only leads to more hate.

we want peace? we have to learn to live in harmony with other ways of living NOT trying to assimilate everyone into the United States

joyfulgirl 11-19-2002 10:58 AM

This is the world of conflict and duality. Always has been, always will be. Doesn't hurt to try, though, because it can always be better, I suppose. I think the best we can do is strive for peace within ourselves and hope that that reflects outwardly in the world around us.

nbcrusader 11-19-2002 11:32 AM

Re: World Peace
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Basstrap
It's a sad world and if there ever comes a time when everybody loves everybody (which is the only thing that will make world peace possible) it will be a divine intervention from God.
*waiting patiently for the Second Coming of Christ*

We will never achieve peace on our own.

bonosloveslave 11-19-2002 11:35 AM

Re: Re: World Peace
 
Quote:

Originally posted by nbcrusader


*waiting patiently for the Second Coming of Christ*

We will never achieve peace on our own.

Me too - but I feel more :hyper: than patient!

cass 11-19-2002 02:24 PM

define PEACE...one would hope, even though we are well and truly
 
part of the animal kingdom, that we can use our power of thought, our gift of compassion and hopefully our sense of right and wrong to find a way to live co-operatively. We don't all have to agree on everything, but we should be able to co-operate for mutual benefit.

I think it depends which day of the week you ask me this..is there hope? I'm struggling too basstrap. I am so hurt and offended some days lately...because of the "current" drought in Oz( we have had them before...news to some) all the "experts" are now saying...LATEST BREAKING NEWS!! we must take care of our water cycle...as though they have just discovered the notion. All I can say is better late than never, but why o why leave it soooooooooo late.greed not ignorance I suspect and that is criminal imho to steal the future like that .
So for me, environmental damage concerns me perhaps more than conflict, there is absolutely nothing I can do to prevent that. It's obvious who will win at war....nobody. But when it's over....our poor poor mistreated mother, the Earth.

But we're it mate, the future makers, we have been born into an interesting era. So much wealth and potential poised with so much suffering. I think the change shall go to the wire, some people have taken to the their "clautrosphere's"( see Ben Elton's This Other Eden) and couldn't care less about the rest of us.

True, the bastards have new and improved grinders....but please, don't let them.
Best Wishes for 2003....stay warm :wave:

diamond 11-19-2002 02:24 PM

i m for the millenium program.
:)

The_Sweetest_Thing 11-19-2002 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Basstrap
we want peace? we have to learn to live in harmony with other ways of living NOT trying to assimilate everyone into the United States
:yes:


--------------------
I don't think we'll ever have peace. WE can't even have peace within nations, nevertheless, between them. Ex: Jerusalem, N Ireland. Geez man, people in Alberta hate people in Ontario :sexywink:

While peace is a lovely thought, it is not a foreseeable (sp?) reality.

Moonlit_Angel 11-19-2002 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Basstrap
It's true, people here in the west think our model will work for everybody but it isn't the truth

if anything, attempts to capitalize and "democrasize" the third world only leads to exploitation of the poor there. Sweatshops being an example. Business people see these places as cheap places to set up and the politicians in the third world are so corrupt it makes ours look like Jesus.

THe more we try to impose our systems on them the more the arab countries and other countires will hate us.
It's people like sting, blinded by the government and by the holy "capitalism" model, who don't understand why they all hate us so much over there anyway, and that propogating our view of how the world "should" be only leads to more hate.

we want peace? we have to learn to live in harmony with other ways of living NOT trying to assimilate everyone into the United States

Well said. Totally agree.

Angela

speedracer 11-19-2002 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Basstrap

THe more we try to impose our systems on them the more the arab countries and other countires will hate us.
It's people like sting, blinded by the government and by the holy "capitalism" model, who don't understand why they all hate us so much over there anyway, and that propogating our view of how the world "should" be only leads to more hate.

So how, pray tell, should countries like Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, North Korea, etc. be run?

STING2 11-19-2002 08:13 PM

Hiphop,

Economic development has yet to be correctly applied under the right conditions in many of the countries where you state such policies have failed. Many of the countries of Sub-Sarahan Africa are not resource rich and the first world does not get virtually all of its resources from the third world as you seem to suggest.

Arguements may have been made about India 40 years ago that it would develop, but in cases like India with a massive population already, it will take much more than the past 40 years to develop. India has yet to fully expand trade with the west to an extent that would be helpful. Both India and Pakistan have very little trade with the outside world, but this is changing.

You ignore countries like South Korea, Tawain, Singapore, and others that have made huge progress over the past 50 years.

If I was in India I would be concerned of the lack of trade with the west and concerned about the governments programs to prevent starvation. In addition to of course being worried about Islamic terrorist and possible war with Pakistan over its inability to stop terrorism in Kashmire.

Bottom line is that its going to take much more time than simply the past 40 years. In addition, the examples you cite do not constitute as a failure of western capitalism and democracy. This is going to be a long process but it will eventually be successful.

150 years ago, Ireland was as poor as any country you want to list in the third world. Today Ireland has a higher standard of living than the country that contributed to many of its problems 150 years ago, the United Kingdom. I was in Northern Ireland this past January and talked to many people there about the conflict. Most of them said the main reason for the decreasing tensions in Northern Ireland from where they were in the early 70s was the economic success of the whole Island in recent years. Unemployment of 30% was reduced to less 7% over most of Ireland including the North. This country has come a long way since my Great Great Grand Parents left there to come to the USA because of the poor conditions in the mid 1800s. It is an amazing and exciting place to live and work now. My parents and I are heading to Ireland next week for Thanksgiving, and I am sure my parents will be amazed by how much has changed.

STING2 11-19-2002 08:53 PM

Basstrap and Moonlit Angel,


"It's people like sting, blinded by the government and by the holy "capitalism" model, who don't understand why they all hate us so much over there anyway, and that propogating our view of how the world "should" be only leads to more hate."

Really? I'd be careful about making unbased assumptions about other people like this. You don't know me, or where I get my information from, or my education. Unless you want unbased assumptions made about you, I'd suggest you refrain from making them about others.


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