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BVS 07-04-2007 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


you haven't touched it. you just say it isn't good. how so? give me what you think is an alternative. i have given you mine

:huh: What? I say what isn't good?

You are the one that came up with the argument that it won't work due to population, well now back it up.

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


:huh: What? I say what isn't good?

You are the one that came up with the argument that it won't work due to population, well now back it up.

i did. more population, more workers, more costs, higher taxes, more confusion. where did you not get that?

BVS 07-04-2007 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


i did. more population, more workers, more costs, higher taxes, more confusion. where did you not get that?

:banghead: And it's been said, that it only makes sense that with larger populations you automatically get more workers and more costs, why do you keep ignoring that?

Your more confusion argument is just an opinion, you haven't backed that up, your larger company analogy didn't work.

Sorry, but you just don't have a great grasp on this one.

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


:banghead: And it's been said, that it only makes sense that with larger populations you automatically get more workers and more costs, why do you keep ignoring that?

Your more confusion argument is just an opinion, you haven't backed that up, your larger company analogy didn't work.

Sorry, but you just don't have a great grasp on this one.

you aren't backing your side up as well, simply saying that you don't think that. proof? where is an example of a large country the size of the us having universal health care, population wise?

look at what happened w/ the various oil companies a few years ago.

deep 07-04-2007 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


i did. more population, more workers, more costs, higher taxes, more confusion. where did you not get that?

How much real experience have you had with health care?

Are you paying for health insurance now?

I am 3 times your age.

And when I needed a hernia repair operation I had to wait 3 weeks to get it done.

and I had to pay around $4000 - $5000.

I live in California, Newport Beach to be exact. And I can tell you that having Health Care controlled and dealt out by for- profit insurance companies is about the least cost effective way to do it.

deep 07-04-2007 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx

look at what happened w/ the various oil companies a few years ago.

What
with favorable legislation from the Bush Administration the have made the most obscene profits in history?

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by deep


What
with favorable legislation from the Bush Administration the have made the most obscene profits in history?

enron

BVS 07-04-2007 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


you aren't backing your side up as well, simply saying that you don't think that. proof? where is an example of a large country the size of the us having universal health care, population wise?

What? That's your argument? Because there isn't one, it won't work? Moscow once didn't have a McDonald's...


This is how it works, you made the argument it's the burden of proof for you to back it up.


Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx

look at what happened w/ the various oil companies a few years ago.

So because some large companies had problems they all have problems? Sorry but you just aren't making sense.

BVS 07-04-2007 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


enron

Enron isn't an example of too large not working, it's an example of corruption.

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:23 PM

i backed my idea up w/ governmental agencies, all which have flopped. you haven't mentioned those.

BVS 07-04-2007 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx
i backed my idea up w/ governmental agencies, all which have flopped. you haven't mentioned those.
And it's your theory that these "failures" were due to the size of population?

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


And it's your theory that these "failures" were due to the size of population?

mismanagement, which is what i have been stating all along.

BVS 07-04-2007 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


mismanagement, which is what i have been stating all along.

No, your original argument was:

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx

i am not saying the healthcare system there is bad, but canada also has a lot less people than the US.

You were basing it on size.

Your correlations to the post office and Amtrack aren't quite fair. Technology changed those things, making them obsolete in many cases. Technology changed the medical field, but won't ever make it obsolete.

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


No, your original argument was:



You were basing it on size.

Your correlations to the post office and Amtrack aren't quite fair. Technology changed those things, making them obsolete in many cases. Technology changed the medical field, but won't ever make it obsolete.

universalizing health care will make many private companies go out of business b/c the prices of medicine will go down. the competitiveness for new drugs will dive and ultimately we will suffer.

we are just going to debate this on and on. i have stated my voice, you don't agree. universal health care won't happen anytime soon here. the democrats can lobby all they want, but the companies run this country, and it would be political suicide for them to do that. so, really think about what the potential candidates say regarding health care. if they say, "i am going to change the whole system," not likely.

that's like saying that israel is going to pull out of the west bank in 4 years. even if they said that they were going to pull out, it would take years for them to move and deconstruct all of the settlements and infrastructure already in place.

anitram 07-04-2007 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx
but the companies run this country
Do you consider that to be a good thing?

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by anitram


Do you consider that to be a good thing?

no, i am just saying.

BVS 07-04-2007 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


universalizing health care will make many private companies go out of business b/c the prices of medicine will go down. the competitiveness for new drugs will dive and ultimately we will suffer.

Now, this is closer to a real argument. But tell me something, how much of pharma is making us suffer now? And why does it not effect countries that do have social medicine?

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx


we are just going to debate this on and on. i have stated my voice, you don't agree. universal health care won't happen anytime soon here. the democrats can lobby all they want, but the companies run this country, and it would be political suicide for them to do that. so, really think about what the potential candidates say regarding health care. if they say, "i am going to change the whole system," not likely.

It's just that you weren't able to back up anything. You kept changing your reasonings. First it was the size of the country, then mismangement, then it was private business, etc... I don't think you really know why you are against social medicine.

How many are running on a platform that they are going to "change the whole system"?

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:50 PM

i am against social medicine b/c i don't want a large percentage of my "hard-earned" going towards health care. I would much rather have my future employer pay for it.

struckpx 07-04-2007 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar

Now, this is closer to a real argument. But tell me something, how much of pharma is making us suffer now? And why does it not effect countries that do have social medicine?


proof?

from my personal readings, I don't read about breaking technology and cures coming from Europe that much. Mainly it is from here and Asia. Although, maybe I am out of the loop.

anitram 07-04-2007 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by struckpx

Although, maybe I am out of the loop.

You are.

I already posted about this on this thread.

The 2nd most sold pharmaceutical drug in the world was developed by the French in France. And it's not the only one, either.


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