So Does Anyone Wanna Place Any Bets on the New RHMT Vocal?

[redhill]

Seriously?

Let's see a quote from a band member, Paul McG, Lanois, Eno, hell...I'd even take McCormack lol

I'm looking for a direct quote but this a pretty darn reputable source, IMO.

In the meantime:
The Joshua Tree: This album nearly became only the second U2 album to have every song played live. U2 gave serious consideration to playing Red Hill Mining Town live, and rehearsed it in soundchecks with the intention of playing it in Tempe, Arizona in late December 1987 for Rattle And Hum. The best-known date of RHMT being soundchecked is 28 November 1987. However, the song never moved out of rehearsals and was not played. All other Joshua Tree songs have been played live. http://www.u2gigs.com/article373.html

If the issue was really the tempo / not fitting in the setlist...then why rehearse it? I know they did this in the past (Drowning Man, etc) but generally when a song is soundchecked they try to fit it in at least once. This further corroborates but I realize is not proof.

 

[kabigon]

This quote from Larry in U2 By U2 perhaps sums up why they're doing a new version of RHMT.

"'Red Hill Mining Town' is one of the lost songs. It was over-produced and under-written, one of those great ideas that never quite got there. Bono had a very clear idea about how he wanted it to sound but I don't think anyone was quite sure where he was going with it. What we ended up with was neither one thing nor the other. During improvisation things happened that were amazing but because of a lack of confidence in our ability to repeat the idea, we tended to hang on very tightly and perhaps not push forward as much as we should have. So sometimes we ended up with a bunch of great ideas as opposed to a fully developed song. In my view, that's part of the genius of U2 but it can also be part of the problem with our songwriting."

 

[gvox]

Has anyone considered the possibility that the band just didn't like how the live arrangement was/wasn't coming together? Ie the second guitar? There's a finite time to get arrangements right in rehearsal...and then the tour must go on. For all we know it just kept turning into a train wreck at practice, with nothing to do with him hitting/not hitting notes.

They didn't shelve any other JT song based on Bono's ability/inability to sing it live identical to the album. They just changed the key.


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

 

[AndrewCowley]

It was over-produced

Haaaaaaaaaaaaaa. Fast forward to the current day and its not a stretch to say that every U2 song is over produced.

 

[redhill]

Has anyone considered the possibility that the band just didn't like how the live arrangement was/wasn't coming together? Ie the second guitar? There's a finite time to get arrangements right in rehearsal...and then the tour must go on. For all we know it just kept turning into a train wreck at practice, with nothing to do with him hitting/not hitting notes.

They didn't shelve any other JT song based on Bono's ability/inability to sing it live identical to the album. They just changed the key.


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

I dunno about that...that's never been mentioned anywhere (in relation to RHMT) to my knowledge. I consider Matt a pretty knowledgeable / reliable source but maybe I'll email him and see if he can tell me what his source was...

 

[dan_smee]

Yeah, Matt is generally pretty good, but the guy's only claim to credibility is he runs a large fan site. We are talking about setlist minutiae from 30 years ago, and an uncredited claim from Matt that perpetuates a long held, but never proven fan theory re the reason it wasn't played isn't anything IMO.


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

 

[gvox]

I dunno about that...that's never been mentioned anywhere (in relation to RHMT) to my knowledge...

Let me ask this then:

How many times has anyone in the band or crew ever said that a song was dropped as a single or from live rotation - ANY song - because Bono couldn't sing it?

I think we all know that answer: if not 0, pretty close to it. Since when does Bono not sing his own damn songs? Lol

Now...How many times have they ever described rehearsing songs for a tour but then the songs just not coming together, or feeling right, or the arrangement being off, etc? We know that answer too: Numerous!

there's a major second guitar part that wouldn't really have sounded all that hot played on a reel to reel deck in 1987....fast forward to 2005 and a lil tune called City of Blinding Lights. Notice anything reminiscent about *that second guitar? And in 2005...Bono's not playing it, it's tracked.

(Let's not get into other songs with extra sounds, as they were made with arpeggiators and keyboards. Different kettle of fish)

Hmm.

In 1987..COBL would have been a real bitch to get a good live arrangement of. I think that's exactly what happened to RHMT.

It's not his most difficult vocal. He can nail it, I'm betting, and will. I think they struggled with the arrangement.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Bono has stated that Bad is his hardest song to sing, yet that never stopped them from playing it.

They soundchecked Acrobat as well, never played it. They soundchecked Two Hearts like a million times this past tour, busted it once and never saw it again.

Maybe there was a problem with the arrangement. Maybe Bono didn't like how it sounded. Maybe they just didn't like it as much as you do. Who the hell knows.

 

[kabigon]

They soundchecked Two Hearts like a million times this past tour, busted it once and never saw it again.

Three times

/pedantry

 

[redhill]

Let me ask this then:

How many times has anyone in the band or crew ever said that a song was dropped as a single or from live rotation - ANY song - because Bono couldn't sing it?

I think we all know that answer: if not 0, pretty close to it. Since when does Bono not sing his own damn songs? Lol

Now...How many times have they ever described rehearsing songs for a tour but then the songs just not coming together, or feeling right, or the arrangement being off, etc? We know that answer too: Numerous!

there's a major second guitar part that wouldn't really have sounded all that hot played on a reel to reel deck in 1987....fast forward to 2005 and a lil tune called City of Blinding Lights. Notice anything reminiscent about *that second guitar? And in 2005...Bono's not playing it, it's tracked.

(Let's not get into other songs with extra sounds, as they were made with arpeggiators and keyboards. Different kettle of fish)

Hmm.

In 1987..COBL would have been a real bitch to get a good live arrangement of. I think that's exactly what happened to RHMT.

It's not his most difficult vocal. He can nail it, I'm betting, and will. I think they struggled with the arrangement.

You make some good points save two.

Do you really think anyone in the band would regularly admit that a song was not played live because Bono couldn't sing it? They may have once or twice (I can't find direct proof from the band as of yet) but it's not something they would talk about much out of respect to Bono. Daniel Lanois (based on the Classic Albums program) seems like the most likely person to talk openly about such a thing (in the U2 camp)...It sounded to me like he vastly preferred the full voice Bono to the falsetto (which can be a crutch at times but has also been used to extraordinary effect).

The other is that, if not his most difficult vocal, it would be reasonable to assume that it would it easily be in the top 5 (if not 3). I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens.

Right now I'm actually just as worried about any lyric changes (that don't need to and shouldn't happen). Don't worry - I won't go on about that...

 

[redhill]

Bono has stated that Bad is his hardest song to sing, yet that never stopped them from playing it.

They soundchecked Acrobat as well, never played it. They soundchecked Two Hearts like a million times this past tour, busted it once and never saw it again.

Maybe there was a problem with the arrangement. Maybe Bono didn't like how it sounded. Maybe they just didn't like it as much as you do. Who the hell knows.

When did he say that about Bad?

I know this may be trivial to some but as one of my favorite (if not my favorite) U2 songs this subject matters to me.

 

[Axver]

In the meantime:
The Joshua Tree: This album nearly became only the second U2 album to have every song played live. U2 gave serious consideration to playing Red Hill Mining Town live, and rehearsed it in soundchecks with the intention of playing it in Tempe, Arizona in late December 1987 for Rattle And Hum. The best-known date of RHMT being soundchecked is 28 November 1987. However, the song never moved out of rehearsals and was not played. All other Joshua Tree songs have been played live. http://www.u2gigs.com/article373.html

I was going to make a snide comment about not crediting me, but I see your code just didn't work.

So here's an article I'll presumably need to update in a few months.

 

[gvox]

You make some good points save two.

Do you really think anyone in the band would regularly admit that a song was not played live because Bono couldn't sing it? They may have once or twice (I can't find direct proof from the band as of yet) but it's not something they would talk about much out of respect to Bono. Daniel Lanois (based on the Classic Albums program) seems like the most likely person to talk openly about such a thing (in the U2 camp)...It sounded to me like he vastly preferred the full voice Bono to the falsetto (which can be a crutch at times but has also been used to extraordinary effect).

The other is that, if not his most difficult vocal, it would be reasonable to assume that it would it easily be in the top 5 (if not 3). I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens.

Right now I'm actually just as worried about any lyric changes (that don't need to and shouldn't happen). Don't worry - I won't go on about that...

You've just provided me with my question for Lanois

(honestly didn't know exactly what I wanted to ask, but i sure do now!! )




Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

 

[redhill]

I was going to make a snide comment about not crediting me, but I see your code just didn't work.

So here's an article I'll presumably need to update in a few months.

I thought I had quoted you and certainly attempted to.

 

[redhill]

You've just provided me with my question for Lanois

(honestly didn't know exactly what I wanted to ask, but i sure do now!! )




Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

Sweeeeeeeeet!

 

[redhill]

I thought I had quoted you and certainly attempted to.

I meant "had credited" you. My apologies as I'm usually multitasking when I post here...

 

[superblue]

Lots of twists and turns and opinions in this debate. Be happy you can debate how the vocals will be to any of their songs on this upcoming tour or any future tour because there will come that day when they won't tour any longer.

I'm a big fan of Rush, and whether you love or hate them (they are polarizing for sure) they have had an impact on music, have a loyal devoted following and are renowned for their musicianship (particularly live). They have toured extensively over the years and now they are done. Neil Peart's body can't handle the rigors of a 3 hour show with his style of drumming and has called it quits. Hell, he's been talking about not wanting to tour any more since the '80's. Their vocalist's voice has changed drastically over the years and they constantly modify songs so he can sing them. Different yes, but you're still glad to hear them.

They are far from being at the point that musically they are unable to play well live anymore. They are still fantastic.....but they are done.

My point is, debate all you want about Bono's vocals and how RHMT's treatment may "make or break" the tour, but there will come a point when it's done and over and you'll just be happy to hear Bono and the rest go out there to put on a show.

I, for one, will be soaking it all up and enjoying every single moment of this tour (as I do every one)....I don't care if it's considered a nostalgia tour or not, whether they re-do some songs so Bono can sing em.....doesn't matter to me. It's U2 live doing an album that has never been played in its' entirety. That won't happen again, and U2's ability (or desire) to play live is a finite thing. Enjoy it while it lasts

 

[DreamOutLoud13]

I was going to make a snide comment about not crediting me, but I see your code just didn't work.

So here's an article I'll presumably need to update in a few months.

Ax, what would you say is a good example of a U2 song that has been truncated in its live performance? I know most of their songs grow and excel live, but there's got to be a good example of one that has fallen flat.

I ask because we can't necessarily assume that this tour's version of RHMT will be very much like the album version. Technically Bono can mumble through the verses, or even pass it over to Edge to sing, and it will still count as them "playing" it.

 

[redhill]

Ax, what would you say is a good example of a U2 song that has been truncated in its live performance? I know most of their songs grow and excel live, but there's got to be a good example of one that has fallen flat.

I ask because we can't necessarily assume that this tour's version of RHMT will be very much like the album version. Technically Bono can mumble through the verses, or even pass it over to Edge to sing, and it will still count as them "playing" it.

IGWSHA

Wild Honey

The First Time (somewhat more of a snippet but still borderline)

I know I'm not Axver but those come to mind...there are others

 

[Joey788]

I like Red Hill Mining Town. I look forward to hearing this new version and then seeing it on tour.

This is my contribution to this thread.

 

[kabigon]

This calm rationality and lack of hyperbole will not stand.

 

[U2girl]

Will he neuter it so he can sing it live on the tour?

Or will he try to sound more similar to the original?

Or even try to outdo / surpass the original (which would be the most miraculous feat of his lifetime)?

My guess is that he tries to sing it more nuanced and improve on it in that way...but is unable to hit the "big" notes à la 87 so it's less powerful overall...

Maybe they'll just (only) go back to the masters and re-mix it and then put new vocals on top (like Wave of Sorrow).

If they re-record...I just hope the new mix isn't made to sound adult contemporary or more radio friendly...or some other garbage.

He rerecorded the vocals + 30 years have passed so no, he can't sing it live like it's 1987.

He'll adapt the vocals to his current abilities, as he does with all 80's material.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

ha it's not even a single it's a remix on the super uber deluxe edition.

 

[redhill]

ha it's not even a single it's a remix on the super uber deluxe edition.

Why is that funny? If that's the case then it's lame and pitiful. I don't see any humor there.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Why is that funny? If that's the case then it's lame and pitiful. I don't see any humor there.

You must be a treat at parties

 

[redhill]

You must be a treat at parties

Make as many failed attempts as you want to disparage me but making lame remixes (as we all know they will be) and tarnishing the legacy of such a legendary album is anything but funny.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

They could have Nickleback cover the entire album and it wouldn't tarnish its legacy

 

[redhill]

They could have Nickleback cover the entire album and it wouldn't tarnish its legacy

Creed already did that ;]

 

[dan_smee]

I get that this whole thing is emotional for you redhill, but you just need to chill the fuck out.


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

 

[redhill]

I get that this whole thing is emotional for you redhill, but you just need to chill the fuck out.


Sent from my iPhone using U2 Interference

No thanks!