Changing up the set for 2011?

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pepokiss said:
yeah, after thinking about it, it's even worst :lol:
If they can't start with breathe, a semi-known song, opening with a NEW unknown song?

ahaahha
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It's OK. ;)

U2387 said:
I am not saying stadiums were silent or asleep during the new material, of course, there were plenty of people clapping and singing along. They're U2 fans at a U2 show. Still, in America, I don't know about in Europe, there was a noticeable lack of energy compared to other tours' openings until they played BD or MW.

Also, where were you sitting?
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This is a good question. Access to the inner-circle comes with rose-tinted glasses. The energy level of having the band within arm's reach usually blinds people to how the rest of the stadium is doing. As I've said before, Boston was dead on the 1st night. The inner-circle was hopping, but the rest of us were just standing around wondering what the band was doing.

An unknown song can rev up the crowd if it's the right kind of song (e.x: "Stingray") but when you throw something "Breathe" at them, it's just asking for people to turn to me and go "What is this?". If it's good enough, nobody cares if they've never heard it before.

U2387 said:
I agree the title track would've probably been the best opener from NLOTH, but still, there are no real ideal options here.
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Bingo.

Salome said:
if your new album, no matter how good, doesn't have a song on it that works as a great concert opener then there's no point in still trying to force it
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Yeah, we can try to find some magical opening combo that would let a NLOTH track work as an opener, but there just aren't any really good options. Just because we want it to work, doesn't mean it will work.
 
Boots most definitely would have worked as an opener from NLOTH, the audience knows it, and it gets the most jumping out of all of 360's set.
 
U2387 said:
Well, U2 aren't hard and fast on this requirement like you and some others are.

They've been opening with Beautiful Day and I Will Follow/NYD.

Because that is what works.

I am not saying stadiums were silent or asleep during the new material, of course, there were plenty of people clapping and singing along. They're U2 fans at a U2 show. Still, in America, I don't know about in Europe, there was a noticeable lack of energy compared to other tours' openings until they played BD or MW.

Also, where were you sitting?

I highly doubt anything from NLOTH got anywhere near the reception the hits did.

I agree the title track would've probably been the best opener from NLOTH, but still, there are no real ideal options here.

That's why I'd like Until The End....------>>>NLOTH.

I am not against opening with new material, if there is a great opener like Elevation or City of Blinding Lights on the next release, perfect!! I'd prefer that.

But in the absence of something similar from the latest release, I don't see the obsession with needing a "new" song to open. Especially when the latest release is over a year old and did not sell nearly as well as their last 2 albums.

It's really kind of a silly obsession, and one U2 does not share.

Also, Fez-Being Born would not work as an opener either. They've never even played it live in the 2 years it's been out, what makes people think they'd all of a sudden open with it? It is the most out there song on the album and the "epic" feel deflates after the first round of "ooohhhs."

If a song is going to open, it needs to be:

1.)Really well known(Elevation, COBL, Streets).

2.)Or a really great, energetic song with a ton of energy. (MOFO, Zoo Station, Out of Control)

It should come as no surprise that the best openers have been some combination of both of these- most notably Zoo, City and Streets!

NLOTH fits in the 2nd category, that's why it would work if we want to talk new(ish) material to open.
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Well it certainly didn't bother them to open with a new song on every tour since 1992...and at times with Streets on JT tour, and I think a few times a Rattle and Hum song opened on Lovetown. Not sure how many shows 11 O clock DIDN'T open on pre-JT tours...probably not enough to matter in this debate. But there is certainly precedent for this in U2 tours, and continued practice for the last two decades.

I was in the GA, far in the back and nowhere near the inner zone or the edge of the "bomb shelter". Definitely a good reaction to the new material opening. :shrug:

Alternatively, if they're that much against opening with NLOTH - and now Breathe - they could try the longer intro style Boots. DVD opening is allright isn't it ?
 
U2girl said:
Not sure how many shows 11 O clock DIDN'T open on pre-JT tours...probably not enough to matter in this debate.
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Uh, well, it didn't open more often than it did.

Boy Tour: The Ocean opened the majority of known sets.
October Tour: Gloria opened almost all sets.
War Tour: Gloria and Out Of Control rotated.
UF Tour: 11OTT opened most sets.
 
I had an idea today... what if bono swapped his guitar solo moment of Amazing Grace for Unchained Melody zoo tv style? It would provide a good link between one and streets.
 
I think Bono would want a spiritual segue into Streets, like how Bad/40 was on Elevation.

Quite honestly, on this tour, I wish there was a better segue into Streets. I mentioned that Running -> Streets, Please -> Streets, Bad/40 -> Streets were epic on previous tours.

Alas, I can't think of any fresh ideas for a better segue. And I think the band has run out of ideas as well.:reject:
 
Galeongirl said:
I had an idea today... what if bono swapped his guitar solo moment of Amazing Grace for Unchained Melody zoo tv style? It would provide a good link between one and streets.
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I'd love to see (a part of) Heartland between One and Streets.
 
U2girl said:
Well it certainly didn't bother them to open with a new song on every tour since 1992...and at times with Streets on JT tour, and I think a few times a Rattle and Hum song opened on Lovetown. Not sure how many shows 11 O clock DIDN'T open on pre-JT tours...probably not enough to matter in this debate. But there is certainly precedent for this in U2 tours, and continued practice for the last two decades.

I was in the GA, far in the back and nowhere near the inner zone or the edge of the "bomb shelter". Definitely a good reaction to the new material opening. :shrug:

Alternatively, if they're that much against opening with NLOTH - and now Breathe - they could try the longer intro style Boots. DVD opening is allright isn't it ?
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:huh:

I never said it did bother them to open with a new song.

Just that it doesn't bother them to NOT open with a new song either.

They seem to have no hard and fast requirement here.

Yes, the DVD opening is alright, but I can think of plenty that would work better and I'm sure I'm not alone.

They'll open with whatever they want, and history, both long term and recent, tells us they don't have an album/era litmus test for openers.
 
U2387 said:
They'll open with whatever they want, and history, both long term and recent, tells us they don't have an album/era litmus test for openers.
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This is the first time in 18 years that they haven't opened with a song off the new album. Given that it wasn't till late 80's where they were established enough, that's pretty significant.

I'm a strong believer in the opening with a "new" song, but regardless this opening is just akward... how come no one in their camp has told them this?
 
BVS said:
This is the first time in 18 years that they haven't opened with a song off the new album. Given that it wasn't till late 80's where they were established enough, that's pretty significant.

I'm a strong believer in the opening with a "new" song, but regardless this opening is just akward... how come no one in their camp has told them this?
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Stingray is somewhat awkward (with the lights on and the very long transition to Beautiful Day). Hopefully the band can tweak that a little. Other than that, I like it. :up:

EDIT - I would love In A Little While to be gone. Miss Sarajevo will obviously stay in the set, because of the spectacular transition from the questions segment to COBL.
 
Hey, I'm just sayin'! I think it's awkward too, and clearly the U2'ers are flat-out wrong if they think otherwise.

Or they're keeping it that way just to piss us off.

Those evil bastards. :tsk:


:wink:
 
Besides replacing most of the ATYCLB songs I'd also like the band to close the shows with something other than MOS. MOS can stay but I'd love to see 40 or Cedars played after.
 
MOS is a great song. But I really want to see U2 rotate it. Popmart and ZooTV each regularly had different songs closing each night. It was either One, Unchained Melody, Wake Up Dead Man, Can't Help Falling in Love, or Love is Blindness.
 
Zoo360 said:
MOS is a great song. But I really want to see U2 rotate it. Popmart and ZooTV each regularly had different songs closing each night. It was either One, Unchained Melody, Wake Up Dead Man, Can't Help Falling in Love, or Love is Blindness.
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I wouldn't really say Popmart and ZooTV had rotational closers; the only recent tour that has had rotating closers in the truest sense is Vertigo (on some legs).

On ZooTV, Love Is Blindness was the normal closer for the first couple of legs, then Can't Help Falling In Love was added after it and stayed there for most shows. Not rotational.

On Popmart, the songs after One were often little more than a glorified snippet. Not the greatest basis for your argument.
 
i am not a setlist complainer. for one, they are few if any U2 songs i don't like. two, seeing them live is a whole different thing from reading names of songs on an internet forum. three, they've thrown us some genuine surprises this tour - new songs (which they NEVER do, i mean when was the last time they played a song live they hadn't released yet? the 70s?), ultraviolet, unforgettable fire, hold me thrill me, crazy tonight remix, your blue room...

that said, i would be eternally happy if i got to see at least ONE song from Pop live. preferably discotheque, mofo, gone, or please (though i did see Gone in 2001... it's my favourite, so i wouldnt mind seeing it again!). U2 doesn't have to completely change their set and only play passengers or whatever... just ONE song from Pop, that's all i'm asking. or rehearse 2-3 and rotate them. it would be a treat to the fans who love it and for many of the casual fans there, it might be a song they hadn't even heard before. when i meet people who aren't into U2 i usually play them something from Pop, and they are pleasantly surprised ... it's a cool album and it's about time the boys acknowledge it!

maybe the "club" album will motivate them to play a song from Pop ... Mofo anyone?
 
I'll Go Crazy Remix should be interchanged with DISCOTHEQUE on a night to night basis ...necessary!

In a Little While + Miss Sarajevo need to GO BYE BYE ...a must!

Surprises from POP and ZOOROPA, + new songs from Songs of Ascent, ...priceless set-list!
 
Songs of Ascent will not be released.

Long gone, the name for sure if not the material.

I too would love to see something from Pop, but we have U2's biggest mistake of their career to explain why they won't touch it.

When I talk to people about Pop, they buy the usual critics' line that Pop sucked and ATYCLB saved U2, without even having heard much of it, or not having heard much of it in years. Others, people I know who really are into music and even U2 and have no issues with their experimental side, often tell me "I didn't like Pop." One guy who wanted to hear more from Zooropa told me this, so he can't be accused of just liking War and JT.

So back to the mistake, I am becoming more and more convinced that the deadline and rush to complete Pop was the worst decision of their career. The entire album, conceptually, musically, lyrically, is brilliant. If they were able to get where they were aiming, Pop would have been much better received and hence played more live.

As much as I love the songs, I have to admit they really screwed up the studio versions of them. Especially Gone and LNOE. They just sound flat to me compared to the live versions. With the exception of Do You Feel Loved, which I think they nailed on the album.

I really don't blame my casual music or casual U2 friends for saying "I don't care for Pop" based on a listen to the album. Not everyone is a die hard like us, so I can't tell them "just do yourself a favor and look up the live performances!"

It was live, on the Popmart tour, that these songs really came to life and realized their full potential. And since this was U2's most heavily criticized, least attended and least profitable tour, the awesomeness that is the live versions of Pop songs got nowhere near as much attention as say, Streets from Zoo TV or Slane Castle.

It's sad, but the perception, and the stupid decisions that led to its formation, is exactly why they don't touch this album any more at shows.

Why this only became a problem to them after the Elevation Tour is truly anyone's guess!
 
U2387 said:
I too would love to see something from Pop, but we have U2's biggest mistake of their career to explain why they won't touch it.

When I talk to people about Pop, they buy the usual critics' line that Pop sucked and ATYCLB saved U2, without even having heard much of it, or not having heard much of it in years. Others, people I know who really are into music and even U2 and have no issues with their experimental side, often tell me "I didn't like Pop." One guy who wanted to hear more from Zooropa told me this, so he can't be accused of just liking War and JT.

So back to the mistake, I am becoming more and more convinced that the deadline and rush to complete Pop was the worst decision of their career. The entire album, conceptually, musically, lyrically, is brilliant. If they were able to get where they were aiming, Pop would have been much better received and hence played more live.

As much as I love the songs, I have to admit they really screwed up the studio versions of them. Especially Gone and LNOE. They just sound flat to me compared to the live versions. With the exception of Do You Feel Loved, which I think they nailed on the album.

I really don't blame my casual music or casual U2 friends for saying "I don't care for Pop" based on a listen to the album. Not everyone is a die hard like us, so I can't tell them "just do yourself a favor and look up the live performances!"

It was live, on the Popmart tour, that these songs really came to life and realized their full potential. And since this was U2's most heavily criticized, least attended and least profitable tour, the awesomeness that is the live versions of Pop songs got nowhere near as much attention as say, Streets from Zoo TV or Slane Castle.

It's sad, but the perception, and the stupid decisions that led to its formation, is exactly why they don't touch this album any more at shows.

Why this only became a problem to them after the Elevation Tour is truly anyone's guess!
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well i think they played some Pop songs on Elevation tour because Pop was the most recent album besides the one they were promoting, so it might have still been fresh in many people's minds

when i talk to people about Pop most haven't even heard of it :p i suppose if your only exposure to it was magazine articles or something, you might get the impression that it was a failure. but i've never met anyone not a solid U2 fan who has even heard of Pop (which in that sense i suppose does make it a failure...)

have to disagree with your criticism of the album itself though. i think it's near perfect. yes it certainly rocked live, but as far as the recordings go the only changes i'd make would be to Please (add live bridge/solo), Miami (make riff more prominent like live version), and Last Night on Earth (solo at the end). Mofo live is awesome, but the climax of the studio version is overpowering. and you don't like the studio version of Gone, really? i think Bono's vocal performance is fantastic, very haunting...Bono himself said it was like a ghost came over him...

i actually think it's U2 fans that have the most problem with Pop (not on interference though, most seem to love it here). i've played songs from Pop for people who aren't really into U2 and have gotten almost universally positive reactions.

those who hated Pop when it came out have forgotten it by now. it's time to remind them, U2, and change their minds.

Axver said:
6 August 2001, Antwerp, actually.
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really? what new song did they play?
 
U2387 said:
Songs of Ascent will not be released.

Long gone, the name for sure if not the material.

I too would love to see something from Pop, but we have U2's biggest mistake of their career to explain why they won't touch it.

When I talk to people about Pop, they buy the usual critics' line that Pop sucked and ATYCLB saved U2, without even having heard much of it, or not having heard much of it in years. Others, people I know who really are into music and even U2 and have no issues with their experimental side, often tell me "I didn't like Pop." One guy who wanted to hear more from Zooropa told me this, so he can't be accused of just liking War and JT.

So back to the mistake, I am becoming more and more convinced that the deadline and rush to complete Pop was the worst decision of their career. The entire album, conceptually, musically, lyrically, is brilliant. If they were able to get where they were aiming, Pop would have been much better received and hence played more live.

As much as I love the songs, I have to admit they really screwed up the studio versions of them. Especially Gone and LNOE. They just sound flat to me compared to the live versions. With the exception of Do You Feel Loved, which I think they nailed on the album.

I really don't blame my casual music or casual U2 friends for saying "I don't care for Pop" based on a listen to the album. Not everyone is a die hard like us, so I can't tell them "just do yourself a favor and look up the live performances!"

It was live, on the Popmart tour, that these songs really came to life and realized their full potential. And since this was U2's most heavily criticized, least attended and least profitable tour, the awesomeness that is the live versions of Pop songs got nowhere near as much attention as say, Streets from Zoo TV or Slane Castle.

It's sad, but the perception, and the stupid decisions that led to its formation, is exactly why they don't touch this album any more at shows.

Why this only became a problem to them after the Elevation Tour is truly anyone's guess!
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"Especially Gone..." ?!?!? You're kidding right? That was a great version of a great song!!!!
 
Axver said:
It was the sole performance of We Love You, unreleased to this day.

Not to plug my own shit, but I wrote this after the debut of Stingray Guitar, Glastonbury, and North Star in Turin: The significance of U2 performing 3 unreleased songs in Turin - U2gigs.com

Oh, and there's also this in the U2gigs Setlist FAQ: U2gigs.com - FAQ
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as you point out, the unreleased songs on 360 are possible candidates for a new album. i don't think "We Love You" was ever meant to be on an album... so i don't think it's quite as significant
 
Harry Vest said:
"Especially Gone..." ?!?!? You're kidding right? That was a great version of a great song!!!!
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collapse said:
well i think they played some Pop songs on Elevation tour because Pop was the most recent album besides the one they were promoting, so it might have still been fresh in many people's minds

when i talk to people about Pop most haven't even heard of it :p i suppose if your only exposure to it was magazine articles or something, you might get the impression that it was a failure. but i've never met anyone not a solid U2 fan who has even heard of Pop (which in that sense i suppose does make it a failure...)

have to disagree with your criticism of the album itself though. i think it's near perfect. yes it certainly rocked live, but as far as the recordings go the only changes i'd make would be to Please (add live bridge/solo), Miami (make riff more prominent like live version), and Last Night on Earth (solo at the end). Mofo live is awesome, but the climax of the studio version is overpowering. and you don't like the studio version of Gone, really? i think Bono's vocal performance is fantastic, very haunting...Bono himself said it was like a ghost came over him...

i actually think it's U2 fans that have the most problem with Pop (not on interference though, most seem to love it here). i've played songs from Pop for people who aren't really into U2 and have gotten almost universally positive reactions.
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Sorry in advance if it gets long, I just don't want to put this out there without explaining myself and give people the wrong idea.

1st, I, like you get a lot of positive reactions from non U2 people, but usually from the live versions of Please, Gone, LNOE and the studio DYFL. I've never heard a good word from anyone not on this board about Miami.

I also get a lot of people who won't go past Discotheque, which they seem to hate for some reason I don't understand.:angry:

Collapse: I would say upon more thought that the studio versions of MOFO and Please were pretty good. But remember, for Please, even you suggested 2 improvements. Last Night On Earth, my biggest issue is the lack of the solo but something about the rest of the song sounds flat and boring when compared to the live version. The riff is nowhere near as prominent. It just feels to me like a great song trying to get out in the studio, live, that great song is realized. Discotheque wasn't terrible in the studio, but not up to Pride or Zooropa or Magnificent standards by any means. To name just a few. I thought the Popmart and Elevation versions owned the studio version and the Vertigo performance in Chicago owned ALL OF THEM COMBINED!

I think with a few notable exceptions on other albums (Pride being the most often mentioned), U2 are better live than studio. Still, even as someone who firmly believes this, I still say the gap is reasonably small and I greatly enjoy the studio versions on most albums. On Pop, however, I think the studio-live gap is the largest by far.

And different. I think gaps with other albums say very little if anything about U2's work in the studio and everything about how great of a live band they are. Pop is the only album where the gap speaks as much to their lacking in the studio as it does to their abilities as a live band.

I hate to ramble, but I guess I'd say most of their songs, as a general rule, go from excellent in studio to transcendent/in another world live, while Pop songs as a general rule go from "good but clearly need work" to transcendent/in another world live!

Collapse and Harry Vest:

I know, I know!!!

Allow me to explain myself!

Bono's vocal is indeed haunting and passionate on the studio version of Gone. I think Gone is one of U2's best songs, for sure. But I still strongly dislike how after the "Goodbye....." start to the chorus, the Edge just starts doing some bell effect or maybe piano?? The energy builds up, both lyrically and musically, throughout the verses, then when the chorus comes, your expecting an explosion, a climax, then a come down and build up in tension again. Instead, to me anyway, it fizzles out with whatever that sound is.

(0:46-47 and 1:46-47 here is what I am talking about)

YouTube - U2- Gone

What is this?

I just have never liked it and thought it deflated things at the wrong time.

(In the same parts, at almost the same count as the studio version conveniently)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rnkIk0pTk4

Here, Edge keeps that powerful riff going and even kicks it up a notch throughout the "goodbye, you can keep this suit of lights, I'll be up with the sun....." chorus.

It's noticeable here, but especially noticeable in the PopMart versions, which kicked all kinds of ass:up::up:

It actually hits on my main issue with the entire album. I heard some great, new rhythms from Larry and especially Adam and great use of different effects and especially power chords by Edge. I think they should have gone with this raw, power chord heavy sound for more of the album. I quite enjoy Miami and Playboy Mansion, but for most people, it contributes to their negative perception of the album. For this reason, and for coherence, I would have made both b-sides or bonus tracks or what have you and brought in Holy Joe(K-Mart style) and Hold Me....Kill Me to replace them.




those who hated Pop when it came out have forgotten it by now. it's time to remind them, U2, and change their minds.
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I would love to see Gone, Please, LNOE and MOFO and wouldn't mind Discotheque being brought back either. My ultimate dream is for them to get a live version of Do You Feel Loved down right!:drool:

Honestly, I would remaster the entire album (not necessarily the way the best of was, lol), going back and finishing/adding parts if necessary.

Either that or put out a live EP or downloadable widget or what have you of Pop material being performed live.

Live is the key. If they're reminding the haters with live versions, in any form, I'm all for it! I just don't think a "Pop" revival or reexamination or mass conversion/enlightenment will happen based on the current studio album we have.

Good discussion, and I want to hear more from both of you on this!:up:
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