PAPERLESS TICKETS For 2009 Tour!

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Won't this result in huge queues getting everyone in?

If everyone has to piss around veryfying credit cards, etc , particuarly if it doesn't swipe properly or there is a communication problem with the bank, then they're asking for all kinds of trouble.

Perhaps you could be given the option, like you can do for picking up tickets at the cinema / theatre.

U2 actually had a kind of a paperless system at the Astoria gig in 2001, but it meant going along very early in the day, to swap your e-mail from U2.com for a wristband.

As you went into the gig, they gave you a ticket, and within a second, another person took the stub off of you.. It worked, because it stopped scalpers outside, but it means there was a massive queue outside, and there was only a thousand fans or so.

Luckily I was u2.com winner, which meant I could jump to the front of the queue, which could be doneat other gigs for paid up fanclub members, but people who'd won tickets via other competitions all had to wait outside for ages.
 
Won't this result in huge queues getting everyone in?


This really is the only drawback I see, but seems worth it if the system is effective in eliminating scalpers.

I do will call most of the time anyways so I already have to show them my creditcard to get my ticket. I do think they have a reader that will scan only the info of the credit card and it doesn't have to communicate with the bank, since the ticket has already been purchased.

As far as trading, that's not that big of deal either, just one phone call and a confirmation number. That's how they deal with it for will call tickets.
 
This really is the only drawback I see, but seems worth it if the system is effective in eliminating scalpers.

I do will call most of the time anyways so I already have to show them my creditcard to get my ticket. I do think they have a reader that will scan only the info of the credit card and it doesn't have to communicate with the bank, since the ticket has already been purchased.

As far as trading, that's not that big of deal either, just one phone call and a confirmation number. That's how they deal with it for will call tickets.

I think you would only have large lines if it was paperless for the entire venue. If its just paperless for U2.com members, then I don't think there will be a problem with big lines.
 
It's an interesting topic, by the way THX to Sherry/atu2.com

What does all this mean for us here in Europe? Remember that credit cards are not as common as in the States. Especially the the younger people don't have CC.

Other questions: So far I don't know what actions Live Nation has got in Europe, any? How will LN work the tour there?

In general I support every step to stop he scalpers. There is probably an advantage for us, the travelling fans. No fear of fake tix on ebay / black market. You just walk in together.
 
I think you would only have large lines if it was paperless for the entire venue. If its just paperless for U2.com members, then I don't think there will be a problem with big lines.

True, but how many scalpers are you really eliminating with that system? I mean sure, it would help a little...
 
True, but how many scalpers are you really eliminating with that system? I mean sure, it would help a little...

I think the goal is to make the fan club system work. Where only the fans get tickets and not the scalpers. Before, Scalpers could sign up for U2 memberships as many times as needed to get the fan club tickets and then sell all of them. With this system, that won't be possible at all. Basically, it makes the fan club system work the way it was supposed to.
 
Interesting idea... I think both scalpers and people without credit/debit cards (or who don't want to use them) could just buy a Visa/MasterCard gift card to get around their problems, though.
 
I hadn't thought of that. Folks in this thread who protested the idea of having to present the credit card at the show - how have you bought tickets before if you don't have one?

At a ticketmaster outlet with cash?

Seeing as ticketbastard's website is useless; you have a better chance of getting tickets that way
 
i agree- for all the shows that i went to last tour (which was a ton), the best rate of success was not the ticketmaster website, but an actual outlet, or ebay. for local shows I went to the outlets, for shows which I traveled to, I used ebay.

other members of my family have used the website while I wait in line and got zero tickets when I was able to score as many as I wanted to basically at an outlet so long as you get there in time.
 
Bruce did something similar for the Devils and Dust tour. There were paper tickets, but they were all will-call, and limited to two. People did indeed scalp them, but they had to sit next to their victim. The two of you would show up at the box office, show the original credit card, and ID, and then get the tickets and a wristband. I don't remember what the wristband was for. I got there way early, expecting long lines. I had time to walk down to Amoeba and buy a Boomtown Rats cd. So the lines weren't too bad, but it was a small venue.
 
Won't this result in huge queues getting everyone in?

If everyone has to piss around veryfying credit cards, etc , particuarly if it doesn't swipe properly or there is a communication problem with the bank, then they're asking for all kinds of trouble.
imagine if a whole concert was paperless and the credit card system went down! highly unlikely, but still.

anyway, i only don't like this because i like having an actual ticket. the old school kind, not the ones you print from your computer. if there's an option for actual tickets, then yay.
 
At a ticketmaster outlet with cash?

I didn't actually realize there were still places you could buy the tickets in person, other than the venue. I guess in my head I still picture people camping out in line at the venue or Ticketmaster to buy tix; I thought maybe with the internet the way it is, people didn't do that anymore.

:reject:
 
pearl jam fan club members need to show photo ID at the box office day of show after 5pm. works like clockwork. could you still scalp them? technicaly, yes. you'd have to find someone day of.

i got closed out of the 2nd pearl jam show at MSG this summer, but got tickets for the first one. another ten club member in seattle got the 2nd show, but lost out on the first. we met up online and decided to swipe tickets... obviously on the honor system... we met the day of the first show, went in on my tickets... met up again the next day, went in on his tickets. and oh by the way... two sold out shows at madison square garden, in the biggest market in america... picking up tickets at the box office, at 5:30 in the middle of rush our at penn station, took about 5 minutes.

if someone can't make it after they purchased their tickets? i suppose they're shit out of luck. but it certainly does make whomever purchases the tickets make for damn sure that, baring family or personal emergency, that they can go to the show.... where as the way u2 did it last time a) anyone can become a "fan," and b) even real fans can go in and buy a ticket for a show far away hoping they can go and then sell it later if they decide they can't... which yes, it helps some people, but i'm sure some sell it for more than face. eliminate the middle man.

make sure you're gonna be able to go, or don't buy the tickets. if you then figure out that you can go, try your luck with the general sale and/or get non fan club tickets off of e-bay, the same as you'd always do. but whatever happens, u2 NEEDS to come up with a way to keep fan club tickets out of the hands of scalpers and off of e-bay.
 
Well, this thread has become predictable, right down to the implicit "U2 shows should be the centre of your life" attitudes.

At the moment, the current system allows anybody capable of affording a ticket the ability to purchase it. This potential new system, to some extent or another, excludes some of those customers. That is bad business. It excludes various groups whose attendance at each concert would number at least in the hundreds (i.e. not an insignificant minority). This exclusion is in some cases from buying a ticket in the first place, in which case U2 miss out financially, or from attendance, in which case a purchased ticket goes to waste and fans miss out (and I am sure U2, through statements in the past about the importance of a crowd to them, also value each person who actually passes through the door, not just the fact a ticket was sold). These groups include:

1. People who, for whatever reason, do not have a credit card. This idea that people must have a credit card is absurd and conformist. Yes, I have one, almost solely to purchase tickets and order CDs/books online, but numerous friends do not. If you don't, and you don't happen to know somebody with a card who actually wants to go to the show, you are stuffed.
2. People buying tickets with their parents' credit card. Their parents have to go now? Great, let's rule out the young crowd! Oh, wait, I thought that's who U2 want to appeal to?
3. People buying tickets as a gift for others. We should quash generosity now? I've seen multiple U2 concerts not on my own money, but as birthday or Christmas presents from relatives who not only had no intention of going, but were, in some cases, up to 14,000km away from where the show was actually being played!
4. People who want to do one-for-one trades, or any other kind of trade where the original purchaser does not attend the concert. Shitloads of trades, including hundreds conducted on this very forum last tour, would be impossible. Say you miss out on tickets for the first show in your city, but can buy tickets for the second show, even though you can't make it to the second night. Under the current system, you could buy tickets anyway in the expectation that you will have a high likelihood of being able to do a swap with somebody who holds tickets for the first night. Under this potential system? Forget it.
5. People who, for whatever reason, buy a ticket and then cannot attend. U2 concerts have a habit of selling out MONTHS before concerts. Sometimes even over half a year. You can't predict the future with absolute certainty. It is absolutely delusional to expect every purchaser in audiences as large as U2's to not have life intrude in the thousands of ways it possibly can, and to expect every purchaser to not want to give their ticket to somebody else as they themselves can no longer attend. If you're playing to 500 people, then maybe you might get lucky, but 50,000? Let's be serious. Numerous people are going to become unable to attend despite their best intentions to keep the date clear, and they will want somebody else to use their ticket rather than let it go to waste. Why the hell SHOULDN'T you be able to give your ticket to somebody else?

Now, you can go ahead and take issue with people in these five categories for not meeting your criteria of expected behaviour (don't waste your time; you're refuting examples, not the actual argument), but the point stands that they are nonetheless a paying customer excluded from the concert and that is a bad business model.

So why even propose a ticket model that will cause headaches, hassles, and potentially exclusion for hundreds of concertgoers? The "scalpers" justification is absurd, yet nobody has responded to this point I made in the very early stages of the thread:

Who are to blame for scalpers? IDIOTS AND DESPERATE FANS.

Scalpers exist purely because there is a niche in the market for tickets being sold for above face value. If you don't want stupid systems such as what's put forward in this thread, here's the simple solution: don't buy tickets from scalpers. If the market for scalped tickets dries up, scalping dries up. Address the cause, not the symptom. Trying to bar scalpers inevitably leads to genuine fans getting the run-around, while the smarter scalpers quickly figure out how to bypass the system and continue to make a killing.

Of course, people are stupid and the market for scalping will continue to exist. But the next time you find yourself unable to purchase a ticket because a scalper snapped them up or because the system has been changed in a way that excludes you, go get annoyed at the idiots and desperate fans paying massively inflated prices for a simple rock concert. If they hadn't allowed a niche in the market to develop, the scalper wouldn't be buying tickets from under your nose. Simple as that.
 
You don't carry an ID anyways? You don't drive, drink, or I don't know happen to get into a car accident and someone knows who you are...


No, I don't take my ID with me at a U2 concert knowing that I will lose about anything that I have in my pockets.... I do drink yes, but I don't need an ID to get a beer in my country... nor in Europe.... :D

And yes I do have an ID on me when I drive, but I do keep my wallet, umbrella and other annoying stuff like that in the car during the concert...
 
I think a lot of your are overreacting. I highly doubt this system will be used for the general sale. If anything it will be a Fan Club type system. Now, if you're going to say not even the Fan Club should try this, I totally disagree. If there isn't much flexibility too bad, buy your tickets in the general sale.
 
Hmm, I see the advantages and disadvantages of such a system. For me, personally, I don't think it would be a bad idea. I'm basically used to paperless tickets. I haven't bought a flight tickets in years and when I go to the theatre or opera in my city, we mostly get paperless tickets and have to bring a number and/or ID to the entrance. On the other hand, I see the problem for people who don't have a credit card. Maybe there will be a system where both ways of purchasing a ticket are possible.
 
Who are to blame for scalpers? IDIOTS AND DESPERATE FANS.

Scalpers exist purely because there is a niche in the market for tickets being sold for above face value. If you don't want stupid systems such as what's put forward in this thread, here's the simple solution: don't buy tickets from scalpers. If the market for scalped tickets dries up, scalping dries up.

Ba-BAM.

Yep.
 
I didn't actually realize there were still places you could buy the tickets in person, other than the venue. I guess in my head I still picture people camping out in line at the venue or Ticketmaster to buy tix; I thought maybe with the internet the way it is, people didn't do that anymore.

:reject:

With the crappiness of ticketbastard's website I'm surprised more don't go to outlets; they're cheaper as well than buying online too

Honestly if a concert is gonna sell out straight away you have a much better chance showing up in line an hour early and waiting. I've gotten tickets for Arcade Fire, Springsteen, Radiohead etc. and if I went online odds are I wouldn't of gotten them. Arcade Fire sold out in 5 minutes; I was third in line through showing up an hour early; an hour wait is better than not getting tickets. And I'd rather save several euro too; ticketmaster have too shitty service to deserve anything extra
 
With the crappiness of ticketbastard's website I'm surprised more don't go to outlets; they're cheaper as well than buying online too

Honestly if a concert is gonna sell out straight away you have a much better chance showing up in line an hour early and waiting. I've gotten tickets for Arcade Fire, Springsteen, Radiohead etc. and if I went online odds are I wouldn't of gotten them. Arcade Fire sold out in 5 minutes; I was third in line through showing up an hour early; an hour wait is better than not getting tickets. And I'd rather save several euro too; ticketmaster have too shitty service to deserve anything extra

In the states there are very few markets that still have live service for concerts the morning of... Most sales are online or over the phone.
 
Who are to blame for scalpers? IDIOTS AND DESPERATE FANS.

Scalpers exist purely because there is a niche in the market for tickets being sold for above face value. If you don't want stupid systems such as what's put forward in this thread, here's the simple solution: don't buy tickets from scalpers. If the market for scalped tickets dries up, scalping dries up. Address the cause, not the symptom..

I agree with most of that, in principle, however in practice getting this to happen is about as likely as a boycott forcing the gas companies to get back to 79 cents per litre days. Someone, somewhere, will fuck up the boycott while we all ride our bikes or whatever.
 
1. People who, for whatever reason, do not have a credit card. This idea that people must have a credit card is absurd and conformist. Yes, I have one, almost solely to purchase tickets and order CDs/books online, but numerous friends do not. If you don't, and you don't happen to know somebody with a card who actually wants to go to the show, you are stuffed.
2. People buying tickets with their parents' credit card. Their parents have to go now? Great, let's rule out the young crowd! Oh, wait, I thought that's who U2 want to appeal to?
3. People buying tickets as a gift for others. We should quash generosity now? I've seen multiple U2 concerts not on my own money, but as birthday or Christmas presents from relatives who not only had no intention of going, but were, in some cases, up to 14,000km away from where the show was actually being played!
4. People who want to do one-for-one trades, or any other kind of trade where the original purchaser does not attend the concert.
5. People who, for whatever reason, buy a ticket and then cannot attend.
1. Do they not have debit cards, or at least sell pre-paid debit cards in Austrailia? In the states anyone who has the cash can get a debit card. So there is no problem with that here...


2-5 For all the similar events that I've attended that were set up like this, it takes one phone call(from the card owner) to transfer the name and get a confirmation number. Minors can always use their parents card with authorization.

So now no one is eliminated. :shrug:
 
At the moment, the current system allows anybody capable of affording a ticket the ability to purchase it. This potential new system, to some extent or another, excludes some of those customers. That is bad business.

What about people who are not able to stay in a row in the middle of the night? I don't think this is bad business. Giving the opportunity to scalpers I think is bad business...

It excludes various groups whose attendance at each concert would number at least in the hundreds (i.e. not an insignificant minority). These groups include:

1. People who, for whatever reason, do not have a credit card. This idea that people must have a credit card is absurd and conformist. Yes, I have one, almost solely to purchase tickets and order CDs/books online, but numerous friends do not. If you don't, and you don't happen to know somebody with a card who actually wants to go to the show, you are stuffed.
2. People buying tickets with their parents' credit card. Their parents have to go now? Great, let's rule out the young crowd! Oh, wait, I thought that's who U2 want to appeal to?
Although people without creditcard are in minority, I agree it would not be nice if they would miss the opportunity because of this fact. However, I do not think it is necessary to show up with your creditcard at the concert. The system works with a photo-ID. So the one who pays does not have to go to the concert. In this case, almost everybody knows someone with a creditcard to borrow...Furthermore, at least in Europe there are several other ways of online paying without creditcard.

3. People buying tickets as a gift for others. We should quash generosity now? I've seen multiple U2 concerts not on my own money, but as birthday or Christmas presents from relatives who not only had no intention of going, but were, in some cases, up to 14,000km away from where the show was actually being played!
This is a minor disadvantage indeed. However, unraveling the information of teh person who receives the preent is a solution. Several times I paid a relative a flight-ticket by paying with my own creditcard and using his personal info for the ticket...

4. People who want to do one-for-one trades, or any other kind of trade where the original purchaser does not attend the concert. Shitloads of trades, including hundreds conducted on this very forum last tour, would be impossible. Say you miss out on tickets for the first show in your city, but can buy tickets for the second show, even though you can't make it to the second night. Under the current system, you could buy tickets anyway in the expectation that you will have a high likelihood of being able to do a swap with somebody who holds tickets for the first night. Under this potential system? Forget it.
Well, because scalpers will have more difficulties to buy a huge amount of tickets at the day of selling, this will quiet down the system a little bit at least, giving people more chance to achieve the tickets they want. Furthermore, come on, you can't make it to the show? You have to make it! these are opportunities you will not get a lot in your life and it's U2 we are talking about! You have to have a very good reason not to be able to make it to a concert. Then, tehre is also the online ticket auctioning system via LiveNation. although I hate this, it's still a possibility to change your tickets.

5. People who, for whatever reason, buy a ticket and then cannot attend. U2 concerts have a habit of selling out MONTHS before concerts. Sometimes even over half a year. You can't predict the future with absolute certainty. It is absolutely delusional to expect every purchaser in audiences as large as U2's to not have life intrude in the thousands of ways it possibly can, and to expect every purchaser to not want to give their ticket to somebody else as they themselves can no longer attend. If you're playing to 500 people, then maybe you might get lucky, but 50,000? Let's be serious. Numerous people are going to become unable to attend despite their best intentions to keep the date clear, and they will want somebody else to use their ticket rather than let it go to waste. Why the hell SHOULDN'T you be able to give your ticket to somebody else?
well

Now, you can go ahead and take issue with people in these five categories for not meeting your criteria of expected behaviour (don't waste your time; you're refuting examples, not the actual argument), but the point stands that they are nonetheless a paying customer excluded from the concert and that is a bad business model.

So why even propose a ticket model that will cause headaches, hassles, and potentially exclusion for hundreds of concertgoers? The "scalpers" justification is absurd, yet nobody has responded to this point I made in the very early stages of the thread:

Who are to blame for scalpers? IDIOTS AND DESPERATE FANS.

Scalpers exist purely because there is a niche in the market for tickets being sold for above face value. If you don't want stupid systems such as what's put forward in this thread, here's the simple solution: don't buy tickets from scalpers. If the market for scalped tickets dries up, scalping dries up. Address the cause, not the symptom. Trying to bar scalpers inevitably leads to genuine fans getting the run-around, while the smarter scalpers quickly figure out how to bypass the system and continue to make a killing.
well I disagree. By preventing that scalpers, and I mean the big scalper-companies of course, are able to get tickets n the first place, then the market for scalped tickets will dry up! Now the problem of the system is that there are too many people dependent on scalpers. Of course individual sclaping will always be possible.

W ehave to wait if this system will work, but imo it can be a perect solution for previous problems.
 
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