Review the Movie You Viewed VII: We're Done, Professionally

[impy13]

Just watched Wendy and Lucy. Daddy like.

 

[powerhour24]

Just got back from seeing Terminator: Salvation, and it turned out to be as much as I hoped for from the concept and trailers, and more. The hero worship of James Cameron, and almost conspiratorial hate for McG is beyond me. I think, beyond just the improved effects and camera technology, McG and his DP did a remarkable job filming the movie (I'm gonna be blasphemous and say that even T2's shooting looks boring in comparison), and I was just as skeptical as the next person of his hiring. Given the reaction from everyone I kept expecting the screenplay to drop the ball since the effects, and direction weren't at fault, and for an action movie neither was the acting, and it never got cheese-ball bad or too convoluted (T3), and while it didn't address a lot of the continuity and leaves you with plenty of questions, I don't think it screwed up the continuity either, and left the exposition to the imagination (or future films) as this was simply dropping you in the middle of the action/story instead of explaining everything to you. The remarkable thing about the franchise is its handling of the effects of time-travel, and its fun to see just how that (as well as the passage of real time, its a 4 film series over 25 years so far) has affected it, and I think this did a good job of raising some philosophical/ethical questions without plodding on about them and being too preachy for an action movie. And for the record, I'm a fan of huge movie fun, but I'm more impressed and interested in artistry in film, so I was pleasantly surprised to enjoy it beyond just siting back and accepting the popcorn entertainment (I'm not calling it an artistic triumph, just better than your average mainstream summer fare, and undeserving of the hate)

Color me impressed.

 

[lazarus]

Just watched Wendy and Lucy. Daddy like.

Daddy like Lucy?

 

[corianderstem]

Just watched Wendy and Lucy. Daddy like.

I started watching that a week ago or so, and had to turn it off when they picked her up for shoplifting and she was telling the that she couldn't leave her dog there alone as she was driven off in the squad car.

I couldn't handle watching a movie where I'd probably start bawling my fool head off if anything happened to the dog, or watching her trying to find the dog.

It was one of those weeks.

 

[impy13]

Lucy was a cute pooch, to be sure. You should catch the rest of it though, seriously.

Now I'm watching Let the Right One In again. Definitely last year's best. Netflix Instant through the XBOX is a wonderful thing.

McG and his DP

I hear the latter is quite fucking amateur.

 

[powerhour24]

Armond White, who accuses Pixar of forced sentimentality, and also happens to be one of Spielberg's biggest apologists.

Don't lump White and Spielberg together, his 'sentimentality' comes from extreme compassion and perhaps a dedication to the fantastical fun that movies brought him as a kid. The tacked on endings of Minority Report and WOTW don't really bring down his immense talent for story-telling.


As for White, the man is the worst kind of shock-writer, a pretentious one, at least pulp-novelists and tabloid 'journalists' don't pepper their writing with so much faux-scholarly bullshit. Its one thing to dislike a movie, its another to blab on and on and never give a legit reason why, especially when the world has come to know you're doing it just to crap on things that everyone else is universally impressed by.

The man gives negative reviews to artistic/story-telling triumphs like Zodiac, The Wrestler, Gomorrah, Wall-E, Slumdog Millionaire, Vicky Christina Barcelona, Atonement, Assassination of Jesse James, and Michael Clayton and mainstream masterpieces like Star Trek, Iron Man and Up, (as well as taking part in the odd NYC-critics negative TDK review conspiracy) and in such a way, he's wasting his life.

That's not even to mention the positive reviews for movies like Dance Flick and Transporter 3.

And fortunately even when he likes a movie worth liking, his writing is filled with critcism for other films/directors that is misplaced and totally against my opinion (like his review of Diving Bell and the Butterfly being more of a platform to tear apart other film-makers who made biopics like Anton Corbijn or Todd Haynes), so I don't have to worry about him even being right once in awhile.

 

[Lancemc]

And for the record, I'm a fan of huge movie fun, but I'm more impressed and interested in artistry in film, so I was pleasantly surprised to enjoy it beyond just siting back and accepting the popcorn entertainment

I'm just curious how impressed you were by the artistry in middling performances, uninspired musical composition, and an consistently inconsistent contradictory screenplay with absolutely no grip on its characters, narrative threads, or "thematic material" which is really a joke to even mention given how unexplored and nonsensical it is. I'm also curious how people are so content with the "popcorn entertainment" movie fun of a film rife with thoughtless inept action sequences that consistently deny the film's own internal logic.

Honestly, I want to know specifics. Where is the "artistry" and "movie fun" in this, one of the more purely inane and ludicrous blockbuster movies made this decade?

 

[Lancemc]

Don't lump White and Spielberg together, his 'sentimentality' comes from extreme compassion and perhaps a dedication to the fantastical fun that movies brought him as a kid. The tacked on endings of Minority Report and WOTW don't really bring down his immense talent for story-telling.

Incidentally I agree with most of your post up here and immediately following this.

 

[powerhour24]

I'm just curious how impressed you were by the artistry in middling performances, uninspired musical composition, and an consistently inconsistent contradictory screenplay with absolutely no grip on its characters, narrative threads, or "thematic material" which is really a joke to even mention given how unexplored and nonsensical it is. I'm also curious how people are so content with the "popcorn entertainment" movie fun of a film rife with thoughtless inept action sequences that consistently deny the film's own internal logic.

Honestly, I want to know specifics. Where is the "artistry" and "movie fun" in this, one of the more purely inane and ludicrous blockbuster movies made this decade?

My point in saying that was that I think people read waaaaaaay too much into this kind of movie, granted it wasn't on the level of Star Trek, but its enjoyable, and not worth ripping to shreds. Also my point about the 'thematic material' was that it was able to bring something else to the movie without spending too much time on it, but didn't really feel like an afterthought either, again the movie drops you into the action, so I'm not expecting soliloquies or deep character development. I seriously think movie fans made up their minds what they were going to think about this no matter what, and stuck with it. I'm not saying you don't have a right to dislike it, but I think there's lots of people out there spouting these things against it without objectively watching it, or watching it at all. I didn't straight up attack anyone's opinion, or call it a masterpiece, so I don't really think I need to be ripped apart either. As for the acting, I really want to know what people expect out of an action film, no one did a bad job, there's no awards-worthy performances, but who cares? Especially coming from a franchise that's built on the purposely mechanical persona of Arnold Schwarzenegger.


I will however defend Danny Elfman, the music might not have been ground-breaking or contain super-memorable themes, but it kept pace with the mood, and again for a movie of this kind that's just fine, we don't need bombastic hummable scores for everything.

 

[powerhour24]

For the record Lance, are you agreeing or disagreeing with my Spielberg comment?

 

[LMP]

The more I read about Salvation, the less I want to see it, especially being a huge fan of Cameron's films.

I'm going to look at it as part of the series and will compare it to those films, and the shitty 3rd one. I think most people who dislike it are doing the same thing, which is totally reasonable seeing as though it's a part of such a well-established and beloved set of movies.

Plus, I'm not going to spend 8 bucks to see the PG-13 version when you know the DIRECTOR'S CUT is coming out in a couple of months. McFuck.

On a lighter note. Drag Me to Hell was one of the most fun times I've had in a theater in a long time. Plus, the gypsy woman looked like a teacher from my school. Discuss.

 

[lazarus]

I hear the latter is quite fucking amateur.

I'd rather see Sasha Grey and her DP, if you get my meaning.

 

[powerhour24]

Oy

 

[Lancemc]

My point in saying that was that I think people read waaaaaaay too much into this kind of movie, granted it wasn't on the level of Star Trek, but its enjoyable, and not worth ripping to shreds. Also my point about the 'thematic material' was that it was able to bring something else to the movie without spending too much time on it, but didn't really feel like an afterthought either, again the movie drops you into the action, so I'm not expecting soliloquies or deep character development. I seriously think movie fans made up their minds what they were going to think about this no matter what, and stuck with it. I'm not saying you don't have a right to dislike it, but I think there's lots of people out there spouting these things against it without objectively watching it, or watching it at all. I didn't straight up attack anyone's opinion, or call it a masterpiece, so I don't really think I need to be ripped apart either. As for the acting, I really want to know what people expect out of an action film, no one did a bad job, there's no awards-worthy performances, but who cares? Especially coming from a franchise that's built on the purposely mechanical persona of Arnold Schwarzenegger.

I don't get it. This seems to boil down to the same argument I hear over and over again from people regarding action films, essentially "As long as there's spectacle, nothing else matters." Why, because McG was given $200 million to fill 2 hours with robots and lots of 'splosions, are we supposed to forgive him his lack of any fundamental storytelling abilities, skill in directing actors, or even sense for choreographing a single compelling set-piece? Have the standards for the genre been lowered so significantly over the years? The film lacks any semblance of coherent thought or purpose. I'm not looking for an art film here, just a solid movie. It fails to deliver in even the basic promise of its medium.

Fundamentally, it's all about storytelling, be it through wordless visual abstraction in the far end of the extreme art world or through utterly conventional Hollywood rules and conceptions; at the very least that's what should be expected from a successful movie. And I don't see what's so wrong about tearing something a new one when it completely fails in that regard. And shit, this movie doesn't even deliver in complete brainless spectacle, because McG apparently can't handle anything longer than a 4-minute music video. And if that's what you're looking for in the first place you're better off going to the circus or an amusement park. (Although the Terminator Salvation equivalent of a roller-coaster would be a 4-year-old designed improvised nightmare from the Rollercoaster Tycoon videogame that launches its passengers into a rocky lake-bed at the end.)

 

[Lancemc]

For the record Lance, are you agreeing or disagreeing with my Spielberg comment?

Well for the record, I was more or less. Though I think Laz's comment regarding Armond White was still noteworthy to a degree.

 

[powerhour24]

What my point boils down to is, could someone else have made a better movie out of the concept? With a better screenplay, sure. But should we pick it to pieces and be so unforgiving of the man who's aspirations aren't all that high and worked just fine within the confines of summer entertainment? No. He'll never be a master storyteller, but he just proved himself to be a maestro action director. At least he's not so much of an obnoxious tool as Michael Bay, and again I liked the way TS was shot, which I can't say of even the fun Michael Bay movies.

I guess pre-gravitas injected action movies prior to this decade didn't need such a high standard, back then I'd say Spielberg and Cameron were the only directors who ever elevated mainstream movies, which I'm not saying is a bad thing (granted, screenwriting in the blockbuster department would always be welcome), of course we could benefit from all movies being good at storytelling and artistry even popcorn movies, but it doesn't mean I can't have fun with what's out there, and that the people behind them are totally worthless, I think people are needlessly harsh sometimes. You may want more out of your average blockbuster than me, but on a day like today when I just went out for a little escapism, I had fun, so shoot me.

 

[Lancemc]

...worked just fine within the confines of summer entertainment...
...but he just proved himself to be a maestro action director...

Jeeeeeze.

 

[lazarus]

DAMN YOU MICHAEL BAY!!!

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why people with decent taste would go anywhere near the likes of Terminator 3, Terminator: Salvation, Transformers, G.I. Joe, etc. You can smell that crap a mile away. There's always a couple popcorn films every summer that actually have a soul behind the effects, and those are enough to satisfy me without have to see every single event movie that comes out.

Full confession: I did pay to see The Island at the cheap theatre a few years ago, but it was mainly because I like both of the leads, and the concept looked interesting. I also saw I, Robot, mainly because I had faith that Alex Proyas's vision would somehow balance out the presence of Will Smith and a bastardized version of Asimov's World.

 

[the tourist]

What my point boils down to is, could someone else have made a better movie out of the concept? With a better screenplay, sure. But should we pick it to pieces and be so unforgiving of the man who's aspirations aren't all that high and worked just fine within the confines of summer entertainment? No. He'll never be a master storyteller, but he just proved himself to be a maestro action director. At least he's not so much of an obnoxious tool as Michael Bay, and again I liked the way TS was shot, which I can't say of even the fun Michael Bay movies.

I guess pre-gravitas injected action movies prior to this decade didn't need such a high standard, back then I'd say Spielberg and Cameron were the only directors who ever elevated mainstream movies, which I'm not saying is a bad thing (granted, screenwriting in the blockbuster department would always be welcome), of course we could benefit from all movies being good at storytelling and artistry even popcorn movies, but it doesn't mean I can't have fun with what's out there, and that the people behind them are totally worthless, I think people are needlessly harsh sometimes. You may want more out of your average blockbuster than me, but on a day like today when I just went out for a little escapism, I had fun, so shoot me.

Don't read too much into it. Some people are just art-film snobs. Then again, I haven't seen it yet. But I will soon. And I'll enjoy it, given my differing opinions with the detractors of it.

 

[Lancemc]

DAMN YOU MICHAEL BAY!!!

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why people with decent taste would go anywhere near the likes of Terminator 3, Terminator: Salvation, Transformers, G.I. Joe, etc. You can smell that crap a mile away. There's always a couple popcorn films every summer that actually have a soul behind the effects, and those are enough to satisfy me without have to see every single event movie that comes out.

Full confession: I did pay to see The Island at the cheap theatre a few years ago, but it was mainly because I like both of the leads, and the concept looked interesting. I also saw I, Robot, mainly because I had faith that Alex Proyas's vision would somehow balance out the presence of Will Smith and a bastardized version of Asimov's World.

You know, I totally agree. I go into a number of films ever summer expecting them to be pretty awful (Terminator was one of them), but I didn't expect it to be this awful. I'm pretty sure nobody involved with the film knows how to read. I'd almost urge you to see it at some point (not in theaters obviously, you shouldn't have to pay for this shit) just to understand how dumb this movie was. It honestly shines good light on Transformers by comparison.

 

[Lancemc]

Don't read too much into it. Some people are just art-film snobs.

Nobody goes into a summer blockbuster expecting to see Bergman, don't be an ass.

 

[lazarus]

Do most film snobs talk about Star Wars as much as we do?

 

[the tourist]

Do most film snobs talk about Star Wars as much as we do?

Of my experience with film snobs? Yes. Definitely.

 

[powerhour24]

DAMN YOU MICHAEL BAY!!!

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why people with decent taste would go anywhere near the likes of Terminator 3, Terminator: Salvation, Transformers, G.I. Joe, etc. You can smell that crap a mile away. There's always a couple popcorn films every summer that actually have a soul behind the effects, and those are enough to satisfy me without have to see every single event movie that comes out.

Full confession: I did pay to see The Island at the cheap theatre a few years ago, but it was mainly because I like both of the leads, and the concept looked interesting. I also saw I, Robot, mainly because I had faith that Alex Proyas's vision would somehow balance out the presence of Will Smith and a bastardized version of Asimov's World.

I don't know, I'm a little more selective most of the time with movies, and never go near mainstream crap with music or books, but I don't mind turning my brain off, and that's all my point was. When I get around to it I enjoy discussing movies with you guys and I'm usually in the same boat, but today was just about having fun, and I did.

Didn't mean to start a suppsoed snob versus mainstream movie debate here, and Lance thank you for pulling two sentences I didn't like much myself out of the whole thing that I wrote and making me look just great! +



Now, let me ask this, anyone around here seen The Brothers Bloom? I didn't totally buy into Brick, but I do love that cast, and have been waiting for it through the multiple delays. I'm debating with myself when I'll put up with the snobby mcsnobsnobs that go to the only theater its playing at near me to see it, but soon, probably a weekday matinee if I'm free.

 

[Lancemc]

Of my experience with film snobs? Yes. Definitely.

Well, if all that distinguishes a film snob is an especially critical eye and generally higher standards when it comes to movie consumption then sure. I'll firmly embrace such a distinction.

 

[Lancemc]

Lance thank you for pulling two sentences I didn't like much myself out of the whole thing that I wrote and making me look just great! +

Well you didn't make it particularly hard for me that time.

 

[deep]

DAMN YOU MICHAEL BAY!!!

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why people with decent taste would go anywhere near the likes of Terminator 3, Terminator: Salvation, ......

Powerhour24 did not give this movie any high praise, like myself he just went for a good time.
I think I said I enjoyed it but it was forgettable. As someone that goes to a lot of movies, sometimes you just go to see the special effects and action shots. T3 is at 7.3 with over 17,000 votes on IMDB. (voting by plain folks and a random bored snob or two)
T2 is at 6.7, so I guess most people agree with Power and myself.


Brothers Bloom is playing near by, I hope to see it this week. I like the cast.

 

[Lancemc]

T3 is at 7.3 with over 17,000 votes on IMDB. (voting by plain folks and a random bored snob or two)
T2 is at 6.7, so I guess most people agree with Power and myself.

You've got those Ts wrong. T4 has the 7.3 and T3 has the 6.7. Just for clarification.

And for the record, I prefer T3 GREATLY to Terminator Salvation. Of course I kind of hate T3, but still...

 

[deep]

sorry, thanks for the correction

I may have liked T3 more than T4, too.

I don't spend a lot of time thinking about them once I leave the theater.

but, I have watched T1 and T2 on the T V a couple of more times.

 

[LMP]

Now, let me ask this, anyone around here seen The Brothers Bloom? I didn't totally buy into Brick, but I do love that cast, and have been waiting for it through the multiple delays. I'm debating with myself when I'll put up with the snobby mcsnobsnobs that go to the only theater its playing at near me to see it, but soon, probably a weekday matinee if I'm free.

I loved Brick and can't wait to catch Bloom soon.

And hey, at least the snobbery comments aren't insulting or anything. People go to see shit for different reasons, so what? I'm in the camp that wants to have a solid enough story and characters that I care about along with all of the action, which is why T2, Aliens, Raiders of the Lost Ark, and Die Hard work incredibly well. Are they as complex as something like Brick, for example? Probably not, but hey, they hit on those fundamental levels and deliver stuff that's fresh and exciting even if it may have been done before (specifically Raiders). And there's something to be said about that.

This whole new breed of McG/Michael Bay/Wachowski-style movie, to me at least, are all style and no substance. And it's cool if people like that, a lot of them do. But when I go see Transformers to see robots turn into cars and fight and Megan Fox look incredibly hot, I don't want to see Shia LaBeouf running around in the middle of it all and lame attempts at humor. I hope the sequel is more about the spectacle than the retard running around ruining my childhood.

And if you're going to do another movie in a "franchise," at least have some respect for the ones that came before it. X3 looks average compared to the inane shitfest that was Wolverine, and I didn't like the former either. There's no rhyme or reason to anything in that film, it goes against what happens in the previous X-Men films, the characters aren't compelling, the action scenes aren't that exciting, and it all looked incredibly cheap. Thanks for shitting the bed on one of my favorite comic book characters, Fox.

sorry, thanks for the correction

I may have liked T3 more than T4, too.

I don't spend a lot of time thinking about them once I leave the theater.

but, I have watched T1 and T2 on the T V a couple of more times.

And that's the difference between the Cameron films and the other two.