Women as priests...a sin??? Vatican excommunicates 7. - Page 2 - U2 Feedback

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Old 08-06-2002, 10:13 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Angela Harlem
Bama I am really surprised you are discrediting something because of its source. I am aware that source is important, but I sincerely doubt the magazine would publish such an article in the hope THEY may knock some sense into the vatican. As Danospano said, it was written by an ex-priest. I think an ex-priest, regardless of where his words end up printed, would have some interesting things to say about the church.
Angela_Harlem:

I do not "discredit" the article, but I sincerely believe that the Church should look to its critics WITHIN rather than in PLAYBOY. In fact, they should have listened to the ex-priest when he was still a priest. I probably agree with much of what he said.

I just find it funny that we look to nudie books for advice on how the Church should operate. I also find it funny that PLAYBOY is telling anyone how women should be viewed/treated, etc.

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Old 08-06-2002, 11:17 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Bama


I also find it funny that PLAYBOY is telling anyone how women should be viewed/treated, etc.

Well, there's something Bama and I can agree on.
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Old 08-07-2002, 01:11 AM   #23
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Point taken Bama, should I have said dismissed? But neither here nor there. I have never read the magazine either I don't believe, except for once years ago when my friend announced she had gone snooping in her mum's drawers and found a whole bunch of men's mags. We had a quick read of one and it did contain a semi intersting article on I think mens roles in the average household compared to 30 years ago or something. Run of the mill, nothing groundbreaking, but not really toilet reading either.

The church and God are so far removed from each other. Its kinda ironic that a mens magazine has more respect for women than the Vatican.
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Old 08-08-2002, 01:55 AM   #24
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Not that I really have a voice in the Catholic Church...

But...I do have opinions on this issue.

I traced my ancestry back to around 400AD and found two women (Queens) ,Saint Margaret Atheling and Saint Clotild descendant from Charlemagne who were sainted for initiating Catholicism in their country as a faith and reinforcing the catholic church and christianity in early France and Europe. This was MANY people...NOT just one's opinion on the issue.
I fail to see why this particular post "priest" should exclude people who can get a Nation to follow their lead and bring Europe out of the Dark Ages?
Women are a gender and NOT being a male doesn't mean we are pagans. I applaud these women for taking a stand for something they have devoted their lives to and something they whole heartedly believe in.
I also believe that the word "Man" in The Bible should be taken in context in many uses as a reference to the entire species and not just the male gender (Freudian thinking...humpf!) because as a population we have evolved to believe that both sexes have not only a mind but a voice.....just my opinion.
To those women who took the time and effort to become ordained>God Speed their efforts!!!!!
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Old 08-08-2002, 10:58 PM   #25
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The women could have been excommunicated for accepting ordination from someone who's not recognized as a bishop by the Vatican. The ultra-conservative group that doesn't recognize the teachings of the Second Vatican Council is excommunicate for this reason--their big shot ordained priests. I'm a practicing Catholic, and I don't see why we can't ordain women, either. But I also don't see why we should do something because it was endorsed in Playboy magazine.
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Old 08-11-2002, 03:18 PM   #26
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I thought of the ultraconservatives who got kicked out after their big shot ordained priests....the Society of St. Pius X, or SSPX. They think the Church is being run by the Freemasons and have some other views that I think are completely off the wall.
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Old 08-11-2002, 08:57 PM   #27
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I don't post much in FYM, but this is an interesting topic. I am a bit late entering the discussion, but I just wanted to mention a couple minor things.

I am not Catholic. I grew up in a rather conservative wing of the Lutheran Church. Women had a diminished role. Not as extreme as some churches, but there were usually no women as officers in the church and even now there are very few women as ministers. There weren't any rules against it, it just wasn't done.

I often wondered, and still do, why women could not be priests. Mary the Mother of Jesus plays such an important role in the Catholic Church. She is looked up to, prayed to and revered...but women have such a minor role and cannot be priests. It just has never made any sense to me.
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Old 08-11-2002, 09:12 PM   #28
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I found this article last night
http://my.aol.com/news/news_story.ps...08110356000021

So apparently from these two stories we can draw the conclusion that spreading the word of God (if you're female) is a worse offense then sexually abusing children. So let me get this straight you'll get excommuniated if you're a female who tries to become a priest, but you can rape children and not even lose your postition in the church. This makes me so mad GRRRR AHHHH I don't even have words to express how angry this makes me FUCKING.... GAH!!!! Also apparently homosexuality this terrible, deadly sin......but only if it's between two consenting adults, if it's with an innocent child it's only a minor offence.
On another note: good plan with the whole giving abusive priests administrative jobs plan.....that would make it impossible for them to get access to children and is truely a just punishment for their actions *rolls eyes*.....and isn't the statistic something like 95% of child molesters will repeat their crime if let out in the general public?


Note: this post is in no way meant to bash Catholics, some of my relatives are Catholic, but to bash the hypocritical high ranking clergy that turn the other way when they see these things going on...........God sees what you have done.
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Old 08-11-2002, 10:37 PM   #29
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Here's more information on that Playboy article that contains details on life within the Catholic Church (as told by a former priest):

Title: "Sex and Sanctity: One man's story about religious life and what seminaries really teach about sex."

Author: Charles J. O'Bryne

September 2002 Issue
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Old 08-11-2002, 11:18 PM   #30
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It annoys me no end when a Catholic big shot blasts being gay as a terrible sin and then we find out he's covered up for priests who abused children. Likewise when they punish women for wanting to be priests after pushing gays into the closet. I will agree, this stinks. The church needs to judge less and tolerate more. Our big shots have a few messes to clean up. They're going after the wrong people. Being Catholic means that all of this crud really pisses me off because it's my church.
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Old 08-11-2002, 11:28 PM   #31
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Why don't we just stop going to church? I know most of us don't go in the first place, but it seems that the majority of voices that dominate American politics are with the church.

It surprises me that in a country where fewer than 1/4 of the population actually goes to church that there is so much debate over religious issues.

Stop going to church and take back what is rightfully yours! Am I right? I might be wrong, but isn't religion a form of mind-control set to divert our attention away from a class war between the have and have-nots? Am I sounded like a Communist? Maybe, but that doesn't disqualify the question.
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Old 08-12-2002, 12:11 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano
Why don't we just stop going to church? I know most of us don't go in the first place, but it seems that the majority of voices that dominate American politics are with the church.

It surprises me that in a country where fewer than 1/4 of the population actually goes to church that there is so much debate over religious issues.

Stop going to church and take back what is rightfully yours! Am I right? I might be wrong, but isn't religion a form of mind-control set to divert our attention away from a class war between the have and have-nots? Am I sounded like a Communist? Maybe, but that doesn't disqualify the question.

Religion *has* been, and still is, used to justify much evil. It's been used in everything from witch hunts and Inquisitions to stupid political games that used it to make slavery and other unjust things "moral" and a whole slew of horrid stuff. What draws some of us to the church is certainly not any of this. It's a search for something permanent in this jungle of uncertain transience that life is. It's tough to be an autistic. It's a bunch of depression, anxiety, cognitive limitations and other things that are, to say the least, a drag. Being a Catholic gives me a sense of stability and hope that I'd never trade. If it's a voluntary act, then religion isn't coercion. I choose to do this, and believe this.
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Old 08-12-2002, 01:13 AM   #33
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If you want to believe in a religion, go ahead. It's your life, and I respect your desicion to have faith is something you can't see. If it gives you comfort and hope, I applaud you for defending it.

My opinion is and has been stated many times in the past. I don't get any reassurance from organized religions and that's why "I" choose to have a personal relationship with the cosmos, the Supreme Being, the Great Spirit. Even though I have no proof of a spiritual being, I believe there is more to life than what meets the eye.

Organized religion is mind-control. It's a crutch. It's a warm-bubble bath.

Maybe, someday my perspective and opinon will change, but until then I'm sticking with my method. I don't need a Pope, a messiah, a prophet, or a fat, bald, laughing Buddha to be one with my surroundings.
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Old 08-12-2002, 02:41 AM   #34
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Oh my *insert random and numerous explitaves here*, Shannon. That is DISGUSTING that the Catholic heirarchy would even consider relaxing punishments on men caught sexually abusing children. As usual, you're right, they set up three layers of double standards. The male priests are on top, who can abuse whomever, until they do it with another consenting man and then he goes to hell. Women are dead last, they're not only barred from the order, but their efforts and voluntary service for the Church is not even recognized.

So, it's better to be a child molster in the Catholic Church than to be gay or a women outside of it.
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Old 08-12-2002, 02:22 PM   #35
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I must say that I'm very angry about the whole molestation thing. It's obscene. The big shots have done a lousy job dealing with this stuff. They're still screwing up, and the only reason they did anything in the first place is because we put up a stink about it and filed a bunch of lawsuits and stuff. This is disgusting.
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Old 08-12-2002, 04:57 PM   #36
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Interestingly, in Marian apparition circles, the destruction of the Church is foretold before its rebirth. Kind of like that "destroy the temple; rebuild in three days" idea in the gospels.

I often don't know what to think of these apparitions--whether to believe them or not--but it is interesting watching some of the pieces come together.

As always, faith should come before the institution. Most of us sincerely know this, but yet, those who are supposed to be leading us are the last to know. We have a hierarchy going in one direction, with 90% of its 1 billion+ followers in the other.

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Old 08-12-2002, 07:39 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon
Interestingly, in Marian apparition circles, the destruction of the Church is foretold before its rebirth. Kind of like that "destroy the temple; rebuild in three days" idea in the gospels.

I often don't know what to think of these apparitions--whether to believe them or not--but it is interesting watching some of the pieces come together.

As always, faith should come before the institution. Most of us sincerely know this, but yet, those who are supposed to be leading us are the last to know. We have a hierarchy going in one direction, with 90% of its 1 billion+ followers in the other.

Melon
That's interesting. I'm not big into Marian devotion so I didn't know about that idea, but it makes sense, particularly with the hierarchy going the way they are. They are completely out of touch.
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