Why will the Democrats win in 2008?

Dreadsox · 12-29-2007, 08:50 PM

Thoughts?

I believe America may be looking for someone that is somewhat of a Washington outsider with fresh ideas. My gut tells me that Obama is the candidate with the best shot at beating the Republican candidate. I think he is showing that he is a shrewd campaigner, capable of standing up to the best of them.

anitram · 12-29-2007, 08:54 PM

The Dems are anti-war but it doesn't matter anymore, because the public honestly doesn't care. They've moved on to other, domestic issues. On that front, the only thing the Republicans seem to be crowing about is immigration. Not enough to win an election.

Plus, the Republican party will self-destruct from within. They are splitting off into factions, which only helps the Dems.

phillyfan26 · 12-29-2007, 08:58 PM

Because people are becoming sick of the GOP, I imagine.

U2democrat · 12-29-2007, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by anitram
The Dems are anti-war but it doesn't matter anymore, because the public honestly doesn't care.

What makes you think this?

The public is fatigued yes, but to say they don't care is just plain wrong.

unico · 12-29-2007, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by anitram
the public honestly doesn't care. They've moved on to other, domestic issues.

No, not really. Actually, from what I've encountered much of their frustrations about how this war is being carried out is incorporated in more conversations. We're tired of our friends/family/or ourselves getting sent back over and over again...and for what? This public is tired of this crap, yes, but they sure as hell have not stopped caring, especially when so many are affected.

U2democrat · 12-29-2007, 09:16 PM

Anyway, the Dems will win if the American people are fed up with 8 years of Republican rule in the WH.

unico · 12-29-2007, 09:22 PM

I also predict that the next president (who will be democrat) will serve two terms. You know, just to fit the pattern

Dreadsox · 12-29-2007, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by U2democrat

What makes you think this?

The public is fatigued yes, but to say they don't care is just plain wrong.

I absolutely agree with you. There is not a person I have spoken with about this election that has not mentioned the war either in a positive way or a negative one.

anitram · 12-29-2007, 09:33 PM

I meant more that it is no longer the driving issue the way it was in the 2006 elections - nothing to do with not caring about say, the troops in the field. Although if we're being honest I think there is a very large apathetic portion of the population which frankly gives the troops pretty much zero thought.

At this point, the fatalities are down, but I don't think the war is being won politically at all. It's like slapping on a band aid. The public cares about secondary things related to the war - ie. the budget, spending, and so on, not the day to day happenings, they way they did before the last midterms.

unico · 12-29-2007, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by anitram
Although if we're being honest I think there is a very large apathetic portion of the population which frankly gives the troops pretty much zero thought.

Can you offer examples for this point? Support for the troops is everywhere I turn. I find this quite surprising. There's loads of local groups in the community that send care packages regularly, more cars have the "support our troops" magnets/stickers than any other sticker I see, and they get special prayers offered in every church I've been to. They get even airtime on the local tv giving shout-outs to their families. Anytime a soldier from the community returns home, or is killed, it is a big deal. I don't know anybody who says they don't care for the troops.

Unless of course this population you are talking about is the administration. In that case, I agree wholeheartedly

anitram · 12-29-2007, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by unico

I don't know anybody who says they don't care for the troops.

But that isn't what I've said. I said that there is a large group who gives them no thought. That's quite something different. I mean that there are many people who don't know anyone who is enlisted or in Iraq and their daily lives are not affected by worry or anything other than reading about it in the paper. We have about a dozen exchange students from the US here (from schools in LA, Washington, Virginia and Ohio), and just in chatting with them about political stuff I often asked if they had family members in Iraq and so on. They didn't, although one knew somebody from their high school who was in Afghanistan. One had a yellow ribbon on their car, but told me that her Dad had bought it for her and that to be honest, she didn't much think about Iraq at all except around the election time. The sense from the rest of them was pretty much the same - they liked going out, they liked going snowboarding, most didn't care about politics at all (I doubt they were even voters), and I can bet my bank account that the safety of the troops likely didn't enter most of their minds once in the last month. They seemed completely detached from the political process.

That doesn't mean that they'd say they don't care about the troops. I bet if you asked them, they would - they're human and young and have empathy for their peers. But day to day? They sure had other things on their mind.

Dreadsox · 12-29-2007, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by anitram

But that isn't what I've said. I said that there is a large group who gives them no thought. That's quite something different. I mean that there are many people who don't know anyone who is enlisted or in Iraq and their daily lives are not affected by worry or anything other than reading about it in the paper.

Do you think they are voters? If they are this out of touch will they be voting? I hope not.

anitram · 12-29-2007, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dreadsox

Do you think they are voters? If they are this out of touch will they be voting? I hope not.

I didn't ask them but I got the sense some of them weren't voters and didn't care. Although sometimes I wonder whether people like that will go vote on their campus anyway, because everyone else is doing it?

unico · 12-29-2007, 10:01 PM

i don't think that a dozen exchange students are in any way a microcosm of a society. you're using a small sample and said there was a "large apathetic portion of the population" based on that sample which is very controlled. from what i've seen, i don't believe that many people are so apathetic.

anitram · 12-29-2007, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by unico
i don't think that a dozen exchange students are in any way a microcosm of a society. you're using a small sample and said there was a "large apathetic portion of the population" based on that sample which is very controlled.

Well you're certainly welcome to disagree. It's a small sample but I don't think they are somehow completely out there and the majority of people thinks about the troops in Iraq on a daily basis. After the election in November you will come here and wonder again, perhaps in mild outrage, why half the people in your country didn't vote. Well, if that's not proof of a large apathetic portion of the population, I'm not sure what better one there is.

unico · 12-29-2007, 10:16 PM

Voter turnout was low before and during the Iraq war. In your original post, you said that the public have moved on from the war. I'm saying they have not. The low voter turnout is an overall lack of faith in politics/politicians for many reasons. Not because the public has "has moved on from the war" or due to any one single issue.

Also you say that you don't think the majority of people think about Iraq on a daily basis, and I still disagree. I invite you to watch a local news network. Over here in DC we have NBC4: http://www.nbc4.com/ Even now when you click on the link you'll see a handful of related Iraq stories. Every day there is something about it covered. It really is everywhere here.

Anyway, sorry to derail your thread, Dread. I'll go back to my little corner now

coemgen · 12-29-2007, 11:19 PM

They will win because Barack Obama is the man.

coemgen · 12-29-2007, 11:48 PM

Actually, not only will they win because of Obama's sheer awesomeness, but Ron Paul will run as an independent, taking away a good chunck of the Republican vote.

maycocksean · 12-30-2007, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by coemgen
They will win because Barack Obama is the man.

Do you really think he'll be able to wrest the nomination from Hillary? She's a pretty formidable force and I really don't see her withering any time soon.

We'll see what happens in Iowa Thursday though. . .

coemgen · 12-30-2007, 12:06 AM

Yes, I do.

12-29-2007, 08:50 PM	#1
Dreadsox ONE love, blood, life Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 10,885 Local Time: 08:35 AM	Why will the Democrats win in 2008? Thoughts? I believe America may be looking for someone that is somewhat of a Washington outsider with fresh ideas. My gut tells me that Obama is the candidate with the best shot at beating the Republican candidate. I think he is showing that he is a shrewd campaigner, capable of standing up to the best of them. __________________

12-29-2007, 08:54 PM	#2
anitram Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: NY Posts: 18,918 Local Time: 09:35 AM	The Dems are anti-war but it doesn't matter anymore, because the public honestly doesn't care. They've moved on to other, domestic issues. On that front, the only thing the Republicans seem to be crowing about is immigration. Not enough to win an election. Plus, the Republican party will self-destruct from within. They are splitting off into factions, which only helps the Dems. __________________

12-30-2007, 12:06 AM	#20
coemgen Rock n' Roll Doggie Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Black and White Town Posts: 3,962 Local Time: 08:35 AM	Yes, I do. __________________

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12-29-2007, 08:58 PM	#3
phillyfan26 Blue Crack Supplier Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 30,343 Local Time: 08:35 AM	Because people are becoming sick of the GOP, I imagine.

12-29-2007, 09:16 PM	#6
U2democrat Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: England by way of 'Murica. Posts: 22,142 Local Time: 01:35 PM	Anyway, the Dems will win if the American people are fed up with 8 years of Republican rule in the WH.

12-29-2007, 09:22 PM	#7
unico Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Rage Ave. Posts: 18,749 Local Time: 08:35 AM	I also predict that the next president (who will be democrat) will serve two terms. You know, just to fit the pattern

12-29-2007, 09:33 PM	#9
anitram Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: NY Posts: 18,918 Local Time: 09:35 AM	I meant more that it is no longer the driving issue the way it was in the 2006 elections - nothing to do with not caring about say, the troops in the field. Although if we're being honest I think there is a very large apathetic portion of the population which frankly gives the troops pretty much zero thought. At this point, the fatalities are down, but I don't think the war is being won politically at all. It's like slapping on a band aid. The public cares about secondary things related to the war - ie. the budget, spending, and so on, not the day to day happenings, they way they did before the last midterms.

12-29-2007, 10:01 PM	#14
unico Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Rage Ave. Posts: 18,749 Local Time: 08:35 AM	i don't think that a dozen exchange students are in any way a microcosm of a society. you're using a small sample and said there was a "large apathetic portion of the population" based on that sample which is very controlled. from what i've seen, i don't believe that many people are so apathetic.

12-29-2007, 10:16 PM	#16
unico Blue Crack Addict Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Rage Ave. Posts: 18,749 Local Time: 08:35 AM	Voter turnout was low before and during the Iraq war. In your original post, you said that the public have moved on from the war. I'm saying they have not. The low voter turnout is an overall lack of faith in politics/politicians for many reasons. Not because the public has "has moved on from the war" or due to any one single issue. Also you say that you don't think the majority of people think about Iraq on a daily basis, and I still disagree. I invite you to watch a local news network. Over here in DC we have NBC4: http://www.nbc4.com/ Even now when you click on the link you'll see a handful of related Iraq stories. Every day there is something about it covered. It really is everywhere here. Anyway, sorry to derail your thread, Dread. I'll go back to my little corner now

12-29-2007, 11:19 PM	#17
coemgen Rock n' Roll Doggie Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Black and White Town Posts: 3,962 Local Time: 08:35 AM	They will win because Barack Obama is the man.

12-29-2007, 11:48 PM	#18
coemgen Rock n' Roll Doggie Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Black and White Town Posts: 3,962 Local Time: 08:35 AM	Actually, not only will they win because of Obama's sheer awesomeness, but Ron Paul will run as an independent, taking away a good chunck of the Republican vote.