"We know Bono's Christian by his love"

[Jamila]

One thing that was missed in this thread is the whole concept of "Grace" (one of Bono's favorite words) and how God can redeem anyone's Heart and Soul, if one is only willing.

Without repeating them, Bono has admitted he has "sinned" in his life and that his life was made whole by ACCEPTING the Grace of God in his life.

It is not up to anyone on this earth to judge another, nor does any religious dogma stand up next to the Grace (the Loving Forgiveness and Acceptance) of God. Bono KNOWS THIS and LIVES THIS DAILY.

Bono still makes mistakes (like all of us) but he has learned how to OVERCOME those mistakes by practicing the Highest Laws of the Universe (Do unto to others as you would have them do unto you/ Love the Lord with ALL your heart and soul and your brothers/sisters as yourself) with humility and a sense of humor.

And remember, Bono is Latin for "Good" which is only one "o" away from God. God loves Good, so God must love Bono.

 

[Mrs. Edge]

Jess, there's a great book I read a while ago called "Being a Christian Without Being Religious." You might enjoy it.

I've never worried about being "religious". Jesus wasn't. Just ask the Pharasees.

SD

LOL! Thanks Sherry!

 

[Diemen]

The danger is when a person makes such things as love, spirituality, humanitarian efforts, etc. their primary goal and desire rather than making God their number one focus. Love and good works apart from a close relationship with God through Christ is, quite frankly, pointless humanistic nonsense which simply deceives a person into believing that they're a "good person" rather than relying upon Christ as their only hope of being cleansed and made righteous.

I know this has already been touched upon, but to call selfless acts of kindness towards your fellow man "humanistic nonsense" if not done with a close relationship to Christ is absolutely ridiculous and downright offensive. It is perfectly possible for one to be a truly good person without having a close relationship to God. To suggest otherwise is petty elitism. You would think religion would be more welcoming of altruism and a true desire to help people, regardless of the religion or spirituality of the people making a difference.

I find it very unnerving how some people seem to think they know exactly how God works. Until he personally sits us down and explains it to us, it is simply impossible to fully know and understand his ways. To so rigidly define the ways in which God will accept us into heaven, if anything, demeans the greatness of God and puts human limitations on his divine power.

 

[melon]

I've studied up enough Christianity to see it go through plenty of phases. I think what I really hate is how evangelical Christianity as we know it was invented in the 1800s, and, yet, they act as if they have always existed and that their beliefs are the only correct ones.

In terms of "faith" versus "good works," the entire debate is nothing more than politics. The debate made sense back in 1520, when the Catholic Church was literally selling salvation in indulgences. Hence, if you were rich, you could literally "buy" your way into heaven. That's what the debate was about: whether you could "work" (or buy) your way into heaven, while being a completely reprehensible person otherwise. Nowadays, the debate is nothing short of ridiculous. Evangelicals cry "faith," yet ramble on about "works" that make God mad, and then condemn those people to hell, even if they have faith in Jesus. Trust me...we all are angels compared to people 500 years ago. I'm certainly happy to be alive now, compared to then.

But if there's one theme over the past 2000 years, it has been religion trying to scare us into submission to their authority. Well, guess what? I don't know who the hell these people are, but their comments are no better or worse than yours. They are not God, so why exult their beliefs higher than yours? Because they scream louder? The keys to faith are within our grasp, and we do not need others telling us what to do.

Melon

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

I find it very unnerving how some people seem to think they know exactly how God works. Until he personally sits us down and explains it to us, it is simply impossible to fully know and understand his ways. To so rigidly define the ways in which God will accept us into heaven, if anything, demeans the greatness of God and puts human limitations on his divine power.

. We all have our own ideas regarding how God works, sure-I certainly have my own views-that's fine and dandy, but I, nor anyone else, knows for sure how God works, and I personally am not about to start acting like I do know.

Also...

Originally posted by paxetaurora
One thing no one else, not even the writer of the article, has mentioned that Bono also practices Christian love close to him--how many major rock stars like Bono can say they've had one wife for 20 years on whom they've never cheated?

Excellent point. .

Angela

 

[BostonAnne]

I've studied up enough Christianity to see it go through plenty of phases. I think what I really hate is how evangelical Christianity as we know it was invented in the 1800s, and, yet, they act as if they have always existed and that their beliefs are the only correct ones.

So if the evangelical Christianity as we know it was invented in the 1800's - what happened to all of the people before them that thought they were Christians but didn't follow the newly created beliefs? No one went to heaven until Christianity was followed the way people started to in the 1800's?

 

[U2luv]

Jess, there's a great book I read a while ago called "Being a Christian Without Being Religious." You might enjoy it.

I've never worried about being "religious". Jesus wasn't. Just ask the Pharasees.

SD

I read a book not long ago that was actually mentioned by Bono at one time. The book may actually give you, Mrs. the Edge, a better understanding of what Grace is. I got a great deal out of it. It's called "What's So Amazing About Grace" by Philip Yancey.

 

[indra]

Thank you for your responses.... Nothing depresses me more than the whole topic of Christianity and religion because I wish that I could be religious but there are too many obstacles in the way that I am trying unsuccessfully to get past.

For example, today I saw an A&E biography on David Berkowitz (Son of Sam). After being a famous serial killer and spending a great deal of time in jail, he is now a Born Again Christian. He wants everything to be "wiped clean". He feels wonderful now, the chains that bind have been released. Now his life will have purpose. Well GOOD FOR HIM! I don't think he DESERVES to feel wonderful and have his bad deeds wiped clean. How does this in any way make up for what he did to the victims? I just can't believe that Born Again Christians literally get away with murder and God says "you have a relationship with me so....no problem" How do you all wrap your heads and hearts around this????

I know I've asked this question before in some form or other, but I never get a truly satisfactory answer, so I keep forgetting what the reasoning is. I guess I'm one of these people that has to hear it over and over again until something clicks.

Also, it was a Baptist minister that converted him. What is the difference between Baptists, Pentacostals, Charismatic Christians, Evangelicals and the like? Are they all in the same category?

Mrs. Edge, have you ever considered looking at different belief systems? I don't mean a different version of Christianity, but say Hinduism? I bring up Hinduism, as I have been reading The Bhagavad Gita off and on over the past year, and I think it addresses the Berkowitz issue very well.

The ultimate goal is brahma-nirvana, meaning the end of the self-will, the limited being that is human, (nirvana) and the integration of the Self within everything back into the universal Godhead (the Brahman). Essentially, you get sucked back into the cosmic all and become one with god.

To get to that point is quite the process, but I only want to touch (very, very lightly too) only one aspect. Karma -- basically it's the law of cause and effect. You reap what you sow. David Berkowitz is loaded up with karma, really bad karma. And he has to work that out (amongst other things) before he can merge with the cosmic all (as we all must). And this is going to take many lifetimes, any positive progress he's made now does help, but I'm pretty sure he has plenty of karma to keep him going through the death/rebirth process many times.

Part of what I find so attractive in reading the Gita is the it's not a case of "one and done," that even if you screw up this life, you aren't going to burn in hell for all eternity. And if you do lead an exemplary life, but don't hit that ultimate goal...well you also get to try again (this time in a life that may be more suited to getting you to that next level).

Now that I have butchered Hinduism (and parts of Buddhism too) with my pitiful explaination -- I'm neither, by the way, I don't consider myself to adhere to any set religion/sect -- if you are interested in learning more, I would suggest reading Eknath Easwaran's translation of The Bhagavad Gita. He has the basic text and also quite a bit of commentary/explanation which is geared to the western reader, who may be more familiar with Christian concepts. I actually do not find the two belief systems systems to be terribly contradictory.

 

[Mrs. Edge]

Thank you for your suggestions, everyone! And indra, that was very interesting! I have no clue how I am going to fit all this research into my schedule, but I will try. My biggest fear is to channel all my energies into the "wrong" religion. That's probably why I take so long to find a path...

 

[PennyPyro]

One thing that was missed in this thread is the whole concept of "Grace" (one of Bono's favorite words) and how God can redeem anyone's Heart and Soul, if one is only willing.

Without repeating them, Bono has admitted he has "sinned" in his life and that his life was made whole by ACCEPTING the Grace of God in his life.

It is not up to anyone on this earth to judge another, nor does any religious dogma stand up next to the Grace (the Loving Forgiveness and Acceptance) of God. Bono KNOWS THIS and LIVES THIS DAILY.

Bono still makes mistakes (like all of us) but he has learned how to OVERCOME those mistakes by practicing the Highest Laws of the Universe (Do unto to others as you would have them do unto you/ Love the Lord with ALL your heart and soul and your brothers/sisters as yourself) with humility and a sense of humor.

And remember, Bono is Latin for "Good" which is only one "o" away from God. God loves Good, so God must love Bono.

Yes.

This is a very interesting discussion.

As for the mention of the serial killer being pardoned...no one deserves to be forgiven, in my belief. I know it's hard to see all people as sinners, regardless of how good they are, and all "saveable", regardless of how bad they are. I've never had to deal with mass murderers, but i have had to deal with people who seemed to have nothing but hate (the root cause of murder) towards me. Yet i also believe everyone is made in God's image, no matter how messed the image is now, there is still some left of that image. I don't David Berkowitz, but for every wrong-doing, someone does get punished, i believe, either the person who did the wrong, or Christ on the cross. There have been many people who have done awful things, but changed. Saul of Tarsus was not a very "tolerant" person, in that he had many people killed or imprisoned just for believing in Christ. But Saul later became the apostle Paul. He was really big on grace, although he never "put down" good works...good works to him (and me) are awesome; they are the result of salvation, not the cause of it. I guess some Christians...im not naming any names, i can't even remember who said what in this conversation...some Christians put down good works, while others put down grace. Neither should be put down.

 

[PennyPyro]

Oh i forgot to add, i have "How to be a Christian Without Being Religious"--it's basically the book of Romans with understandable commentary (but if someone else has read it and thinks theres more to it, then feel free to disagree), and it changed my life.
Also, Jamila, i like that last line...in fact one of my sn's is jesuslovesbono

 

[Jamila]

PennyPyro, thanks for the POSITIVE feedback.

I am COMPLETELY convinced that Bono was given the name "Bono" for a reason much more than just "good voice".

There was a cosmic reason for this man to carry around such a potentially awesome name - because "the forces that be", the Universe, the Almighty - KNEW that this man, short of stature but ENORMOUS OF HEART, would one day LIVE UP TO HIS NAME and become greater than he ever thought he would!

I truthfully believe that Bono has BECOME A LIVING ANGEL IN OUR MIDST and his efforts to help the world, whether nations of people or a few "fans", will ALWAYS BE BLESSED.

All I want to do is to draw people's attention to this careful observation of mine over the years and to help establish a sense of God living amongst our midsts in the form of ANGELS LIKE BONO!

Thanks, PennyPyro, for your affirmative comments. I'm glad to know that some folks out here really understand Bono's significance.

BONO, YOU ARE DEARLY LOVED AND DEEPLY RESPECTED!

 

[BostonAnne]

Jamila, that's a neat observation. I tend to think of Bono as more of a prophet than an Angel. To me, he is a person gifted with profound moral insight and exceptional powers of expression.

Bono!

 

[Jamila]

BostonAnne -

I also think of Bono as a prophet (there is actually some coincidental "evidence" I use to back this observation up with).

I also am completely convinced that Bono has a large piece of the Heart and Soul of King David. If you read the lyrics of SO MANY of U2's songs (Beautiful Day, ISHFWILF, Always, I Will Follow, etc) you can't help but see how similar they are to so many of the PSALMS.

I won't go into lyrical analysis here, but these similarities ARE there. That's why I call Bono's (U2's) songs their songs/psalms because that is what they TRULY ARE!

And the prophetic way in which Bono has been speaking regarding first the Jubilee movement and now about the Global AIDS pandemic, his prophetic side shows ALL THE MORE BRIGHTER!

Thanks for your input, BostonAnne, I always value your ideas.

GRACE FINDS BEAUTY IN EVERYTHING....

 

[verte76]

Bono is the most amazing person I know of. Period. The guy never ceases to amaze me.

 

[BostonAnne]

I totally agree Jamila & Verte76!

I think Bono/U2 have been very gifted as to be able to read the Bible and pull out what we can't leave behind Perhaps they did this when they had to reconcile their careers and their religious beliefs.

He has lead me to Church and lead me to serve. My only wish is that I had more time to serve right now.

Sigh - I almost heard him speak last week. I guess a big public rally in a state that already leans heavily towards supporting him in his journey wouldn't make sense during a week where security is such a huge concern. There were less than 20 of us to squeeze in though! I feel like I missed a piece of history. Next time maybe!