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Old 10-09-2018, 04:13 PM   #41
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.



I just got a really disturbing image of Trump dancing to that song in my head. Thanks.
my bad. Let me help.

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Old 10-09-2018, 04:33 PM   #42
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Maybe we should run Taylor Swift in 2020.
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Old 10-09-2018, 05:45 PM   #43
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I think there was some discussion about 2020 candidates at the end of the last thread, and I wanted to chime in...

Warren is perhaps my first choice. She knows how to get a crowd excited - in that regard she's perhaps better than any female politician I've seen and also better than a lot of male ones too. I have two concerns though:

1. We have two-year election cycles now, and I don't know if I can stomach two years of Drumpf calling her Pocahontas every day for two years. It's nauseating to think about. I hate the misogyny that permeates his base.

2. The governor of Massachusetts is a Republican. If we don't take back the Senate in the midterms, we'll have another chance in 2020, and if Warren were to run and win, the Republican governor would fill her seat with a Republican. Something to think about. In contrast Harris and Booker are both from states with Democratic governors(I'm assuming Gavin Newsom will win his governor's race in California in November). Speaking of which...

Harris & Booker are both similar in that they are young, African-American, relatively new to the Senate, and both are excellent politicians who can get a crowd going wild(Booker blew the roof off the place at the 2016 Democratic convention). They are both eminently likable I'd be able to support either wholeheartedly. Though it should be mentioned that the far-left Bernie types are going to tear Booker apart for his connections to Wall Street.

Gillibrand doesn't interest me much. Too much like Hillary. I had no problem voting for Hillary, but I don't love her, and I feel like Gillibrand would present some of the same problems as a candidate - too reserved, too buttoned up, unable to really light a fire under the base. Then again, she's the one I know least about here, so maybe I'll change my mind.

Biden. There isn't a bigger fan of Biden than me. I love the man. Back in 2008, after Obama locked up the nomination and the media was speculating about who he would pick to be his VP, the whole time I was saying Biden, it's gotta be Biden, he's clearly the best candidate, the best person, the most qualified, etc. I think he was a great VP. I love him. But I'm weary of him running. Because he's 80. Because I fear that while he'll appeal to people in Ohio/Pennsylvania/Michigan/etc who may have voted for Drumpf, I feel that the increasingly liberal base may seem him as too centrist. That said, I could get on board, if he were to, say, commit to serving one-term only, and select a younger home-run VP candidate to basically have the nomination served up on a platter in 2024, i.e. Booker or Harris maybe.

Sanders. I'm sorry, but I've decided that I don't want him to run. He's just too divisive. I started as a Bernie supporter in 2016. I voted for him in the Ohio primary. But I became increasingly uncomfortable with him and his supporters as time wore on. With him, because he talked about one thing only and appeared to have no mental agility - nothing to say about anything else, especially foreign policy, he was one-note - he was too lax about gun-control, and he didn't appeal enough to minority voters who are vital to getting Democrats elected. With his supporters, because to them Bernie was the only honest progressive. Even now, they call Warren, Harris, and Booker faux-gressives. Because Warren didn't support Bernie in 2016. Because Harris didn't bring charges against Steve Mnuchin's company when she was the AG of California. Because of Booker's aforementioned ties to Wall Street. For them, Bernie is the only one. That's not support of a candidate, it's worship, similar to how Drumpf's supporters worship him, and it's not a healthy relationship to have with a politician. There's no perfect progressive, we can't let 'good' be the enemy of perfect, and I don't want to have to have that argument for the next two years.
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Old 10-09-2018, 05:49 PM   #44
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good lord, there are still people doing the "drumpf" thing?
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Old 10-09-2018, 05:53 PM   #45
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I’d love Harris to run. I think she’s smart, personable, and very well spoken.

While i don’t see her being in the same league as Obama with speeches, i think she has some fire in her and could shoot back at Trump when the insults fly

Plus i get the feeling with her being a former prosecutor she knows how to play chess and set foes up to fail on their own.

Bernie can fuck off. Assuming Mueller can actually finish his job, I’m real curious what comes out about Bernie’s campaign managers ties to Manafort
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Old 10-09-2018, 06:33 PM   #46
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Bernie can fuck off.
This should be the next thread title.

US PolitiXI - Bernie Can Fuck Off
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Old 10-09-2018, 06:47 PM   #47
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When Kamala Harris asked Kavanaugh that question about any laws that the government has the power to make over the male body, that was quite a moment. She's impressive. I don't care how many female law clerks he hires, his stammering response to that question was lame and revealing.

It spoke volumes about the Senate that a woman had to be the one to ask him that question too. Not in a good way, obviously.
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Old 10-09-2018, 07:10 PM   #48
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I do love watching her question people. I have no idea what her qualifications are for the presidency, but she doesn't fuck around, and that's a nice change of pace.
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Old 10-09-2018, 07:13 PM   #49
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Bernie Sanders... divisive? Plenty of criticisms for Sanders, but he is not divisive at all.
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Old 10-09-2018, 07:30 PM   #50
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Bernie Sanders... divisive? Plenty of criticisms for Sanders, but he is not divisive at all.
He is. Or at least a large portion of his supporters are.
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Old 10-09-2018, 07:49 PM   #51
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He is. Or at least a large portion of his supporters are.


Divisive behavior is electing a Supreme Court justice accused to sexual assault prior to his nomination. Or calling voters deplorable (and that’s not a criticism, it’s just the truth - not all divisive behavior is inherently bad - you do want to divide some groups of people - like Nazis!).

The only divisive language Bernie Sanders ever uses is in regards to “the man” when he goes off about thee to .2% or the big banks or whatever.
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Old 10-09-2018, 07:57 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by MrsSpringsteen View Post
When Kamala Harris asked Kavanaugh that question about any laws that the government has the power to make over the male body, that was quite a moment. She's impressive. I don't care how many female law clerks he hires, his stammering response to that question was lame and revealing.

It spoke volumes about the Senate that a woman had to be the one to ask him that question too. Not in a good way, obviously.
Agreed. I'd be totally fine with her running. I'm good with Warren and Booker, too. And of course, there's always the chance there could be somebody else who isn't well known yet in terms of media attention and such who decides to run as well.
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Old 10-09-2018, 07:58 PM   #53
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Divisive behavior is electing a Supreme Court justice accused to sexual assault prior to his nomination. Or calling voters deplorable (and that’s not a criticism, it’s just the truth - not all divisive behavior is inherently bad - you do want to divide some groups of people - like Nazis!).

The only divisive language Bernie Sanders ever uses is in regards to “the man” when he goes off about thee to .2% or the big banks or whatever.
You're being a tad simplistic there.

Socialism is divisive in this country, even for many on the left.

As you said, something doesn't have to be bad to be divisive. There doesn't even have to be any logical answer behind why it's divisive to be divisive.

When there are also very vocal portions of his supporters who believe that he was the only answer, Clinton and Trump are the same, blah blah blah? Yea, that's going to make him divisive to many - even if it's not necessarily any fault of his own.
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Old 10-09-2018, 08:10 PM   #54
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You're being a tad simplistic there.

Socialism is divisive in this country, even for many on the left.

As you said, something doesn't have to be bad to be divisive. There doesn't even have to be any logical answer behind why it's divisive to be divisive.

When there are also very vocal portions of his supporters who believe that he was the only answer, Clinton and Trump are the same, blah blah blah? Yea, that's going to make him divisive to many - even if it's not necessarily any fault of his own.


How is an ideology divisive? Not even the worst of ideologies are divisive. A benevolent dictator in fascism has no enemies to suppress, in theory.

Socialism isn’t divisive.

Your latter point about the idea of Sanders being divisive is situational to the 2016 election. In fact, it’s just as fair to say if he’s divisive in that case, so is Hilary Clinton? I don’t see why one is fair play but the other is not.

But by your definition, Hilary Clinton is also divisive because a bunch of people really hate her. And I wholeheartedly disagree with that statement as well. That’s a mischaracterization of someone who Is perhaps a controversial or contentious selection, but not divisive.

If you want to call Bernie controversial or contentious, that’s fair. But legit, neither of those candidates should be considered divisive.
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Old 10-09-2018, 08:16 PM   #55
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How is an ideology divisive? Not even the worst of ideologies are divisive. A benevolent dictator in fascism has no enemies to suppress, in theory.

Socialism isn’t divisive.

Your latter point about the idea of Sanders being divisive is situational to the 2016 election. In fact, it’s just as fair to say if he’s divisive in that case, so is Hilary Clinton? I don’t see why one is fair play but the other is not.

But by your definition, Hilary Clinton is also divisive because a bunch of people really hate her. And I wholeheartedly disagree with that statement as well. That’s a mischaracterization of someone who Is perhaps a controversial or contentious selection, but not divisive.

If you want to call Bernie controversial or contentious, that’s fair. But legit, neither of those candidates should be considered divisive.
Hillary is crazy divisive. Did you think I'd argue otherwise?

I don't exactly know why you think an ideology can't be divisive, but if that's what you're going with okay. I'll have to disagree with you on that one.


Quote:
di·vi·sive
dəˈvīsiv/
adjective
adjective: divisive
tending to cause disagreement or hostility between people.
I think that fits the bill
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Old 10-09-2018, 08:18 PM   #56
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Yeah, I can't get behind the idea that an ideology can't be divisive, unless I'm going to learn today that I completely don't understand what the word divisive means.
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Old 10-09-2018, 08:26 PM   #57
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Fox News take on Hillary Clinton is divisive. Hillary Clinton herself does little to be divisive.

Sure, you can call an ideology divisive. That doesn’t make Bernie Sanders divisive.

It seems as though you are referring to being divisive as the idea or topic of someone rather than the person themselves.

Donald Trump himself is divisive. He divides. By his action.
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Old 10-09-2018, 08:32 PM   #58
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Fox News take on Hillary Clinton is divisive. Hillary Clinton herself does little to be divisive.

Sure, you can call an ideology divisive. That doesn’t make Bernie Sanders divisive.

It seems as though you are referring to being divisive as the idea or topic of someone rather than the person themselves.

Donald Trump himself is divisive. He divides. By his action.
If you really need to break it down like that, sure - the idea of Bernie Sanders is divisive.

What he stands for is also divisive, though - again, not saying what he says is bad. But any mention of socialism will immediately get old white men to recoil in fear.

No - he does not go around calling people rapists or mocking sexual assault victims or people with disabilities. Only an insane person would do that, and we would never elect an insane person so it's not worth discussing.
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Old 10-09-2018, 08:58 PM   #59
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US PolitiX -Angry Left Wing Mob Edition

The issue with Bernie is that he tends to be all-or-nothing, albeit not as much as his supporters. And that IS divisive in today’s world because it projects hostility towards progressives or liberals who are not progressive enough. And I am sorry but the orange abomination has got to go, and anybody who can’t put aside their blind devotion to some sort of purity test to ensure that we boot out the corrupt and utterly immoral GOP top to bottom can pound dirt.
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Old 10-09-2018, 09:39 PM   #60
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Agreed on your last sentence especially, anitram. It seems weird to me that there's so much infighting in the Democratic party, 'cause on the big issues, regardless of where one falls on the more liberal-leaning scale, we generally seem to be in agreement. The issue seems to be more in terms of how to promote and implement those policies. Even then, though, there's got to be a way we can work that issue out, too.

On a different topic for a moment, a former GOP congressman doesn't seem to think very highly of Lindsay Graham:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/former-go...082310432.html

Quote:
Jolly also had a warning for Republicans: Getting Kavanaugh confirmed will come back to haunt them during next month’s midterm elections.

“The Republican Party has said to women across the country, ‘We don’t believe you,’” Jolly said. “And those women are going to shout very loudly on Nov. 6, and it’s not going to be shouting on behalf of Republicans.”
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