US Politics XIII: Don Jr. The Worst Judgment of Anyone in the World.

[Headache in a Suitcase]

You do realize that it could be that Barr made a reasonable decision and that evidence wasn’t sufficient to prosecute the president directly?

That doesn’t exonerate him and doesn’t stop other investigations.

It’s really hard to know without knowing what’s in the report. We should be vigilant in demanding its transparency both to congress and the public.

This.

If all Mueller does is letter of the law conclude that Trump isn't a Russian asset, which has always been likely, it does not mean whatsoever that he didn't adjust his platform and make decisions as president in order to profit from his potential business interests in Russia - which may not be an actual crime but is still, ya know, kinda important for the American people to know.

If he concludes that they're just a bunch of bumbling idiots but not criminals? Ok, fine. But let the report say that. Also kinda important to know.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

I mean, I was never expecting any outcome to say the president “colluded” with the Russian government in some malicious or treasonous fashion.

I was pretty 50-50 on whether or not they’d find him guilty of obstruction. That aspect doesn’t seem to be over. It sure looks like what we see is there was certainly a lot of obstruction around the President, and a lot of other criminal activity. He certainly associates himself with criminals and engages in some soft criminal-like behavior.

Let’s just see what the Mueller report has to say.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Equally important is all of the criminal behavior associated to the president that Mueller uncovered but handed off because it wasn't letter of the law associated with his directive. Much of what SDNY is doing is based off of Mueller's work

 

[Irvine511]

Collusion itself always seemed difficult. How do you prove that?

But obstruction seems so baldly evident, and my guess is what’s in the report will indicate that’s the case.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

It's over.

It doesn't matter what's in the actual report now. It's time to move on before it's too late for 2020. The case in the court of public opinion is already settled. They will have days of controlling the narrative before any actual evidence is shown to the American public. This is why he needed to get rid of Sessions and why the Barr nomination was the end.

Anything short of the pee tape showing up will be ignored. They won.

 

[Irvine511]

Collusion is over. Obstruction, not so much.

The release of the report is very much alive, and its apparently highly embarrassing to Trump.

The Democrats will have to play this smartly. Which they suck at, except for Pelosi.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

Collusion is over. Obstruction, not so much.

The release of the report is very much alive, and its apparently highly embarrassing to Trump.

The Democrats will have to play this smartly. Which they suck at, except for Pelosi.

But the administration has been able to control the narrative for over 48 hours and counting.

The news reports everywhere are mostly just reporting NO COLLUSION NO COLLUSION TRUMP VINDICATED.

that matters.

That this memo only says that nobody from the campaign worked directly with the IRA. And that's important to know, but it's only a piece of the bigger picture.

But it's now the entire narrative. See? Told you so. NO COLLUSION!

 

[anitram]

It's over.

It doesn't matter what's in the actual report now. It's time to move on before it's too late for 2020. The case in the court of public opinion is already settled. They will have days of controlling the narrative before any actual evidence is shown to the American public. This is why he needed to get rid of Sessions and why the Barr nomination was the end.

Anything short of the pee tape showing up will be ignored. They won.

I totally agree.

The (D) candidates for president need to totally ignore this and move on to talking about issues that matter to people + keep reminding everyone that Trump likes white supremacists, keeps children in cages separated from their nursing mothers, is taking appropriated funds from veterans and is participating in large scale land grabs along the border in such San Francisco states like Texas and Arizona.

 

[LuckyNumber7]

Well Trump himself was driving that narrative all along. When all of his associates were being arrested for lying and for financial crimes, he continued to morph the narrative that the sole purpose of the investigation was to say “Donald Trump conspired with Vladimir Putin. In reality it was a broad scope investigation on Russian interference in the election, with the scope to prosecute any crimes stemming from/related to the investigation.

So yeah, Trump already probably knew he didn’t have anything to do with the Russians interference. It was pretty easy to see that coming. The Russians had ample reason to support trump without his involvement.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

There were three options

1. The President was compromised by the Russians and is an actual Russian asset. This was obviously the worst option, and it's a damn relief that this isn't the case because I honestly don't know how we'd be able to possibly deal with that as a country.

2. The President encouraged and/or ignored Russian interference, and adjusted his own platform and now administration policies for his own personal financial gain.

3. They're just a bunch of bumbling idiots who ended up hiring sketchy people because nobody else would work for them.


With everything we know publicly - it looks like it's both 2 and 3. And that's a huge fucking deal.

But because of how this was built up, and how we now find ourselves having to take the word if a Trump appointee who was specifically put in place because of his feelings on obstruction of Justice and the president, and how the media is just running with it without even seeing any actual evidence, because oh my god they've been so truthful this far why wouldn't we?

It's over. Win in 2020. He'll still have to face the courts when he's out of office. Let them deal with it. The only thing that matters is removing this stain and dealing with whatever is left when he's gone.

 

[BEAL]

So the Flynn, Gates, Cohen, Etc cooperations are going to be tied to financial crimes ?

And the assumption is Mueller handed them off to the states ?

It’s so obvious this report isn’t great for Trump or they’d release all of it. We don’t even know how many pages it is, and the “quotes” from Mueller in it aren’t even full sentences.

Barr made Iran-Contra go away and that’s a big reason he was brought in for this.

I agree that the 2020 candidates need to focus on issues. Let the House Committees gather the info and release it to the public

 

[Irvine511]

I agree that the 2020 candidates need to focus on issues. Let the House Committees gather the info and release it to the public

I think we can all agree on this. Let the House deliver the thousand cuts, let the candidates run on issues like health care and Trump’s generalized incompetence + mendacity.

But let’s also wait to see how this develops.

 

[Honest Broker]

But...but...what about collusion! What about obstruction!? It was a SLAM DUNK!!!!


If only a year ago someone around here would have been saying this is exactly how this would all turn out, we could have saved ourselves a lot of dissapointment.


Right, I'll leave the five of you to it then.


<---------PS. The report button's there!

 

[BEAL]

https://twitter.com/tapstrimedia/status/1110202919067009024?s=21

 

[DaveC]

But...but...what about collusion! What about obstruction!? It was a SLAM DUNK!!!!


If only a year ago someone around here would have been saying this is exactly how this would all turn out, we could have saved ourselves a lot of dissapointment.


Right, I'll leave the five of you to it then.


<---------PS. The report button's there!

imagine having such a sad existence that you take the time to create a new account, and sit on it for over a month for the express purpose of gloating like a teenager to a half dozen people that you were like 40% right about something well over a year ago.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

That's why he's such an HONEST BROKER.

 

[BEAL]

https://twitter.com/goldengateblond/status/1110223338729684992?s=21

How is it the GOP are so good at this ? Are the Democrats just that dumb and ineffective ?

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

https://twitter.com/goldengateblond/status/1110223338729684992?s=21

How is it the GOP are so good at this ? Are the Democrats just that dumb and ineffective ?

Short answer, yes.

Long answer, yesssssssssssss.

 

[Irvine511]

I think we can all agree that the real Honest Broker here is Bill Barr.

 

[Irvine511]

https://twitter.com/goldengateblond/status/1110223338729684992?s=21

How is it the GOP are so good at this ? Are the Democrats just that dumb and ineffective ?

Their voters want to win.

Our voters want to feel special and righteous.

You can do just about anything if you aren’t punished by the electorate.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

this is all very normal behavior

https://twitter.com/jonathanvswan/status/1110254539163291648

thank goodness we had an HONEST BROKER to warn us about it a year ago. or something.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

And there you have it. McConnell blocks senate resolution to make report public.

I know I always like to make sure documents that totally exonerate me from wrong doing are never seen.

 

[dabiggestu2fan]

And there you have it. McConnell blocks senate resolution to make report public.

I know I always like to make sure documents that totally exonerate me from wrong doing are never seen.

Why is this not surprising?

 

[anitram]

this is all very normal behavior

https://twitter.com/jonathanvswan/status/1110254539163291648

thank goodness we had an HONEST BROKER to warn us about it a year ago. or something.

I’m perfectly happy to never have any of those individuals on TV again on the basis that they are liars so long as the same is true of Trump, Kellyanne Conway, Man on Dog Santorum, that random fat guy on CNN who worked on the campaign, Sarah Huckabee Sanders and Rudy Giuliani (ok he can stay for laughs).

 

[BEAL]

Trump and his team have lied about EVERYTHING, so why would this be any different ? Are we really going to believe Barr???

I remember reading on the interwebs that If mueller couldn’t finish his work, there would be mass protests.

Well isn’t it the same thing if he finishes and it’s never released ?

 

[Zephyrpilot]

the special counsel needed more intersectionality in leadership

 

[LuckyNumber7]

imagine having such a sad existence that you take the time to create a new account, and sit on it for over a month for the express purpose of gloating like a teenager to a half dozen people that you were like 40% right about something well over a year ago.

On a U2 web forum’s politics sub forum

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

And there you have it. McConnell blocks senate resolution to make report public.

I know I always like to make sure documents that totally exonerate me from wrong doing are never seen.

Honestly, if the GOP wants to continue to behave this way in response to the report, fine, let them. Most Americans support this report being made public, so the more the GOP tries to hide it and dig in their heels, the more that could backfire on them in the end.

As for the stuff about no proof of collusion, if my time watching true crime shows has taught me anything, it's that there are many cases where somebody looks pretty guilty of committing a particular crime, but the evidence just isn't quite airtight enough to confirm it. For all we know, that could well be what Mueller (or rather, Barr's interpretation of Mueller's comments) means here by "no proof".

I do think there's a clear cut obstruction case to be made, though, and I do hope something can ultimately come of that.

And I'm also interested to see what will come of the other investigations still ongoing, too. Sometimes it can be the smallest, most unexpected thing that can bring down a house of cards, after all.

 

[BEAL]

Two parts of this that doesn’t make any sense to me at all

Why wasn’t don jnr interviewed over the 2016 Trump tower meeting with Russians? He even released the damn emails that stated they were meeting over “dirt on Clinton”. How can you not call that collusion ? I suppose Manafort was there but that dude proved to be a liar on everything and was convicted for it

Second, regarding obstruction, how do you not interview Trump to get his damn answers under oath about his intentions of firing Comey and the other 50 examples we all saw and read over the past two years ?

Did Mueller draw a line regarding Trumps family ? Was he pressured to not go there ?

Just having trouble wrapping my head around it.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

It's a shame there isn't a report of some kind that could explain the who what when where and why.

Somebody should have thought of that.