US Politics XII: shutting down Interference until @U2 agrees to pay for a firewall

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BEAL said:
The issue is how do you convince nearly half of the population to vote for the best interest of society versus tribal votes to “own da libs “ or vice versa?

I want a fair system. I have no desire of having a family of my own, yet I’m willing to see my taxes go towards the greater good. Not just the freaking debt and military.
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As far as who is voting currently, it's not nearly half the country - more like 25% - 30ish%, not nearly half.
We'd of course have to see how that pans out once a lot more people start voting again.

I'm seriously for fairness, and would hope America will eventually head down that road more.

LuckyNumber7 said:
Also not my job. I don’t think the top “bracket” is “favored.” The taxation system is fair, but people with a lot of money do find ways through the system to not pay their taxes. It’s not necessarily Bob the doctor making 300k that’s circumventing a tax system through its own rules, but maybe Jimmy the doctor who owns his own practice and “employs” his wife and blah blah blah has all the strategic possibility in the world to do whatever. I don’t know I’m not a tax genius. But rich people shouldn’t be vilified.

I’m ranting. Lobbyists? I don’t know. That’s what people want to see. Bolder politicians. That’s why the orange guy was elected from his deplorable base. He was more likely to actually try things than a politician.

Maybe the solution is for the states to take over a little more control. It tends to work well when a leader state implements something that’s successful and others follow suit. Typically over time you have a feedback loop from up top in the federal government, and the holdout states eventually jump on board. But this particular scenario being presented is not workable, because the federal government has too much of a grip on health “care” already. Between Medicare and ACA and general income tax, you’d need a state to seize those funds. Which it cannot do. So, I would imagine a new system would require to come from the top.

Well you and I are two in the same there. The beautiful thing about military spending is that you technically don’t have to give up a lot of capability and/or “defense” to free up some cash from it. It’s such a bloated establishment that could run a lot leaner than it does.
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Well, rich people who aren't uber greedy, anyway.
FDR became more empathetic, unfortunately he was racist and i think, anti-semetic.

Look up FDR's Second Economic Bill of Rights - the one he didn't get to fight for; since he died. It's pretty impressive. I heard about it through Tom Hartman's radio show.

So from what i understand after 10 mil$ the tax rate would go up higher under AOC's and other's plans. Sounds good to me! Things started to go haywire when the ratio between the lowest paid worker ,and the CEO in Corporateland which had be around 50 to 1 in the early 60's started increasing rapidly.

Headache in a Suitcase said:
The other issue is this... It needs to be an amendment.

We can't play with people's health like this, where they have coverage, then there's a chance in management and all of a sudden they don't.
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That sounds right- but with too many States in Republican hands (still??) - it would be terrifying right now to try for a Constitutional Convention.
Unless you don't need to do that (can't remember).

anitram said:
In Canada we have universal healthcare, but private insurance exists for supplementary spending. It is typically paid for by the employer with the employee making a contribution, not huge, depending on whether they have a spouse and dependents. This covers:

- prescription drugs (not sure if it's the same across all provinces but here they are free for all kids, seniors below a certain income threshold, people on social assistance, etc but everyone else pays)
- hospital expenses (if you want semi-private or private accommodations as opposed to a ward room to be shared with up to 4 patients)
- massage therapy, physio, occupational therapy, dentistry, orthodontics, prosthetics, vision care like glasses, contacts, etc.

Additionally we also have entirely private medical care facilities in a very limited fashion. The wealthy go to MedCan or something similar for their annual physicals, quick work ups, etc. Typically provided to executives by their employers. Fertility clinics are also outside of the public sphere - some provinces cover very limited fertility treatment for "free" (in reality they cover a small percentage of costs for a certain number of cycles), but generally they are unregulated and can and do charge what their American counterparts would. Meaning tens of thousands of $.
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Ah, thanks for a more detailed description of Canadian's health care options! :up:

namkcuR said:
Bill de Blasio was just on Bill Maher. Piqued my interest somewhat. Talking about guaranteeing health coverage in NYC for anyone not getting coverage from ACA/work/medicare/medicaid. Also about requiring everyone in NYC to get two weeks paid vacation per year. Oh, and potential marijuana legalization/decriminalization "without corporatization".

Might be an interesting left-leaning candidate if he runs.
q
Any thoughts on him?
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He's kind of good on a few things, but don't think he'd make a good president. something about how he deals with people at times. Though being late would be the least of my concerns (after orange donnie)A still, that1 would not play well in international in person meetings etc!

A I think he talks a good game to some extent. But like for instance he
didn' t get on NYCHA's case soon enough! Near the last year or so of Bloomberg's admin the Daily News ran a whole report on how mold was sickening, or worsening kids re: asthma. As someone who watched her mom when i wad 5 1/2 yrs old going from this vibrant, active woman to one suddenly gasping for breath day after day etc (she got better off and on, then much better decades later) ; issues involving breathing and general healthiness, and healthcare became a concern for me. We were lucky, though, we went from, hmm, lower end of upper middle class to lower end of middle, middle class.

MrsSpringsteen said:
It's iconic. We are all Nancy Pelosi at certain times in life too let alone regarding Trump. That would make a great t shirt, I'd buy it.

I didn't watch his bullshit speech, it would have been worth it just to see that moment.
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I think i blinked, or was distracted for some seconds or so. Is she dissing him there? Or is that when just about all the Democratic women in
in white (100th yr of women voting!) stood up when he said how many more women were working.
"Thanks" to him negatively House-wise since many ran to take dome of his power away. Some one said she was trying to the Dems on resectful side. They said she gave the eye to Schiff when he started laughing over something Trump did or didn't get done.

Omg, i loved when she was looking at the prepared speech copy!
 
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trojanchick99 said:
Look, I am further left then the average Dem on most issues. However, I'm also pragmatic. For 2020 my only goal is to defeat Trump. Outside of Tulsi Gabbard who has some weird stances on issues, I would be happy to vote for any of the Dems who have announced.

As to who has the best chance to win, my pragmatic side thinks it will be someone not too far left to scare the large number of Americans who are still scared of the big S word. Is it silly that people are scared of socialism but agree with most of the Democratic Socialist ideas bandied about, Yes. However, it is where we still are as a nation. I think the US is ready to move back to the left, but our first priority needs to be to unite to get Trump out of office.
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THIS! Thanks!

Getting him out of office is my first priority! Too many, many people have suffered badly!
Look at drumpy last night with his big, bad SD word! Too many people still don't know the nuances.
 
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The current cost of elections is a bad thing but in one sense it will be helpful here because it should thin out the Democratic herd of 947 candidates pretty quickly. Looks like Klobuchar, Biden and O'Rourke will likely all announce. For some reason I don't think that Bernie will run but I wouldn't be surprised either way.

You have a huge field of actually competent people for the most part (heya Tulsi), unlike the Republican Clown Car of 2016. But there simply isn't enough room for all of them on the debate stage or in the wallets of donors. To be sure, some of them are actually running to be VPs, and that list should become obvious quickly. Others will likely be eyeing cabinet positions. Realistically aside from self-funders like Bloomberg, there may be room for 3-4 reasonably well funded candidates. That's it. And you need massive funding in order to run an efficient primary campaign which requires staffing in a number of states, event organization and so on. Assuming Biden takes one obvious spot, you're now down to 2-3. BI don't think that any of the others have obvious piles of cash on hand so it will become a ruthless race to fundraise which will help certain candidates over others (Booker, Gillibrand, Harris will all have access to deeper coffers in NY and CA and O'Rourke obviously knows how to fundraise).

In theory there is room for all these people, but in reality they'll start dropping like flies. And at some point somebody will probably play king/queenmaker and capture that VP slot.
 
Virginia: Fairfax is accused by Tyson of sexual assault, says the Washington Post.

Don’t know what the right joke is here, and it’s not funny in general to joke about this situation, but if you’ve ever been to northern Virginia... the fact that the lieutenant governor’s name is Fairfax is already weird enough. He’s being accused of by a Tyson, and I’m just waiting for his female friends Alexandria and Rosslyn to defend him (but yes he hired Kavanaugh’s lawyers)(and she hired Blasey-Ford’s lawyers).
 
dazzledbylight said:
THIS! Thanks!

Getting him out of office is my first priority! Too many, many people have suffered badly!
Look at drumpy last night with his big, bad SD word! Too many people still don't know the nuances.
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This is so true, and why the frustration was so great for people who knew the importance of getting behind the nominee in 2016, while continuing to listen to hoards of people on the left still badmouthing Clinton and calling her the lesser of two evils and continuing the #neverhillary nonsense.

We now have 2 supreme court justices and a boatload of circuit judges that have been placed because Hillary was not a "true progressive". Along with all the other absolute nonsense that is happening.

The fact is that i am all behind most farther left policy ideas, but the reality is that change happens in small amounts no matter who gets into office on the Dem side. Any of them will stand behind far more progressive policies than any republican would. The reality is that a few changes will get through and many won't.
More importantly would protect and hopefully reverse the destruction of the Judicial branch.

put up Biden/Harris, Biden/Klobuchar, Booker/Harris, Harris/Booker, Harris/Klobuchar, Biden/Castro... Whatever. Just get a bulletproof pair together and get this orange shitpile out.
 
Elizabeth Warren- I wouldn't vote for her for President regardless. But with this second proven instance of her attempting to use Native American heritage to gain advantage..the Pocahontas stuff from Trump and others was always disgusting to me but she has lost her credibility. She shouldn't run. They all have skeletons but this to me is the deal breaker for EW. Makes you wonder what else will come out.

Now Trump is saying he's the victim of Presidential harassment. He truly is a case study in manipulative narcissism.

Somehow he didn't think he was harassing Barack Obama about that birth certificate. Racist dog whistle to lay the groundwork for his joke of a Presidency.
 
MrsSpringsteen said:
Elizabeth Warren- I wouldn't vote for her for President regardless. But with this second proven instance of her attempting to use Native American heritage to gain advantage..the Pocahontas stuff from Trump and others was always disgusting to me but she has lost her credibility. She shouldn't run. They all have skeletons but this to me is the deal breaker for EW. Makes you wonder what else will come out.

Now Trump is saying he's the victim of Presidential harassment. He truly is a case study in manipulative narcissism.

Somehow he didn't think he was harassing Barack Obama about that birth certificate. Racist dog whistle to lay the groundwork for his joke of a Presidency.
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I agree. She has been hobbled at this point. As I heard one pundit say. She just doesn't wear well in the long term. And this is coming from a guy that was really hoping that Warren would run last time. But she has fell flat for me, at least in a Presidential sense.
I do agree with her wealth tax. But i think what would be a better tact would be to have a slightly smaller wealth tax, but raise the base amount for Social Security and Medicare tax. Its ridiculous that its at 150K.
Raise that to 10 million but at a smaller percentage as it moves up the scale and put SS and Med into solvency for the next century. THAT is a winner with the public. Tell the bulk of reliable voters that they won't have to worry about SS and Med in any way, and you've got a winner.
 
Just did my taxes. Sooooooo happy for that middle class tax cut. I owe $900 more this year than last.
If I could choke the life out of that fat orange sub-human shit stain, i would.

that is all.
 
MrsSpringsteen said:
Elizabeth Warren- I wouldn't vote for her for President regardless. But with this second proven instance of her attempting to use Native American heritage to gain advantage..the Pocahontas stuff from Trump and others was always disgusting to me but she has lost her credibility. She shouldn't run. They all have skeletons but this to me is the deal breaker for EW. Makes you wonder what else will come out.

.
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She really should just bow out.
Howie Carr is going to have a field day with his next column breaking out all the nicknames (Lieawatha, Fauxcahontas and Chief Spreading Bull, far more clever than Trump).

Her campaign is DOA at this point.
 
Haven’t done mine yet, but pretty much everyone is posting about how pissed off they are at how much higher it is than last year.
 
Elizabeth Warren probably won't bow out immediately but she really should sooner rather than later.

She could still make a very good cabinet member for somebody, but running with this scandal over her head (and getting worse) is just foolish.
 
Am I wrong for thinking this is a dumb scandal to get worked up about? She's one of the most progressive candidates, and we're going to throw her away because she bent the truth(she does have Native American ancestry, however small and however long ago) on a question about her heritage?

All the things the Orange Clown gets away with and we have to throw away the only candidate aggressively running on a wealth tax over this?

Seriously, if I'm missing something and this is worse than I think it is, tell me, I want to be informed.
 
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namkcuR said:
Am I wrong for thinking this is a dumb scandal to get worked up about? She's one of the most progressive candidates, and we're going to throw her away because she bent the truth(she does have Native American ancestry, however small and however long ago) on a question about her heritage?
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umm, yes. she may have *some* native ancestry but this is equivalent to if i listed myself as black on government forms because i had one black great grandmother. that doesn't make me black and it doesn't make her native. yes it may not have mattered on this particular form, but it does raise the question of if she did the same thing on forms or elsewhere, where it would present some sort of benefit to be listed as a minority. and you know for a fact that even if the dems put this past them and nominated her that she'd be eviscerated over and over for it Hy her opponent. they'd beat her into the ground with it so much that she'd never have a chance to even talk about her policies. she was my preferred candidate before this too but that millstone is now too heavy to overcome.

she absolutely deserves a very important place in the government of whomever wins (knock on wood), but she's got about as much chance at being elected now as howard schultz.
 
DaveC said:
umm, yes. she may have *some* native ancestry but this is equivalent to if i listed myself as black on government forms because i had one black great grandmother. that doesn't make me black and it doesn't make her native. yes it may not have mattered on this particular form, but it does raise the question of if she did the same thing on forms or elsewhere, where it would present some sort of benefit to be listed as a minority. and you know for a fact that even if the dems put this past them and nominated her that she'd be eviscerated over and over for it Hy her opponent. they'd beat her into the ground with it so much that she'd never have a chance to even talk about her policies. she was my preferred candidate before this too but that millstone is now too heavy to overcome.

she absolutely deserves a very important place in the government of whomever wins (knock on wood), but she's got about as much chance at being elected now as howard schultz.
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Ok, I guess you're right when you put it like that. And regardless of what one thinks of what she did, you're right that she's just a waste of space in the presidential field if she has no chance on winning, which is how it appears to be.
 
namkcuR said:
Am I wrong for thinking this is a dumb scandal to get worked up about? She's one of the most progressive candidates, and we're going to throw her away because she bent the truth(she does have Native American ancestry, however small and however long ago) on a question about her heritage?

All the things the Orange Clown gets away with and we have to throw away the only candidate aggressively running on a wealth tax over this?

Seriously, if I'm missing something and this is worse than I think it is, tell me, I want to be informed.
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Oh I understand, it is especially galling given what he gets away with. But as we see time and time and time again, there are distinct and different standards for the orange Teflon Don and well everyone else. I am in favor of her proposed wealth tax, but the very sad reality is that it will get lost among all the Native American stuff. Which works out perfectly for those same wealthy people. Funny not funny how that works out.

I really wish she hadn't done those things, she's smart and has some good ideas. I've voted for her twice and it's very disappointing. For me it's about credibility. I don't know what was going on in her head that she seemingly thought she needed those advantages. Maybe because of her humble background? She's the only one who knows.
 
anitram said:
The National Enquirer trying to blackmail Jeff Bezos, potentially the only person in the world who at this point really could not care less. :lol:
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PlayfulLividBergerpicard-small.gif
 
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