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Old 08-30-2017, 08:00 PM   #181
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US Politics III

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Originally Posted by AEON View Post
Are you playing the "what about" game that Irvine despises so much? Why can't you just accept that antifa is a violent hate group on the grounds that it is both violent and hateful.


It's funny how you suggest that the left is exaggerating the extent and influence of white nationalism and then comment on antifa as if they're the real problem.
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Old 08-30-2017, 08:04 PM   #182
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It's funny how you suggest that the left is exaggerating the extent and influence of white nationalism and then comment on antifa as if they're the real problem.
I truly don't believe antifa is the real problem, only that they are a real problem.
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Old 08-30-2017, 08:15 PM   #183
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I think white supremacists' lives matter, in the theological and humanistic sense. But that doesn't mean that they might not need to be opposed forcefully, should the situation warrant. I certainly hope not, but peace-loving people who respect the laws of liberty do have the right to protect themselves and their way of life.
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Old 08-30-2017, 08:31 PM   #184
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I truly don't believe antifa is the real problem, only that they are a real problem.
They are only a problem for those who are/wish to protect fascists.
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Old 08-30-2017, 08:57 PM   #185
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Can we talk for a minute about how Trump is willing to/happy to shut down the government because the Democrats (who have no power whatsoever) want to block funding for the wall which Mexico was supposed to pay for? So he is willing to shut down the government until the American citizens pony up for this wall that most of them don't want and which they expected not to pay for?

Heckuva job, Republicans.
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Old 08-30-2017, 09:38 PM   #186
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Can we talk for a minute about how Trump is willing to/happy to shut down the government because the Democrats (who have no power whatsoever) want to block funding for the wall which Mexico was supposed to pay for? So he is willing to shut down the government until the American citizens pony up for this wall that most of them don't want and which they expected not to pay for?

Heckuva job, Republicans.
There are already is a wall. President Clinton expanded it during his term and Senator Hillary Clinton also voted for expanding it during her time in office.

This is about continuing the work the Clintons started.
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Old 08-30-2017, 09:42 PM   #187
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Are you suggesting their lives do not matter? Because the racist tag has been applied very "liberally" in here over the last decade. Even in this thread, it's been suggested that white people are racist simply for being white.
No one ever has suggested you're racist simply for being white.

This is a Breitbart move.

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Originally Posted by AEON View Post
Are you playing the "what about" game that Irvine despises so much? Why can't you just accept that antifa is a violent hate group on the grounds that it is both violent and hateful.


Are you serious?
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Old 08-30-2017, 09:42 PM   #188
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There are already is a wall. President Clinton expanded it during his term and Senator Hillary Clinton also voted for expanding it during her time in office.

This is about continuing the work the Clintons started.
Let's pretend that we all accept this as fact for a second.

Did Trump, or did he not, run EXPLICITLY ON THE PREMISE that Mexico will pay for the wall?
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Old 08-30-2017, 09:46 PM   #189
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Originally Posted by AEON View Post
Are you playing the "what about" game that Irvine despises so much? Why can't you just accept that antifa is a violent hate group on the grounds that it is both violent and hateful.


If hating nazis and fascists is wrong I don't want to be right. I'm not a fan of some of the violent tactics that some antifa members use, but I like that they oppose nazis and white supremacists.
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Old 08-30-2017, 11:23 PM   #190
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Originally Posted by anitram View Post
Let's pretend that we all accept this as fact for a second.

Did Trump, or did he not, run EXPLICITLY ON THE PREMISE that Mexico will pay for the wall?
I honestly don't think anyone took him serious on who would pay for it. They just want it completed. Just like the Clintons. I don't see why you have a problem with this.
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Old 08-30-2017, 11:26 PM   #191
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If hating nazis and fascists is wrong I don't want to be right.
Hate is such a strong word. It is so strong in fact, that the Left has connected a whole series of crimes specifically named after it.
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Old 08-30-2017, 11:29 PM   #192
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No one ever has suggested you're racist simply for being white.
Yes, indeed it has been suggested. The very concept of this unseen force of white privilege relies on this to be true. That white people, at a minimum, are passively racist.
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Old 08-30-2017, 11:36 PM   #193
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Yes, indeed it has been suggested. The very concept of this unseen force of white privilege relies on this to be true. That white people, at a minimum, are passively racist.



You clearly don't understand what white privilege means.

Which is pretty white privileged of you.
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Old 08-30-2017, 11:39 PM   #194
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I'm not a fan of some of the violent tactics that some antifa members use...
Curious, you say that you are not a fan of "some" of the violent tactics that "some" antifa members use - which violent tactics do you support? The burning of property? The urine bombs? The rock throwing? The bike lock to the head tactic? Which violent tactics are "okay" and which ones are "not okay?"
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Old 08-30-2017, 11:49 PM   #195
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You clearly don't understand what white privilege means.

Which is pretty white privileged of you.
Fallacies: argumentum ad populum and the Inverse of No True Scottsman
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Old 08-30-2017, 11:51 PM   #196
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Curious, you say that you are not a fan of "some" of the violent tactics that "some" antifa members use - which violent tactics do you support? The burning of property? The urine bombs? The rock throwing? The bike lock to the head tactic? Which violent tactics are "okay" and which ones are "not okay?"



Maybe the protecting of clergy (including Cornell West) who were saved by charging, armed Nazis because the Charlottesville PD weren't doing their jobs.

Also, they haven't killed anyone. Can't say the same about the very fine people you seem to think exist on that side.
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Old 08-31-2017, 12:01 AM   #197
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Yes, indeed it has been suggested. The very concept of this unseen force of white privilege relies on this to be true. That white people, at a minimum, are passively racist.
This is a wildly inaccurate understanding of white privilege.
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Old 08-31-2017, 12:07 AM   #198
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I really love Rebecca Solnit. She just posted this on FB:

"Why let the right and status quo make antifa something we all have to debate/condemn /justify?

People keep speaking as though they are some huge liability we must wipe away, but they only are if we take the bait. Why not just blithely say, oh yeah, who isn't anti-fascist besides fascists, and those people in the confrontations, some doing good stuff, some maybe other stuff, not really the big issue of our time, and also did you notice a woman killed with a car and a man beaten half to death for being black and thousands upon thousand of other black people killed for being black over the last little while and also, could we talk about gender violence for, i don't know, 500 years, because that would start to cover how awful it is except that we also need to talk about climate change as violence and a stolen election?

If you let them set the priorities, you've already lost.

Whose approval are you seeking? Whose do you need? It's also a way they're saying the left has to be 100% nonviolent to earn a cookie from people not doing much to denounce the KKK, Nazis, the NRA gun cult, misogynistic violence, homophobic violence, transphobic violence, environmental violence, economic violence, etc. When all that violence gets condemned, the right has a leg to stand on, but it won't be the right any more."
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Old 08-31-2017, 12:24 AM   #199
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who isn't anti-fascist besides fascists,
"Either you are with us...or you are with the terrorists."

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Old 08-31-2017, 02:11 AM   #200
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This is a wildly inaccurate understanding of white privilege.
Does Japanese privilege exist in Japan? If so, where is the outrage? If not, why not?
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