US Politics II - Page 25 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 08-07-2017, 12:37 AM   #481
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
BEAL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: San Diego
Posts: 6,551
Local Time: 01:05 AM
Well it took people nearly 20 years to figure out BEAL wasn't my real name but acronym for the band members haha

And crazy to think I've spent around 18/19 years posting on this site. Discovered it right out of high school when the internet was becoming a bigger thing (in Iowa haha)
__________________

BEAL is offline  
Old 08-07-2017, 07:53 AM   #482
Blue Crack Addict
 
LuckyNumber7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 18,564
Local Time: 09:05 PM
In fairness I didn't think it was your real name. I just didn't know what it stood for.
__________________

LuckyNumber7 is online now  
Old 08-07-2017, 08:31 AM   #483
45:33
 
cobl04's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: East Point to Shaolin
Posts: 58,333
Local Time: 12:05 PM
Anyway you pricks reckon you've got it bad. Today, a refugee locked up in detention by the Australian government killed himself. It's the seventh refugee to kill himself under our laws in the last five years.

And to top it off, the governing Liberal party held an all-party meeting to decide their policy on marriage equality today: do we a) allow a free conscience vote when all MPs, no matter of party lines, can vote what they believe in and gay people can married tomorrow or do we b) pretend to be the government of the people by opening up marriage equality to a plebiscite, thus allowing all Australians to have a say on whether gay people are humans or dogshit.
cobl04 is offline  
Old 08-07-2017, 01:39 PM   #484
The Fly
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 296
Local Time: 06:05 PM
Trumps problem is he doesn't stand for anything. He was an emotionally abused child by a tyrant barron father, was given the keys to the kingdom through his unimpressive educational performance, then literally given the keys to the Trump forture, ran that into the ground numerous times, and is really only a standout in his field for his insane branding of everything Trump. His son-in-law, Jared Kushner, is 10X the business builder, and love or hate him, he took his dad's rag and assets at a time his dad was jailed and destroyed publically, and set off on an impressive, if not also villain, plan to restore his family name and destroy all that hurt his family, including the other family members who turned on Jared's dad. And, most famously, the prosecutor turned gov of NJ turned deposed transition leader Chris Christie, who prosecuted his dad and had some rather choice words for the media about the Kushner family name. So, back to Trump...his children were mostly raised by their moms, and if they were in NY, they lived a life of a twisted Diff'rent Strokes in 68th floor penthouses with more rooms than they had cells on their body. Trump destroyed the family fortune but rebuilt because anyone with that level of power can always rebuild. His most brilliant move was to convince the world the Trump brand was golden...he sold the NYC development world the same bill of goods he sold us. He has never stood for anything but himself. His dad was awful to him, and he is awful to most of his kids. But they are driven by a loyalty to the Trump name...branding at the family level...and are stepping out of their comfort zones and beliefs to win. That is what Kushner and the baby Trumps have in common...overbearing fathers who robbed them of a real childhood who they feel the need to protect, no matter what. They view their advocacy as a game to win, not by the content they are having to uphold. Ivanka has been clear on LBGTQ+ rights, but her dad is destroying that. There were family beliefs on climate change that have been discarded in favor of winning.

Except...they aren't winning. They are losing. So they double down. This is a game to win to each of them. There isn't a single deeply held principal in play here. There is no advocacy here. This is about beating the people who they have engaged as the enemy.


Which is why he is most dangerous. The person who believes in nothing is the hardest to contain.
Wide Awake n AZ is offline  
Old 08-07-2017, 06:25 PM   #485
Blue Crack Addict
 
LuckyNumber7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 18,564
Local Time: 09:05 PM
I wish the notion that Trump "ran the fortune into the ground" would go away.

He can be mocked for his inability of his wealth to keep up with simpler investments, this is true. But to suggest he somehow fucked it all up royally is a disservice to the attempt to discredit Donald Trump. He's successful as a businessman. He's also a scumbag. Accept reality. It doesn't help the folks against him if an alternative reality is painted.
LuckyNumber7 is online now  
Old 08-07-2017, 07:03 PM   #486
The Fly
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 296
Local Time: 06:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyNumber7 View Post
I wish the notion that Trump "ran the fortune into the ground" would go away.

He can be mocked for his inability of his wealth to keep up with simpler investments, this is true. But to suggest he somehow fucked it all up royally is a disservice to the attempt to discredit Donald Trump. He's successful as a businessman. He's also a scumbag. Accept reality. It doesn't help the folks against him if an alternative reality is painted.
His inherited position as estimated, if invested in the safest of mutual funds, would have far outflanked his current value.

He has run his companies at a net minus against the most basic and safety funds in the market. He has declared bankruptcy for business lines, and he has burned vendors. He overreached in some of the safest real estate markets in the world. His Atlantic City folly was committed in the face of warnings and clear signs of danger.

I accept financial reality. The financial reality is he has had far more "bad runs" than any normal businessman gets, and it is because, to use a card analogy, he had stacks. There is very little he has done that wasn't paint-by-numbers obvious to someone with his capital that hasn't failed...in the real estate world. And mostly in his small endeavors, though the TV thing was very successful. But that isn't what the brand is about, and his actual performance from inherited position to current position financially is pedestrian, to be kind, compared to the potential. He has not shown to be a great businessman. Or even a good one. When dealing from that position of power, in the NYC market, it is unfathomable how he made his mistakes other than associating them with pure ego.

Yeah...he is wealthy. He was given a real estate company in NYC...well, he was allowed to "borrow" against inheritance to make his first deal, which was the equivalent of a ball placed on a tee. So, in the late 70's, he gets to buy up Manhattan against inheritance. About 6 people in that business had the position to do that. It was where his dad did his deals, and where he grew up. He did not come to NYC with the foresight of a genius. He just played Monopoly in a city that was set to explode in value.

Translate that however you like.
Wide Awake n AZ is offline  
Old 08-07-2017, 07:45 PM   #487
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 41,232
Local Time: 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyNumber7 View Post
I wish the notion that Trump "ran the fortune into the ground" would go away.

He can be mocked for his inability of his wealth to keep up with simpler investments, this is true. But to suggest he somehow fucked it all up royally is a disservice to the attempt to discredit Donald Trump. He's successful as a businessman. He's also a scumbag. Accept reality. It doesn't help the folks against him if an alternative reality is painted.


What exactly would define "ran into the ground" for you? Trump by his own admission(we really don't know), but several billion in debt at one time.

What would be your definition?
BVS is offline  
Old 08-07-2017, 07:58 PM   #488
Refugee
 
Bluer White's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Maine
Posts: 2,214
Local Time: 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wide Awake n AZ View Post
His inherited position as estimated, if invested in the safest of mutual funds, would have far outflanked his current value.
Possible. What was President Trump's inherited position?
Bluer White is offline  
Old 08-07-2017, 09:31 PM   #489
Blue Crack Distributor
 
Headache in a Suitcase's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: DC
Posts: 68,427
Local Time: 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by corianderstem View Post
LOL "understand" as in his username is his (likely) last name backwards.
Mind:blown
Headache in a Suitcase is offline  
Old 08-07-2017, 09:46 PM   #490
Blue Crack Distributor
 
Headache in a Suitcase's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: DC
Posts: 68,427
Local Time: 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyNumber7 View Post
I wish the notion that Trump "ran the fortune into the ground" would go away.

He can be mocked for his inability of his wealth to keep up with simpler investments, this is true. But to suggest he somehow fucked it all up royally is a disservice to the attempt to discredit Donald Trump. He's successful as a businessman. He's also a scumbag. Accept reality. It doesn't help the folks against him if an alternative reality is painted.
He's successful as a con man. As the con is his business, then yes, he's a successful businessman.

His image is a lie, and his rebuilt wealth is built off that lie. He's developed one major piece of real estate in the past 20 years, which oh so happened to be financed by a bank that was recently fined half a billion dollars for laundering Russian money.

Thr majority of Trump buildings aren't owned or developed by Trump. They're merely licensing deals.
Headache in a Suitcase is offline  
Old 08-08-2017, 03:47 AM   #491
Blue Crack Addict
 
LuckyNumber7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 18,564
Local Time: 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Headache in a Suitcase View Post
He's successful as a con man. As the con is his business, then yes, he's a successful businessman.

His image is a lie, and his rebuilt wealth is built off that lie. He's developed one major piece of real estate in the past 20 years, which oh so happened to be financed by a bank that was recently fined half a billion dollars for laundering Russian money.

Thr majority of Trump buildings aren't owned or developed by Trump. They're merely licensing deals.


All of these things are valid points.

Painting the picture of him as a colossal failure otherwise implies he isn't still a rich billionaire who lives a luxurious life and conned his way up to the highest public office in the world.

There's reality, and there's actuality.
LuckyNumber7 is online now  
Old 08-08-2017, 03:52 AM   #492
Blue Crack Addict
 
LuckyNumber7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 18,564
Local Time: 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BVS View Post
What exactly would define "ran into the ground" for you? Trump by his own admission(we really don't know), but several billion in debt at one time.

What would be your definition?


I never described him as a self made man. If he truly drove something into the ground and was unable to otherwise be successful, he wouldn't have so much. It's clear that he's a con and he's not actually that good at what he does, of course. But when you fail to adequately criticize him for that specifically, you come off as silly when talking about how much of a failure he is as he bathes in his gold faucet bathtub aboard his private commercial aircraft.
LuckyNumber7 is online now  
Old 08-08-2017, 05:45 AM   #493
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 41,232
Local Time: 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyNumber7 View Post
I never described him as a self made man. If he truly drove something into the ground and was unable to otherwise be successful, he wouldn't have so much. It's clear that he's a con and he's not actually that good at what he does, of course. But when you fail to adequately criticize him for that specifically, you come off as silly when talking about how much of a failure he is as he bathes in his gold faucet bathtub aboard his private commercial aircraft.


You and I would have been labeled failures, because using credit to pay off credit and not being cash positive would be deemed failure by most definitions. Starting from privilege allowed him to keep the gold faucets, normalizing and trying to label that as successful is part of the myth that got us here.
BVS is offline  
Old 08-08-2017, 06:03 AM   #494
Blue Crack Distributor
 
Headache in a Suitcase's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: DC
Posts: 68,427
Local Time: 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyNumber7 View Post
I never described him as a self made man. If he truly drove something into the ground and was unable to otherwise be successful, he wouldn't have so much. It's clear that he's a con and he's not actually that good at what he does, of course. But when you fail to adequately criticize him for that specifically, you come off as silly when talking about how much of a failure he is as he bathes in his gold faucet bathtub aboard his private commercial aircraft.
He helped drive an entire city into the ground by destroying it's main industry through overspending, and though "deals" that were only beneficial to him.

His casinos lost billions of dollars. Billions. Yet through multiple bankruptcies he managed to skate by with just enough. Again, cause he's a con. He's good at being a con. He's good at selling a false image of success. That's his #1 product, and yea; business is a booming.

Just look at Trump SoHo. The crown jewel. Not a dime of Trump money spent on it. Not. A. Dime. But the two companies that did fund the building? Well lookie there - Russian. One of whom happens to have been found guilty of fraud and racketeering.

The only banks that would touch him after his utter failures in the casino world were foreign banks with shady dealings. These are not conspiracies, either. They're easily verified facts.

Guy's always been a fraud, and he just sold his greatest con ever.
Headache in a Suitcase is offline  
Old 08-08-2017, 06:49 AM   #495
Blue Crack Addict
 
LuckyNumber7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 18,564
Local Time: 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BVS View Post
You and I would have been labeled failures, because using credit to pay off credit and not being cash positive would be deemed failure by most definitions. Starting from privilege allowed him to keep the gold faucets, normalizing and trying to label that as successful is part of the myth that got us here.


Starting from privilege did not allow him to keep anything. I don't know how you came to that conclusion. He's a conman. That's how he got to keep his gold faucets. He's built up a false image. A name. An understanding of his success, even if it's not actually true. But thereby he's managed to, in reality, be successful.

Many things got us here. I love how you're accusing me of "normalizing" his success. Contrary. You normalized his media incited hysteria from day one, and fell right into his conman trap. Anyone who gave that man the light of day by being offended or shocked or whatever was just as conned as the folks who bought into his vision. Turn off the tv and go outside (unfortunately it's too late for that now, though).
LuckyNumber7 is online now  
Old 08-08-2017, 07:04 AM   #496
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 41,232
Local Time: 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyNumber7 View Post
Starting from privilege did not allow him to keep anything. I don't know how you came to that conclusion. He's a conman. That's how he got to keep his gold faucets. He's built up a false image. A name. An understanding of his success, even if it's not actually true. But thereby he's managed to, in reality, be successful.

Many things got us here. I love how you're accusing me of "normalizing" his success. Contrary. You normalized his media incited hysteria from day one, and fell right into his conman trap. Anyone who gave that man the light of day by being offended or shocked or whatever was just as conned as the folks who bought into his vision. Turn off the tv and go outside (unfortunately it's too late for that now, though).


Media incited hysteria?! Wow. Pointing out he's a conman from day one is not falling for anything, calling it 'success' is normalizing. How do you not see the difference? You've tried far too hard to blame others for paying attention to him, but he was already put on an alter from day one by his minions, you don't expose a conman by calling him successful.
BVS is offline  
Old 08-08-2017, 07:58 AM   #497
Blue Crack Distributor
 
Headache in a Suitcase's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: DC
Posts: 68,427
Local Time: 08:05 PM
I give him this - he's an incredibly successful con-man. Just the best cons. The biggest concern (literally).

I would consider him to be wealthy.

Good businesses don't have to rely on shady foreign banks and put down significantly larger amounts of cash than any other developer would be expected to put down due to a large history of defaulting on loans, like what he had to do for the Old Post Office.

Ultimately I think this is a dumb argument. Both parties agree he's a con man. It's symantics whether you believe being someone who's grown wealthy through cons and shady dealings should be considered a success. By the pure definition of the word, yea - he's been successful in his line of work, in the same way Al Capone was a success in his line of work.
Headache in a Suitcase is offline  
Old 08-08-2017, 08:49 AM   #498
Blue Crack Addict
 
anitram's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 18,918
Local Time: 09:05 PM
I think that it's obvious that he is wealthy.

I don't believe that he is anywhere nearly as wealthy as he projects and makes it seem.

I would also hope that somebody of his wealth could get tailored suits that fit and a proper haircut but I guess that's neither here nor there.

Your typical nouveau riche - tacky, ugly and insecure.
anitram is offline  
Old 08-08-2017, 09:32 AM   #499
Blue Crack Addict
 
LuckyNumber7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 18,564
Local Time: 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Headache in a Suitcase View Post
I give him this - he's an incredibly successful con-man. Just the best cons. The biggest concern (literally).

I would consider him to be wealthy.

Good businesses don't have to rely on shady foreign banks and put down significantly larger amounts of cash than any other developer would be expected to put down due to a large history of defaulting on loans, like what he had to do for the Old Post Office.

Ultimately I think this is a dumb argument. Both parties agree he's a con man. It's symantics whether you believe being someone who's grown wealthy through cons and shady dealings should be considered a success. By the pure definition of the word, yea - he's been successful in his line of work, in the same way Al Capone was a success in his line of work.


I'm not arguing with you... because I agree with you. I think there are two separate conversations going on at once.
LuckyNumber7 is online now  
Old 08-08-2017, 09:37 AM   #500
Blue Crack Addict
 
LuckyNumber7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 18,564
Local Time: 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BVS View Post
Media incited hysteria?! Wow. Pointing out he's a conman from day one is not falling for anything, calling it 'success' is normalizing. How do you not see the difference? You've tried far too hard to blame others for paying attention to him, but he was already put on an alter from day one by his minions, you don't expose a conman by calling him successful.


Wow! Yes, incited hysteria. Listen to the next outrageous thing Donald has said on his campaign trail. Take him seriously when he's illegitimate and you legitimize him. He fueled all press being good press because you couldn't look away from his train wreck.

Pfft. Whatever man. Im "normalizing" his success. Open your eyes. He didn't need me to get what he has. He needed your voice to bring him to the table for serious discussion.
__________________

LuckyNumber7 is online now  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com
×