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Old 09-03-2003, 11:39 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram


Poland is there for every reason except altruism. And they're recently joined by what, 8 Bulgarians? Also there for the same reason.

All that's missing are 5 Slovaks, 3 Romanians and a Bosnian.
Who and why:

http://www.time.com/time/europe/maga...480246,00.html
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Old 09-04-2003, 05:55 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by TylerDurden


Kid tells his parents he's gonna make a chocolate cake. Parents say it's a bad idea, and you are gonna make a huge mess of the kitchen if you try and do it the way you want, and by yourself. We can help you make a chocolate cake, but it's a different way to the way you want to, it will take longer, and we get some of the cake at the end. Kid says Fuck off, I'm doing it my way, and I get all the cake, and just you watch you silly Old Parents, I won't mess up the kitchen. The kid totally fucks up the cake and the kitchens a complete disaster. He comes back to the parents and says, right well now you have to help me clean up. But you clean up my way, and you still get no cake.

The parents could (a) offer to clean up, on the condition that they get some cake. (b) Do the kid a favour and help the kid clean up, under his rules, accept that they are not getting any cake, and hope that the kid lies in bed that night and learns something from the event. Or (c) the kid asked for it and should learn a lesson the hard way by cleaning up his own mess.

If there weren't human lives involved I'd hope it would be (c), but 'cos there are I hope it's (b) and that the Bush Administration has a 'moment of clarity' over it all (yeah, right).

And thats the answer to "where are the other countries?" Aside from humanitarian reasons, and doing the US a favour, no other countries apart from the US, Britain and Australia should feel obligated to have to clean it up.
well said
I hope it will be C
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Old 09-04-2003, 09:31 AM   #23
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Originally posted by TylerDurden


Follow the leader.
Or not, if it means more $$$.
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Old 09-04-2003, 10:14 AM   #24
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The thing that makes it tough for me is that there are human lives involved. The other thing is that this unilateral deal has gone so far it's possibly too late to do anything about the anti-U.S. sentiment. Considering that some of these people had no qualms about blowing up the U.N. offices I wonder if it'd even make a difference now?
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Old 09-04-2003, 11:56 AM   #25
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DRESDEN, Germany (Reuters ) - France and Germany on Thursday rejected a U.S. proposal for a U.N. resolution seeking international help in Iraq, saying the proposals did not yield enough responsibility to Iraqis or to the United Nations.
Can't say I'm surprised.
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Old 09-04-2003, 12:15 PM   #26
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Can't say I'm surprised.
Me either. I guess GWB is going to have to clean up his own mess. I wouldn't have a problem with this if lives weren't endangered by it. Yuck.
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Old 09-04-2003, 12:23 PM   #27
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But lives will be at stake and our deficit will grow higher and higher. Oh the mess we're in...
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Old 09-04-2003, 12:29 PM   #28
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
But lives will be at stake and our deficit will grow higher and higher. Oh the mess we're in...
I know. Damn. The hell of the situation is that it's *our* mess, not just GWB's.
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Old 09-04-2003, 02:11 PM   #29
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Originally posted by verte76


I know. Damn. The hell of the situation is that it's *our* mess, not just GWB's.

Unfortunately you are correct! My children will be paying for his mistakes, whether it is in underfunded education now or the rape of Social Security.
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Old 09-04-2003, 02:26 PM   #30
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Is the sky really falling?
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Old 09-04-2003, 02:41 PM   #31
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The bombs and attacks look pretty organized and coordinated to me. Before the two big bombs went off I thought they were just Saddam sympathizers doing attacks but at this point it looks pretty organized and not just in Iraq but in Afgnistan now too. It looks like the terrorists had some sort of meeting and are trying to attack America on two fronts to make them scare out of both Afghanistan and Iraq. The main reason looks like if America fails then no coalition will help America if it wages war against another M.E. country i.e. Syria. This is a pretty important time in world history unfolding in front of our eyes. The amount of terrorists filtering into Iraq at this point is pretty insane. Every body who has a grudge against America is gonna haul ass into Iraq and target troops.

What I don't like about Bush is did he not think about this before the war I mean lots of us 'regular' citizens said this exact thing was gonna happen and that the Sunnis and Shiites awere gonna beat the crap out of each other which is gonna happen at any moment now. I think that's unforgivable that the president can't think about all the possible outcomes and solutions BEFORE starting a war.
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Old 09-04-2003, 02:55 PM   #32
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Originally posted by nbcrusader
Is the sky really falling?
Haven't you heard about the astroid

Truly I haven't seen the US in this big of a mess since Vietnam - but the economy wasn't in the tubes at the same time.
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Old 09-04-2003, 03:02 PM   #33
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I'm pretty sure that for those Americans who lost their sons and daughters in Iraq and for those Iraqis whose family members and friends have been blown to smitherines and for the families of the UN members that have died, the sky has already fallen.
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Old 09-04-2003, 05:09 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by TylerDurden


Kid tells his parents he's gonna make a chocolate cake. Parents say it's a bad idea, and you are gonna make a huge mess of the kitchen if you try and do it the way you want, and by yourself. We can help you make a chocolate cake, but it's a different way to the way you want to, it will take longer, and we get some of the cake at the end. Kid says Fuck off, I'm doing it my way, and I get all the cake, and just you watch you silly Old Parents, I won't mess up the kitchen. The kid totally fucks up the cake and the kitchens a complete disaster. He comes back to the parents and says, right well now you have to help me clean up. But you clean up my way, and you still get no cake.
I do like the Kid/cake analogy

I suggest another analogy (stretched a bit though):

You come across a guy and tell him:
- U, bastard, I know you bought a gun some ten years ago. I know that you used the gun against another guy ten years ago. Give me the gun now or you will face serious consequences.
- But it was ten years ago. I was already punished for that. Still I cannot buy food freely in the grocery.
- Shut up! I know u got the gun and I know you want to use it against me. Give me the gun now or I will kill you.
- But I don't have the gun.
- Prove it! Give me papers confirming that you got no gun! Give me evidence that you have not bought a single gun in ten years.
- Ok, calm down. Let the others search me.
- They do not know how to search!!

U kill the guy, u search him and fail to find the gun...
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Old 09-04-2003, 05:17 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by ALEXRUS


I do like the Kid/cake analogy

I suggest another analogy (stretched a bit though):

You come across a guy and tell him:
- U, bastard, I know you bought a gun some ten years ago. I know that you used the gun against another guy ten years ago. Give me the gun now or you will face serious consequences.
- But it was ten years ago. I was already punished for that. Still I cannot buy food freely in the grocery.
- Shut up! I know u got the gun and I know you want to use it against me. Give me the gun now or I will kill you.
- But I don't have the gun.
- Prove it! Give me papers confirming that you got no gun! Give me evidence that you have not bought a single gun in ten years.
- Ok, calm down. Let the others search me.
- They do not know how to search!!

U kill the guy, u search him and fail to find the gun...
Sad part is, almost everyone in the world believed there was a gun. So where was it. Frqnce and Russia did not object because they believed there was no GUN. The real question now is did the gun get passed on to someone else.

But they did have a GUNS and AMMO. Obviously there are plenty of Soviet munitions that work really well. Plenty of guns to kill people coming out of mosques ect.
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Old 09-04-2003, 05:28 PM   #36
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Originally posted by Dreadsox

Obviously there are plenty of Soviet munitions that work really well. Plenty of guns to kill people coming out of mosques ect.
Ok, ok...it's Russia's (Canada's, Antarctic's) fault
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Old 09-04-2003, 05:31 PM   #37
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The SAD thing is that you missed other bad guys who DID ATTACK YOU!, who DO have guns and who (I guess) are preparing their guns to use them once again...
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Old 09-04-2003, 05:46 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by EvolutionMonkey
The bombs and attacks look pretty organized and coordinated to me. Before the two big bombs went off I thought they were just Saddam sympathizers doing attacks but at this point it looks pretty organized and not just in Iraq but in Afgnistan now too. It looks like the terrorists had some sort of meeting and are trying to attack America on two fronts to make them scare out of both Afghanistan and Iraq. The main reason looks like if America fails then no coalition will help America if it wages war against another M.E. country i.e. Syria. This is a pretty important time in world history unfolding in front of our eyes. The amount of terrorists filtering into Iraq at this point is pretty insane. Every body who has a grudge against America is gonna haul ass into Iraq and target troops.

What I don't like about Bush is did he not think about this before the war I mean lots of us 'regular' citizens said this exact thing was gonna happen and that the Sunnis and Shiites awere gonna beat the crap out of each other which is gonna happen at any moment now. I think that's unforgivable that the president can't think about all the possible outcomes and solutions BEFORE starting a war.
I agree. I felt like there was the strong possibility of this turning into the Quagmire From Hell if the planning wasn't really careful. I felt that there was a strong possibility that the planning wouldn't be careful. If we can't get out of this, and it's a huge mess, and is a financial drain and such...............damn. It upsets me. No one benefits from this sort of situation, particularly not the Iraqi people.
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Old 09-04-2003, 07:05 PM   #39
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Originally posted by ALEXRUS
The SAD thing is that you missed other bad guys who DID ATTACK YOU!, who DO have guns and who (I guess) are preparing their guns to use them once again...
On this we agree
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Old 09-05-2003, 07:28 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox


Sad part is, almost everyone in the world believed there was a gun. So where was it. Frqnce and Russia did not object because they believed there was no GUN. The real question now is did the gun get passed on to someone else.

But they did have a GUNS and AMMO. Obviously there are plenty of Soviet munitions that work really well. Plenty of guns to kill people coming out of mosques ect.

Dread,

When he writes "guns" I think he means WMDs.

Kelly who is dead, Ritter who they tried to discredit were inspectors who said there really were no "guns" (WMDs) of consequence. I am not buying the nonsense that they transferred them to Iran or Syria. This is bullshit.
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