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Old 10-07-2008, 11:16 AM   #961
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there are black conservatives.

<>
there's still plenty of time for them to come to their senses.

<utoo>
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Old 10-07-2008, 11:32 AM   #962
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there are black conservatives.

<>
There are white liberals. I'm one of them.

This is fun. There are Asian Libertarians.
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Old 10-07-2008, 12:53 PM   #963
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apologies if it's already covered, but talk about "palling up" with terrorists, it would appear McCain has the support of one much more dangerous domestic terrorist.

I mean, selling arms to Iran ? Funding foreign terrorist groups to overthrow democratically elected governments ?

If that's not a terrorist, don't know what is

McCain Camp Touts Ollie North Endorsement | The Trail | washingtonpost.com
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:02 PM   #964
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BTW, there are also white, italian-american catholics who are liberals who support Obama.

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Old 10-07-2008, 01:07 PM   #965
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Tonight's debate is going to be uncomfortable. McCain is going to get angry, possibly lose his temper, and certainly call Obama every name in the book. He's going to primarily use the fear doctrine the Bush Admin. was so sucessful at, saying Obama is unfit, pals with terrorists, insinuate every stereotype that racist whites will buy.

Obama will try to stay above the fray, but he will have to address the comments in a forceful, direct way, then move on to the real issues.

I predict McCain stepping all over himself.
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:20 PM   #966
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BTW, there are also white, italian-american catholics who are liberals who support Obama.


yes there are 3.5 in my state

<>
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:22 PM   #967
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There are white liberals. I'm one of them.

This is fun. There are Asian Libertarians.
being white and liberal is no feat.

<>
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:24 PM   #968
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Tonight's debate is going to be uncomfortable. McCain is going to get angry, possibly lose his temper, and certainly call Obama every name in the book. He's going to primarily use the fear doctrine the Bush Admin. was so sucessful at, saying Obama is unfit, pals with terrorists, insinuate every stereotype that racist whites will buy.

Obama will try to stay above the fray, but he will have to address the comments in a forceful, direct way, then move on to the real issues.

I predict McCain stepping all over himself.

I'd love to see that happen. And while I don't think it's a probability, it's certainly a possibility.

Again, I think the key for Obama is to lay down a few well-written sentences as a "final punch" to the smears, and then move on to the issues. The contrast between a festering old man who is stuck on smears and the guy who's talking about the economy will be stark.
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Old 10-07-2008, 01:24 PM   #969
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yes there are 3.5 in my state

<>

You mean the state of denial?
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Old 10-07-2008, 02:11 PM   #970
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BTW, there are also white, italian-american catholics who are liberals who support Obama.

And while I don't get a vote, I'm a white, Italian-Canadian Catholic, who's a liberal and supports Obama.
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Old 10-07-2008, 03:31 PM   #971
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Reports out of early voting states say that African American turnout is MASSIVE. I think it actually may be exceeding the Obama campaign's already high expectations. Just awesome news.


Obama is now consensus up in FL. pulling away in OH. and PA seems to be totally out of reach for McCain.

we're already hearing it, but a right wing narrative is already being put forth that McCain lost because of the banking crisis. that's foolishly simplistic. McCain started to lose steam first with the "lipstick on a pig" and the "sex ed for 5 year olds" nonsense that happened well before the banking crisis. and it's less about the crisis itself, and more about the fact that McCain gave us the "fundamentals/strong" garbage. not to mention Palin's abysmal interviews. so it has nothing to do with McCain's unfortunate membership in the Republican party at an inopportune time in history.

resist that narrative. it's garbage. the difference is that since the banking crisis McCain has appeared unstable, melodramatic, self-pitying, hysterical, and erratic. Obama has been utterly and totally presidential. he is careful. he is calm. he is an adult.

and that's why he's winning. McCain -- the esteemed John McCain, once the most popular politician in America -- looks as if he is going to lose to, and i quote Chris Rock, "a black guy that nobody had ever heard of."

and he has only himself to blame.
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Old 10-07-2008, 03:38 PM   #972
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I'd love to see that happen. And while I don't think it's a probability, it's certainly a possibility.

Again, I think the key for Obama is to lay down a few well-written sentences as a "final punch" to the smears, and then move on to the issues. The contrast between a festering old man who is stuck on smears and the guy who's talking about the economy will be stark.
Yes, exactly!! I can't wait for McCain to lose his temper so people can see how erratic he is. Obama's natural cool demeanor will speak volumes, even if he doesn't throw a verbal knock out punch. I would love to see that though!
Just a well placed verbal jab that speaks directly to the smears and then on to his plans for the economy and other real issues. Obama's visable grace and eloquence and patience is going to be unbeatable. That's a true leader ladies and gents.
McCain is going to look like a 2 yr old throwing a tantrum. It's going to be beautiful.
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Old 10-07-2008, 03:40 PM   #973
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my guess is that relatively little will be changed after this debate, and the trends already set in place will continue.

then again, McCain may feel like he needs a big moment, so maybe he'll roll the dice/throw a hail mary/double down on something or other.

like he keeps doing every month.
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Old 10-07-2008, 03:52 PM   #974
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Obama is now consensus up in FL. pulling away in OH. and PA seems to be totally out of reach for McCain.

we're already hearing it, but a right wing narrative is already being put forth that McCain lost because of the banking crisis. that's foolishly simplistic. McCain started to lose steam first with the "lipstick on a pig" and the "sex ed for 5 year olds" nonsense that happened well before the banking crisis. and it's less about the crisis itself, and more about the fact that McCain gave us the "fundamentals/strong" garbage. not to mention Palin's abysmal interviews. so it has nothing to do with McCain's unfortunate membership in the Republican party at an inopportune time in history.

resist that narrative. it's garbage. the difference is that since the banking crisis McCain has appeared unstable, melodramatic, self-pitying, hysterical, and erratic. Obama has been utterly and totally presidential. he is careful. he is calm. he is an adult.

and that's why he's winning. McCain -- the esteemed John McCain, once the most popular politician in America -- looks as if he is going to lose to, and i quote Chris Rock, "a black guy that nobody had ever heard of."

and he has only himself to blame.
Brilliant I do think, that the economic crisis was the straw that broke the camel's back, so to speak. A look back through American history, and especially the Depression clearly shows that the Republicans aren't the party one wants in charge of an economic crisis for the simple fact that their economic philosophy of deregulation and the free market is flawed at its core. Hoover got us into the Depression and it took FDR to get us out. When you look at Hoover's economic policies and decisions and how he favored corporations and big business on everything from taxes to government aid, the parallels to our current president are scary. Bush got us into this economic crisis, it will take a Democrat to get us out.
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Old 10-07-2008, 04:20 PM   #975
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Watch, though....

I'll bet that what we'll actually see tonight is McCain not directly going for any of the smears at all. He's going to try and use the fake "town hall" atmosphere to come off as a sweet, thoughtful, calm guy.

I still think he'll come off as a festering old bean, but I'm not banking on him slinging too much mud tonight.
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Old 10-07-2008, 04:26 PM   #976
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Watch, though....

I'll bet that what we'll actually see tonight is McCain not directly going for any of the smears at all. He's going to try and use the fake "town hall" atmosphere to come off as a sweet, thoughtful, calm guy.

I still think he'll come off as a festering old bean, but I'm not banking on him slinging too much mud tonight.
In the first debate he sounded like he was about to you yell, "You damn kids get off my lawn!" at any moment. I don't think this will be any different. One of McCain's own strategists said about the outright lies the campaign has been throwing out about Obama, "It's a dangerous road, but we have no choice. ...If we keep talking about the economic crisis, we're going to lose." Political Punch It's absolutely despicable, and it's also why I truly believe deep down that McCain will lose this election.
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Old 10-07-2008, 05:08 PM   #977
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Gallup Daily: 9-Point Obama Lead Ties Campaign High
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Old 10-07-2008, 05:09 PM   #978
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If I remember correctly, thereabouts in August or early September when things looks tied/going McCain's way there was rumblings from Strongbow and others about the loonies on this forum declaring an Obama blowout victory months and months ago.

Still about a month to go, but it'd be useful to keep this in mind if the campaign keeps its current trajectory. It's possible those loonies were actually psychic.
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Old 10-07-2008, 05:24 PM   #979
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If I remember correctly, thereabouts in August or early September when things looks tied/going McCain's way there was rumblings from Strongbow and others about the loonies on this forum declaring an Obama blowout victory months and months ago.

Still about a month to go, but it'd be useful to keep this in mind if the campaign keeps its current trajectory. It's possible those loonies were actually psychic.

actually many ran away form their supposed optimistic predictions

I think I have always said I expected a decisive win by Obama


my only question has been,
Is there a candidate that I can enthusiastically say,
"I am for him".
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Old 10-07-2008, 05:31 PM   #980
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actually many ran away form their supposed optimistic predictions

I think I have always said I expected a decisive win by Obama


my only question has been,
Is there a candidate that I can enthusiastically say,
"I am for him".
I can't count myself among those thinking Obama would ever do this well pre-election. So it's very unsettling looking at the numbers right now.
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