US 2008 Presidential Campaign Discussion Thread - Part 9

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at last, we've come to the real reason why Palin was selected: so she can smirk and call Obama a terrorist. "man of honor" McCain has a hawkee mahm doing his dirty work for him.

but is this hari kiri?


Obama allies warn GOP to back off attacks.

By CHARLES BABINGTON – 1 hour ago

ASHEVILLE, N.C. (AP) — Barack Obama's allies warn that John McCain's attacks on the Democrat's character will lead to the political equivalent of mutual assured destruction: fire your big weapon at your own peril.

Several Obama surrogates said his supporters may start reminding voters of McCain's ties to Charles Keating, a convicted savings and loan owner whose actions two decades ago triggered a Senate ethics investigation that involved McCain as one of the "Keating Five."

The warnings of massive retaliation came as McCain's running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, took on the role of attacker and said that Obama sees America as so imperfect "that he's palling around with terrorists who would target their own country." She was referring to an early Obama supporter, 1960s radical Bill Ayers, a founder of the Weather Underground whose members were blamed for several bombings when Obama was a child.

Obama has denounced Ayer's radical views and activities. But he's not above questioning McCain's character with loaded words.

On Sunday Obama unveiled a TV ad on the economy that paints McCain was "erratic in a crisis." Some see that as a reminder of McCain's age, 72.

Democrats were well-synchronized Sunday, using the word "erratic" and Keating's name in nearly-matching sentences across the talk show circuit.

"This is going to be a month, I think, of character assassination," Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif., an Obama supporter, said on CBS's "Face the Nation."

Indeed, McCain adviser Greg Strimple predicted "a very aggressive last 30 days" of the campaign.

"We are looking forward to turning a page on this financial crisis and getting back to discussing Mr. Obama's aggressively liberal record and how he will be too risky for Americans," he said in a recent conference call with reporters.

Obama, too, alluded to harsher tactics in a speech Sunday to thousands of people in Asheville, N.C.

McCain and his aides, Obama said, "are gambling that he can distract you with smears rather than talk to you about substance. They'd rather try to tear our campaign down than lift this country up. It's what you do when you're out of touch, out of ideas, and running out of time."

Noting the nation's serious economic problems, Obama said: "Yet instead of addressing these crises, Senator McCain's campaign has announced that they plan to turn the page on the discussion about our economy and spend the final weeks of this campaign launching Swiftboat-style attacks on me."

Obama has denounced Ayers' radical views and activities. However, Ayers hosted a small gathering for Obama in 1995, early in his political career. Obama and Ayers live in the same Chicago neighborhood and served on a charity board together, but there is no evidence they have palled around.

Rep. Rahm Emanuel, a Chicago Democrat and Obama supporter, warned against McCain's strategy.

"If we are going to go down this road, you know, Barack Obama was eight years old, somehow responsible for Bill Ayers," he said. "At 58, John McCain was associating with Charles Keating."

"If we really want to talk who is associating with who, we will," Emanuel said. "The American people will lose in that transaction."

Just months into his Senate career, in the late 1980s, McCain made what he has called "the worst mistake of my life." He participated in two meetings with banking regulators on behalf of Keating, a friend, campaign contributor and S&L financier who was later convicted of securities fraud.

The Senate ethics committee investigated five senators' relationships with Keating. It cited McCain for a lesser role than the others, but faulted his "poor judgment."

In the new Obama ad, an announcer says: "Our financial system in turmoil. And John McCain? Erratic in a crisis. Out of touch on the economy."

The ad, slated to start running Monday on national cable, alludes to McCain's response to the nation's financial crisis. He briefly suspended his campaign, called for a White House summit meeting that ended chaotically, and showed varying degrees of support for the massive rescue bill Congress passed Friday.

Republicans say McCain's actions showed leadership.

"In the midst of it all, I think you saw Sen. McCain, unlike Sen. Obama, come off the campaign trail, because that's John McCain in the middle of a crisis," said Sen. Joseph Lieberman of Connecticut, an independent-Democrat who backs McCain.
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Sad news. My condolences to her family and friends.
 
Irvine511 said:
i know that some people want to think that the only reason Obama is skyrocketing in the polls and McCain is falling is because of the economy, but there's more to the rise than the fact that McCain admits he knows nothing about the economy and the only place Republicans have ever taken us is economic ruin.
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The evidence does not support that though. Take a look at the polls and look when Obama started to pull ahead of McCain after McCain had been ahead for two solid weeks by margins as large as five points. Obama did not start to pull ahead of McCain until after the financial crises in mid-September.
 
so, after Obama continued to skyrocket after the first debate, how much of a bounce will he get after the second debate? it was startling, for Obama to have so clearly defeated McCain in what was supposed to be his best subject, foreign policy, and now we're going into a debate into what is McCain's preferred format -- the town hall. can McCain start to close the ever widening gap now that Obama is pushing 50% and more in most national polls and as the list of swing states are now all red states? all McCain can do is hold, is it going to be enough for the presidency? is Obama, again, going to shut down and shut up McCain even though the debate is supposedly weighted towards his strengths?

we can only wonder.
 
diamond said:
Will O tap Hil?

<>

:sexywink:

regardless-

condolences
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i think that if McCain hadn't been imploded by the economy, Obama's superior debating skills, better ideas, superior intelligence, stronger campaign, and just better overall human qualities, and the in retrospect terrible choice of Palin, and that if maybe he were tied in the polls, Obama might have an HRC pick as a Hail Mary. fortunately, he hasn't needed to embarrass and debase himself like McCain has had to.

the fact that McCain has sent Our Sarah out to call Obama a terrorist is more proof positive of the campaign's desperation.

it's sad, really. poor John McCain. he was crushed by Bush in 2000 and everyone knows he hates the man. so then he sucked up to Bush in 2004 in order to become the front runner in 2008. then, Bush turned out to be the worst president in modern history, and so poor Johnny M had to distance himself from Mr. 22% and forced a sitting president to literally phone in a speech to the RNC. that's shocking, and historic, and shocking to anyone who understands anything about history. McCain did his best to shoot Bush in the head, and Palin emphatically denounced and rejected the failed Bush administration in the last debate.

and what good has it done them?

not much.

poor things. :hug:
 
Irvine511 said:
i think that if McCain hadn't been imploded by the economy, Obama's superior debating skills, better ideas, superior intelligence, stronger campaign, and just better overall human qualities, and the in retrospect terrible choice of Palin, and that if maybe he were tied in the polls, Obama might have an HRC pick as a Hail Mary. fortunately, he hasn't needed to embarrass and debase himself like McCain has had to.

the fact that McCain has sent Our Sarah out to call Obama a terrorist is more proof positive of the campaign's desperation.

it's sad, really. poor John McCain. he was crushed by Bush in 2000 and everyone knows he hates the man. so then he sucked up to Bush in 2004 in order to become the front runner in 2008. then, Bush turned out to be the worst president in modern history, and so poor Johnny M had to distance himself from Mr. 22% and forced a sitting president to literally phone in a speech to the RNC. that's shocking, and historic, and shocking to anyone who understands anything about history. McCain did his best to shoot Bush in the head, and Palin emphatically denounced and rejected the failed Bush administration in the last debate.

and what good has it done them?

not much.

poor things. :hug:
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+1,000,000.
 
if we were from another planet and we landed and saw this election, it should be a no-brainer.

an old, white, long time senator who was a war hero and a major part of a party that has been in power for over a decade and who has spent the better part of his career cultivating the media (not to mention submitting himself before the current president) is running against an almost unknown first term african-american senator with the name Barack Hussein Obama.

by all reasonable historical measures, it shouldn't even be close.

alas.
 
What's incredible is that he has 2 out of 3 names working against him.

To the idiots anyway.

And yet, he is up 50%-43%.


I guess the chickens did come home to roost after all, except in a way that actually makes sense: 8 years of crap will not pan out for another 4.
Hopefully.

BTW, Rev. Wright is a jackass racist moron. I don't mean to quote him in a positive manner.

Anyway, according to Palin, Obama hangs out with terrorists.
Meanwhile, Obama is the only one who has mentioned hunting down Osama Bin Laden.

You would think with McCain's record he would play that up more, but no.
Which makes me believe the governement actually knows more that they do about his whereabouts and doings and keep him there so the can pull the fear factor at any time.
 
JOFO said:
I guess the chickens did come home to roost after all, except in a way that actually makes sense: 8 years of crap will not pan out for another 4.
Hopefully.
Click to expand...

I really think that we have a very inert and mostly stupid middle and lower middle class who is perfectly happy to maintain the status quo. Bush was able to get a lot of them by scaring them with brown ragheads coming after them into the American heartland.

But now their own financial well being is in trouble. Now they are worried about their money in the bank, their payroll cheques and how long they'll continue to be employed. You're never going to get the right wing bigots, but the middle cares more about their own hide than about Obama's middle name or who he sat on a board with. They are terrified of losing their money and that the country is going to implode. They see an angry old man well past his prime, a woman who is woefully inadequate by any sane measure, a president who has been a miserable failure except if you're Sting, Republicans in congress trying to pretend like they're not republicans and so on.

Once you start feeling like you may be out on your ass in the street, suddenly Adam and Steve getting hitched and a 19 year old college student going to an abortion clinic start to seem irrelevant. These people are looking out for #1 first, who can blame them. Except McCain who looks like he may be a huge loser by virtue of it.
 
You really shouldn't go digging for lame-ass, peripherally-associated skeletons when you have a few in your own closet that tie in 100% to the crises of the day.

:down:
 
a Republican strategist has some good advice for Johnny Mac and Our Sarah:


October 5, 2008 10:11
30 Days Out...
Posted by Mike Murphy

Lots of process talk on the political tom-toms right now about McCain pulling out of Michigan and re-deploying resources to other states. This moving forces around the map like Gen. Rommel in the desert stuff may be catnip to the media and a huge pre-occupation of the campaign staffs, but it can obscure the big picture. McCain is in trouble in Michigan for the same reason he is in trouble in GOP leaning Florida and North Carolina; when it come to strategy Team Obama is throwing the McCain High Command around the room like stunt men in a Bruce Lee picture. The terrain of the election has shifted mightily to economic fear and Obama is moving his campaign to exploit that. Meanwhile the McCain campaign retains its lamentable focus on press tactics at the expense of a real strategy. While Obama’s huge financial resources are an advantage, the vital issue for McCain is not cutting all Detroit TV spending to find money to increase a TV ad buy in Charlotte from 1700 rating points a week to 2600 rating points because Obama can afford 3800 rating points. What really counts is what message McCain is using his 1800 rating points to carry, and even more importantly what message McCain and Palin are out selling in the media every day. For the last nine weeks the McCain campaign has tried win by raising Obama’s negatives. Ads have attacked, McCain and Palin has have attacked. This has failed. Over the top negative attacks and a campaign message that too often seems to be little more than sarcasm and suppressed anger has damaged McCain’s priceless and hard earned “brand” as a different kind of Republican. McCain’s best option now is to ditch the chainsaw and offer a scared and angry country what it badly wants; hope and leadership.

Palin should drop the braying attacks on Obama’s aging hippie bomber pals and start connecting to her cherished hockey moms on the one issue they = are actually worried about; a quickly slowing economy. Chuck the hacky and ineffective negative ads and switch to man on the street spots with real people voicing their real doubts about Obama; too weak to stand up to Washington’s mighty special interest cartel or the newly empowered Democratic bosses of the Congress and Senate, too liberal to know how to fix the economy, too inexperienced to handle a dangerous world. On Tuesday, McCain should look into the camera and connect to the 80 million scared and worried Americans who will be watching him.

McCain is losing. To regain a chance to win, McCain must run as who he truly is; pragmatic, tough, bi-partisan and ready to break some special interest china to get the right things done in Washington. Fix the message, and you will fix the states.
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i guess i'm getting a little sick -- and this goes mostly for Republicans, but also for Democrats, and especially for David Brooks -- of people who continue to make excuses for McCain's nasty, snarky, mean-spirited campaign. the chorus of, "it's not his fault, he's better than this." really? just who is in charge here?

perhaps, after over a decade of carefully cultivated and managed media spin about said Maverick, we are seeing the real McCain, and there's no there there. or, what's there is a professional politician who's used his position for personal gain as much as anyone else in DC.

it's disappointing, really. because i bought into the Maverick McCain Myth as well.
 
Irvine511 said:
it's disappointing, really. because i bought into the Maverick McCain Myth as well.
Click to expand...

Have you read this? Make-Believe Maverick : Rolling Stone

I knew about some of this before reading it, but still, it's kind of horrifying to see all his misdeeds tallied in one place.

I liked him up until this campaign got going, too. Now, he scares me more than Bush ever did.
 
Va. GOP fears McCain could lose state - Jonathan Martin - Politico.com

:yippie:


I live in a targeted state, and a targeted region within the targeted state. Sometimes I feel like I'm just floating through my classes because I never think about them, but I somehow manage to go through the motions of doing assignments and taking exams, meanwhile my mind/energy are entirely focused on the election.

To think...November 5 this will all be over, and it's also my birthday. Less than a month...and it'll probably be the most insane month ever. Virginia will deliver for Obama.
 
The FiveThirtyEight guys have been visiting the field offices of each candidate in various states. This blog entry offers some telling insight as to why McCain's support is slipping.

Reason #78 McCain is losing?

The meat of this post is below the slideshow, and it’s about the McCain ground game. It's probably going to make a little stir.

Our apologies in advance to the Obama organizers and volunteers who aren’t going to get the full justice they deserve in this post. They believe Missouri is going blue this year, and they’re working their bodies into the ground to make that happen.

We’re getting used to this relentless Obama operation: organizers trained in both tactics and campaign culture, working so hard they have trouble remembering what happened 48 hours ago – it’s too distant – and convinced that if they stay in their lane and trust the structure it’ll pay off in the end.

Obama has 40 offices now open in Missouri, and Justin Hamilton, Obama’s Press Secretary for Missouri, told us that while he couldn’t confirm below or above the published reports of 150 organizers (it didn’t come from the campaign), the campaign is only adding to its ground force. Organizers have now recruited 2500 neighborhood team leaders statewide, folks who do the far more effective work than any 30-second ad or yard signs, actual face-to-face contact and persuasion of their neighbors.

For a Democrat to win Missouri, he or she has to follow the Claire McCaskill map, which is win the blue urban centers in Kansas City and St. Louis city by wide margins, hold down the losses in outstate Missouri (McCaskill spent huge time in and around Springfield, and got to 42% there while Kerry only managed 37%), and then win highly populated St. Louis County (20% of Missouri’s overall vote) by enough votes to hold on for a win. McCaskill won St. Louis County by 12, Kerry only won it by 9. Barack Obama beat Hillary Clinton in the County, 63% to 36%.

Something interesting is happening with John McCain’s campaign. Up until now, we’ve had no trouble gaining access to field offices and volunteers. Here in St. Louis, we were told by Tina Hervey, Missouri Republican State Party Press Secretary, that she had never heard of FiveThirtyEight, and while they trusted Politico, we were people who they had to decide whether we “shouldn’t or don’t need to be talking to.” (McCain’s Missouri press secretary actually works out of Iowa, and did not return calls or email.) I told Tina that’s not a story we wanted to write, that this was our first Republican resistance, and that while she may not have heard of us, we’d probably go over 2.5 million site visits this week, now that we’re regularly past 400,000 per weekday. I told her I’d hold off writing her flat refusal and give her the opportunity to change her mind.

No budging. We were told that we’d be asked to leave public field offices we now attempted to visit. We did not get any promised follow-up helping get access to the post-debate Palin rally last night, and we were locked out. Hmm.

Let’s be clear. We've observed no comparison between these ground campaigns. To begin with, there’s a 4-1 ratio of offices in most states. We walk into McCain offices to find them closed, empty, one person, two people, sometimes three people making calls. Many times one person is calling while the other small clutch of volunteers are chatting amongst themselves. In one state, McCain’s state field director sat in one of these offices and, sotto voce, complained to us that only one man was making calls while the others were talking to each other about how much they didn't like Obama, which was true. But the field director made no effort to change this. This was the state field director.

Only for the first time the other day did we see a McCain organizer make a single phone call. So we've now seen that once. The McCain organizers seem to operate as maître Ds. Let me escort you to your phone, sir. Pick any one of this sea of empty chairs. I'll be sitting over here if you need any assistance.

Given a choice between taking embarrassing photos of empty phone banks, we give McCain’s people the chance to pose for photos to show us the action for what they continually claim we “just missed.” No more. We stop into offices at all open hours of the day, but generally more in the afternoon and evening. “Call time,” for both campaigns, is all day, but the time when folks over 65 are generally targeted begins in late afternoon and goes til 8 or 9pm. Universally, McCain’s people stop earlier. Even when we show up at 6:15pm, we’re told we just missed the big phone bank, or to come back in 30 minutes. If we show up an hour later, we “just missed it” again.

The McCain offices are also calm, sedate. Little movement. No hustle. In the Obama offices, it's a whirlwind. People move. It's a dynamic bustle. You can feel it in our photos.

Up to this point, we’ve been giving McCain's ground campaign a lot of benefit of the doubt. We can’t stop convincing ourselves that there must – must – be a warehouse full of 1,000 McCain volunteers somewhere in a national, central location just dialing away. This can’t be all they’re doing. Because even in a place like Colorado Springs, McCain’s ground campaign is getting blown away by the Obama efforts. It doesn't mean Obama will win Colorado Springs, but it means Obama's campaign will not look itself in the mirror afterward and ask, "what more could we have done?"

You could take every McCain volunteer we’ve seen doing actual work in the entire trip, over six states, and it would add up to the same as Obama’s single Thornton, CO office. Or his single Durango, CO office. These ground campaigns bear no relationship to each other.

Here on out, our skepticism is going to be higher. We truly respect organizers on both sides, because it is grindingly hard work for minimal pay. It’s powered by a belief in doing what’s right. We do not quote them or get them in trouble. Moreover, we truly respect direct action by volunteers – who do exist on the McCain side, just as a tiny, tiny fraction of the Obama side – but if the attitude continues on this unhelpful and obstructive turn, we’re going to spend less time making excuses for what we observe. Less benefit of the doubt. Show us real work and we'll cover it. We want to.

We'll be up in Chicago tonight making Nate pound RCP shooters. Then, Indiana. There's a huge story unfolding in Indiana.

-- Sean Quinn
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