And his cause for reasonable suspicion is because a teenage boy was wearing a hoodie in the rain?
Had TM just told Zimmerman to back off - or had he ignored Zimmerman and went home - there would have been no tragedy.
Or, you know, had Zimmerman not gotten out of his vehicle and followed him like the police asked him to.
Nowhere in your post did I see any of this tragedy being attributed to Zimmerman. It was all onus on Martin to do this or that or the other thing. Kind of weird.
Admittedly I haven't bothered following this case as closely as most of you, but was Zimmerman gainfully employed at the time of this incident? Or was he just doing nothing but playing wannabe cop in his neighbourhood?
Well - anyone is allowed to be suspicious of anything.
I reference the clothing as evidence that seems to point that TM had the character of a young man/older teen that desired to be a "gangsta" - and not only did he want to look the part, he wanted to play the part (based on the texts and photos on his phone) - and this is what motivated him to jump the "cracka" Zimmerman - which eventually led to his being shot.
Had TM just told Zimmerman to back off - or had he ignored Zimmerman and went home - there would have been no tragedy. Instead - the evidence supports that he waited for Zimmerman to catch up to him, he jumped him, he broke his nose, and then had him pinned to the ground while continuing the assault.
Even though TM's clothing, location, actions led to attracting Zimmerman's attention - it was TM's decision to jump Zimmerman (in a manner which would have brought felony assault charges had both survived the incident) that caused his death.
There is zero evidence that TM was hit by Zimmerman. There is extensive evidence that Zimmerman was hit by TM.
However, he did not have the right to physically assault Zimmerman.
Again, apologies as I'm not as familiar with the facts - how was it established that TM jumped Zimmerman? Eye witness accounts?
All of his cheer-leading fans deserve to have the truth spoon fed to them.
there are very few facts, many things are being reported as facts by people that have bias.
We all have bias and must admit that so the bias can be identified and challenged to try for objectivity.
as for admitted evidence? jesus, some people think it is the same as facts.
OJ got the correct verdict in the criminal case, not guilty based on the prosecution and evidence. He did not take the stand, his right. So be it. Some people believe 'justice' was not served. The Goldman and Brown family got a Civil Case where OJ was compelled to take the stand, with preponderance of evidence he was found guilty.
So my question to you. Would you support a Civil Case against GZ so the Martin family can have GZ compelled to take the stand and testify?
surprising that you think OJ should have walked completely with no repercussions at all.
you do realize it is just for damages and not criminal charges, so no double jeopardy at all.
That's a rather bold assumption.Had TM just told Zimmerman to back off - or had he ignored Zimmerman and went home - there would have been no tragedy.
The evidence supports that "he waited for Zimmerman to catch up to him"? Where is this evidence?Instead - the evidence supports that he waited for Zimmerman to catch up to him, he jumped him, he broke his nose, and then had him pinned to the ground while continuing the assault.
And how is it that the line in the sand, basically the only piece of the puzzle that's missing, hinges on a known liar and is believed as fact and evidence by so many?However - the inciting incident, the point of no return, the line in the sand where hypothetical ends and the tragedy begins is when Martin jumped Zimmerman.
"cracka"
Again, apologies as I'm not as familiar with the facts - how was it established that TM jumped Zimmerman? Eye witness accounts?
Rachel JeantelAnd we know he said this based on. . . .
I've not yet had this question answered to my satisfaction.
Rachel Jeantel
Is this suppose to mean something?It seems the prosecution's star witness, Rachel Jeantel, believes "Trayvon hit first" and there was also no bruising/marks on Trayvon (from a fight).
It's a shame that speculation and circumstantial evidence carry so much weight in this mess.I concede - this is circumstantial. However, it does line up with Zimmerman's story and it is difficult to see how a grown man could get his nose broken, head beaten, and helplessly pinned - without leaving a single mark on the other person - unless he was "jumped". But it is possible I suppose.
Is this suppose to mean something?
It's a shame that speculation and circumstantial evidence carry so much weight in this mess.
It's a shame that speculation and circumstantial evidence carry so much weight in this mess.
Not saying you're wrong or right but it's unfair to jump to that conclusion. I could just as easily say that without the gun someone still would have died. And there's no basis for that, it is something I don't think we will ever know.
There was alignment on a factual element regarding how this started? Where?When prosecution and defense witnesses align on a factual element, what does it say about the speculation that something else happened?
No one is disputing this, but none of this tells me how it started.Well, true. In this forum we've used speculation to carry on a discussion, and try to guess what likely happened based on the evidence we've seen in the trial and through the information released via the press.
To me - the key is the voice crying out repeatedly "Help!....Help!....Help!"
So what do we know was happening at this moment...
We know for sure that Zimmerman's back was wet, was bleeding on the back of the head, and had a broken nose. An eyewitness also saw TM punching down on Zimmerman "MMA" style. Also - the forensics demonstrated that the bullet went through TM's sweater in a way that could only occur from leaning forward.
This seems to contradict what you stated earlier about Martin waiting for Zimmerman to catch up to him???Also - the dispatcher said to Zimmerman, "we don't you need you to do that" after the dispatcher heard the wind in the background and asked Zimmerman if he was following the suspect. In other words - Zimmerman did not disregard the dispatcher's advice - instead - was heading back to his vehicle to meet the cops (he told the dispatcher he would meet them at his truck).
This seems to contradict what you stated earlier about Martin waiting for Zimmerman to catch up to him???
Well - anyone is allowed to be suspicious of anything.
I reference the clothing as evidence that seems to point that TM had the character of a young man/older teen that desired to be a "gangsta" - and not only did he want to look the part, he wanted to play the part (based on the texts and photos on his phone) - and this is what motivated him to jump the "cracka" Zimmerman - which eventually led to his being shot.