Three Journalists killed today by US military.

[Klaus]

from CNN.COM

BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Two journalists were killed by an explosion at the Palestine Hotel and an Al-Jazeera TV reporter died when an airstrike hit a building housing the Arab media on Tuesday during intense but sporadic warfare in central Baghdad, the respective news services said.

At least four other journalists were injured in the blast at the Palestine Hotel, used by many international journalists as a base in Baghdad.

...

...Journalists operating independently in contested areas put themselves most at risk, said Brooks, who added that, "where we have knowledge of (their presence), I think we can do what we can to try to prevent injuring journalists and any other noncombatants."

read full article here

"Tageschau" to the same subject:

..."Hotel "Palestine" was shot by a US tank most of the International Journalists stay (approx. 150 ).

2 US Rockets hit the Baghdad Headquater of Abu Dhabi TV/Al Jazeera. Al Jazeera reporters couldn't imagine that it was coincidence because they were hit by not only one but by 2 rockets

Both places were well known Journalist buildings.

Spanish defence minister Federico Triollo asks the USA for a explenation of this.
He also urges all spanish reporters to leave Baghdad emediately because of future uncontrollable situations

Victoria Clarke (US Pentagon speaker) said that US army has bin atacked from the hotel and they had to selfdefend.
No journalist could be found so far who heared these shots.
One journalist asked why the US troops fired into the 15.th floor when the US troops thought they saw shots from the lobby.

Great Britain won't protest against these acts.

Reporters without borders protest against this attack and say it "dosn't look like an accident". The IFJ protests at US and Iraqi attacks at Journalists and said that both parties should stop these warcrimes. The DJF protests against these acts to and asks US troops to stop attacks against international Journalists emediately.

Klaus

p.s. sorry, some text passages are translated several times so they might not be the exact words, i tried not to change the intension of the article

 

[Klaus]

Addition:

LEGITIMATE TARGET OF ATTACKS
UNDER INTERNATIONAL HUMANITARIAN LAW
HPCR POLICY BRIEF

I. The basic principle of distinction
According to an uncontroversial principle of customary international humanitarian law
(IHL), parties to an armed conflict must distinguish between the civilian population and
combatants and between civilian objects and military objectives. In order to spare
civilians and the civilian population from hostilities and their effects, it is essential to
define who and what may be attacked. The first rule regarding attacks (by acts of
violence 2 ) is that the intended target must be a military objective. Once a military
objective is the target, under additional rules, which are not discussed here, the attack
may nevertheless become illegal if excessive collateral damage affecting civilians or
civilian objects must be expected. Furthermore, even when attacking a lawful target,
precautionary measures to spare civilians have to be taken.
While the main aim of the law is to protect persons, it is appropriate to discuss first what
objects may be attacked. This permits to clarify the criteria, which make targets
legitimate. In addition, attacks on objects involve the greatest danger for persons who are
beyond any doubt civilians.

 

[hiphop]

Oh, American precision work again!

To me, the situation seems clear: It is a planned warning for others. Look at all the deaths (except for soldiers and Iraqi civilians) surrounding this war. First a protestor is killed by an Israeli bulldozer, then some Russian diplomats, then Al Jazeera is shot at, now its about targetting journalists. A little too many accidents for my taste.

The bulldozer might have been a different affair, but the rest speaks a clear language.

It is saddening to see the lowers itself to the style of the Cosa Nostra.

 

[Screaming Flower]

you must have extensive experience in war tactics. i had no idea we had someone with so much battle experience in our midst.

 

[hiphop]

Cosa Nostra knowledge, you meant.

I wrote a paper about its tactics, and the resemblances are quite shocking.

 

[eardrumbuzz]

Cosa Nostra knowledge, you meant.

I wrote a paper about its tactics, and the resemblances are quite shocking.

yeah! they killed Kennedy too!

 

[sharky]

Ok while they should have known that is where journalists were, they were attacking people who were just trying to cover the story, its bad and all, wouldn't it be bad for the US to attack journalists who are trying to tell the story? don't you think they would try to avoid killing an al-Jazeera journalist to avoind the hatred it would create?

yeah, they shot at the wrong place but there were many government officials staying in that hotel as well. don't be surprised if someone in that building was shooting at US troops.

In the meantime, we've lost way too many civilians and way too many journalists. One is way too many. Let's pray this is over with soon before we lose anyone else.

 

[Dreadsox]

I am sure the US Military wanted to create an international crisis. Yep, definitely what the White House wants, to kill reporters so there will be even more bad press.

The Civilian Casualties in this war as of to day are so small compared to past wars, it sickens me that people, in their round about way, are accusing our servicemembers of doing this on purpose. It is a war, someone fired from the building at them. They have every right to defend themselves. The fact that you are accusing the US servicement and women of acting like the MOB, sickens me to no end. As a former servicemember, and as someone whose relatives are currently putting their lives on the line in Iraq, your post is disgusting and out of line.

There have been many reports of servicemen taking fire and not returning it for fear of hitting civilians. Where is your outrage at the bastards who are using tactics that try and increase civilian casualties?

Klaus, thanks for the articles, you are always respectful in your posts.

 

[hiphop]

I am sure the US Military wanted to create an international crisis. Yep, definitely what the White House wants, to kill reporters so there will be even more bad press.

The Civilian Casualties in this war as of to day are so small compared to past wars, it sickens me that people, in their round about way, are accusing our servicemembers of doing this on purpose. It is a war, someone fired from the building at them. They have every right to defend themselves. The fact that you are accusing the US servicement and women of acting like the MOB, sickens me to no end. As a former servicemember, and as someone whose relatives are currently putting their lives on the line in Iraq, your post is disgusting and out of line.

Hey Dread,

I wasn?t accusing the service mebers of anything. They just do what they are told to do, and when they are told, they have to do so - so its not their fault.

I am sure, on the other hand, that the White House doesn?t give a shit about creating a crisis. After all, they have have created one about the U.N., about unilateral attack, not to speak of the heavy diplomatic crisis with Europe. If you think the administration is trying to keep things out of crisis, this proves you wrong.

Now, if journalists say they weren?t fired at from the building, the Army officials just seem to spread another crap piece of disinformation, in my eyes. Journalists tend to be more independent in their views than military, sorry but thats just a fact.

And even IF this was the case (which I heavily doubt) - those things are normally solved different. Yes, it is a war, but when you know this hotel is full of journalists, you?re NOT going to shoot at the hotel anyway. After all, they could have sent troops into the hotel to find Oswald, whats so complicated about that?

No, really, I am sorry, but all those things, the diplomats, Al Jazeera, and the journalists happening in a time span of very few days - this speaks a clear language.

Sorry if it makes you sick, I can relate to that - many Sicilians were sick of the war between the Cosa Nostra and the state, too. I guess thats how things go in war, I just wonder that those killings are planned and executed so cruelly.

Or do you want to tell me it was all hit and miss? I don?t buy it. The U.S. Army is intelligent. Not responsible, though - the one who gives the orders is responsible.

 

[Dreadsox]

How is it unilateral? There are many countries supporting this action. The UN Crisis was created by France and Russia refusing to hold their trading partner accountable with their Peace for OIl campaign.

Us forces have every right to fire when fired upon. If you would like to suppy the number of troops the US had in the area at the time to show me that it is tactically smart to raid a building, please show me. Have you done this? Ever raided a building? Do you know what it takes?

It does speak a clear language, war is hell, and if you are reporting in a time of war, or driving out of a battle field, or if some asshole is manipulating the world by placing troops in your building, it is not a safe place to be.

My sickness is your post, not at all with the actions our troops took yesterday. I feel badly, I pray for the souls of the dead. But, your post, as it stood was insulting.

Your last line again implies that the US Services are intentionally targeting reporters. AGain, insulting.

Peace

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

The fact that innocent people, journalists included, are dying is tragic. It's tragic, but it's a fact of war. American and British journalists have died in battle too. A war zone is not exactly the safest place to be. Anyone who might suggest that Al Jazeera was targeted on purpose, I don't even have the breath to give you a response.

Now back to watching the liberated citizens of Iraq yank down the main statue of Saddam in the center of Baghdad...

gee, and I thought these people didn't want this war...

 

[The Wanderer]

it's tragic. they certainly didnt have to be there though. that was their choice to stay in the middle of Baghdad during a war.

 

[sharky]

exactly, wanderer. there are several news organizations that pulled their reporters out because of the danger.

 

[hiphop]

it's tragic. they certainly didnt have to be there though. that was their choice to stay in the middle of Baghdad during a war.

I won?t put words into your mouth, but what do you want to say with your post? To me, it sounds as if you implied that its the reporters own fault. Like, if you move into trouble, thats what you get for it.

If I am wrong, tell me, what else did you want to say?

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

spin spin spin...

no one thinks the journalists got what they deserved... there are risks one takes when you enter a war zone. it's a tragic event, and the press... both al jazeera who died at the hands of american rounds and american and british journalists who died by shots fired from iraqis... did not deserve to die, but they knew the risk when they entered a war zone. that's it.

 

[The Wanderer]

yeah I want journalists to die...

you accused the US of targeting journalists

you're such an ass

 

[sulawesigirl4]

you're such an ass

Very nice debating tactic.

 

[hiphop]

spin spin spin...

no one thinks the journalists got what they deserved... there are risks one takes when you enter a war zone. it's a tragic event, and the press... both al jazeera who died at the hands of american rounds and american and british journalists who died by shots fired from iraqis... did not deserve to die, but they knew the risk when they entered a war zone. that's it.

Ok, I agree. They knew the risks when entering the war zone.

Yes, sure. Everyone knows. And so?

I think that was an argument, not just a mere statement. What good is a statement like that? Its totally logical that everyone who is in Iraq at the moment is at high risk.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

it was a defense at your thought that any of us were saying that the journalists deserved to die...

 

[hiphop]

yeah I want journalists to die...

you accused the US of targeting journalists

you're such an ass

What do you mean then, "they certainly didn?t have to be there"? You mean it like a statement, am I interpreting this right? You mean, if they had chosen not to be journalists, but bakermen, they wouldn?t be there. Or, if they had chosen to be journalists that left Iraq, they wouldn?t have been shot. So whats the job of a journalist then?

I didn?t accuse the US of targeting journalists, man, and i didn?t accuse you of wanting journalists to die. Get over it. I said that there is certain pattern that remembers me of the methods of the Cosa Nostra. We will never know if someone gave the order to fire into the building intentionally.

Do you think it was an accident?

And another accident?

And another accident?

Ok, your choice. Then I must say, the military is really not acting precise enough. It is a little much, just a little too much. We are talking about lives here. Not about patriotism and accusing. Life weighs heavier.

 

[Klaus]

2 other interesting facts:

al Jazera HQ was also bombed in Afghanistan war. (Seems they have no luck with US military) so it's easy for people who don't trust the US (most people in the arabic world) to see a pattern

David Chater (britisch Sky Channel,) saw this tragidy with his own eyes and said "absurd". "That tank shell, if it was indeed an American tank shell, was aimed directly at this hotel ... This wasn't an accident. It seems to be a very accurate shot." and.. "What are we supposed to do? How are we supposed to carry on if American shells are targeting Western journalists?"

my opinion: if it was an acident US government should appologize for that and not talk aobut self-defense

The way they handle this situation shows how they talk about "colateral damage" in other places too. The only difference is that Journalists can inform the world how it really was, who would believe a iraqi family who complains that they were shot for no reason?

Here you can read the view of CPJ

http://www.cpj.org/news/2003/Iraq08apr03na.html

Tho problem of a President who thinks his mission is authorized by god might be that he has serious problems to simply say "What we did was wrong"

Klaus

 

[verte76]

Right, if anyone was shot for no reason, the thing to do is to acknowledge that there was a screw-up and apologize, not rationalize.

 

[nbcrusader]

The BBC is onw reporting that the blast that killed the journalists may have been the result of Iraqi soldiers.

From The Guardian.

 

[sharky]

look, I have a friend who is embedded with the 82nd Airborne and he is taking a risk being there. We know that reporters have died on both sides of the war. We know that reporters were kidnapped by Iraq. We also see reporters reporting from Qatar or Kuwait. You don't HAVE to be in Iraq. That's why people left.

Do they deserve to die? No. But neither do civilians. Are you willing to go on record and say that journalists -- and ONLY journalists -- were in that building? I've been reading coverage from the New Yorker of a journalist staying at that hotel talking about all the Iraqi government officials that were also staying there. Unless you were there and can say that you did not see any shots fired from that building with your own eyes, you need to back off. I wouldn't be surprised if there were shots fired from that hotel. And I wouldn't be surprised if that tank thought it was aiming at Iraqi resistors.

It?s a sad day when journalists die but they were there to report the TRUTH. Don't manipulate the truth to make it YOUR truth to support your argument. We were not there, we don't know exactly what happened there. Stop acting like we do.

 

[hiphop]

Ok, agreed, we don?t know about the truth because we weren?t there.

 

[FizzingWhizzbees]

look, I have a friend who is embedded with the 82nd Airborne and he is taking a risk being there. We know that reporters have died on both sides of the war. We know that reporters were kidnapped by Iraq. We also see reporters reporting from Qatar or Kuwait. You don't HAVE to be in Iraq. That's why people left.

True, but I'm personally very grateful that some reporters have stayed in Iraq during the course of the war in order to let those people not in Iraq know something of what's been happening there.

Unless you were there and can say that you did not see any shots fired from that building with your own eyes, you need to back off. I wouldn't be surprised if there were shots fired from that hotel. And I wouldn't be surprised if that tank thought it was aiming at Iraqi resistors.

Equally, if you weren't there then you can't say there there were shots fired. Personally I've heard Rageh Omar (BBC correspondent) and David Chater (Sky News correspondent) go on record as saying they do not believe there were any shots fired from that hotel. They were both giving eye-witness accounts of the events.

It?s a sad day when journalists die but they were there to report the TRUTH. Don't manipulate the truth to make it YOUR truth to support your argument. We were not there, we don't know exactly what happened there. Stop acting like we do.

True, none of us can know for definite what's happened in Iraq because we weren't eye-witnesses to it. However, we're all in the same position here: none of us are in Iraq and so all of our comments are based on information from people who are in Iraq. If you are going to discredit other people's opinions because they weren't present at the events they're talking about, then surely that logic discredits your own opinions also as you're not in Iraq either. I don't mean this post to sound like it's a direct criticism of you, I just think it's wrong to suggest that because we're not in Iraq, we can't really comment on events there.

 

[Dreadsox]

The BBC is onw reporting that the blast that killed the journalists may have been the result of Iraqi soldiers.

From The Guardian.

The Guardian would be one of the first papers to push that Americans did it. Interesting.

Peace

 

[FizzingWhizzbees]

You don't like the Guardian?

 

[hiphop]

But I like the Guardian!

 

[FizzingWhizzbees]

YaY! Guardian readers of the world unite!