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Old 12-14-2002, 07:18 PM   #101
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Originally posted by Dreadsox
When there is a viable alternative to oil, I will 100% support an end. Now, for my country it makes no sense to allow ourselves to be held hostage by other countries.
This argument is partially mute. Even if we started today on Alaska, it takes a minimum of 10 years just for oil exploration, and that doesn't even include building the oil well and piping the oil. All exploring for oil at this point will do is placate some Texan oil magnates that are buddies of Dubya and his father, because I'm sure we'll be able to perfect hydrogen fuel cells in ten years time.

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Old 12-15-2002, 04:14 PM   #102
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I said a lot of foolish things when I was 20 too..

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not much changed there then...
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Old 12-15-2002, 05:58 PM   #103
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I find that to be a very ugly remark!
Ok (bonoman) why dont you go f@#%ing cry. I (took) it as a joke. But really the only joke here is your post.

For the record, I do not WANT oil exporation and drilling in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge. That being said, it is a "national wildlife refuge" as opposed to a "national park," and I have not heard of it potentially "killing a national park." Wildlife refuges, wildlife management areas, national forests and the like are often considered for limited and heavily regulated resource uses, as is the case with the current ANWR proposals. A 45,000 acre Wildlife Management Area is about 2 miles from my home, and it is home to some of the largest wildlife populations in Alabama. Prior to its designation as a WMA, it was used for methane and other natural gas drilling. Now it is an abundant wildlife home.

The proposed exploration site is a small portion of the greater Refuge, and exploring/drilling there would be far less risky than additional water-based drilling in the Eastern Gulf of Mexico, yet you hear very little media coverage of Gulf drilling. My concern with ANWR drilling, however, is that if the initial exploration is succesful, the scope of drilling will increase geographically. For the longest time, ofshore drilling in the Western Gulf of Mexico has gone forth unimpeded, and the Eastern Gulf of Mexico was always left alone. However, the movement to drill in the Eastern sector has gradually increased and snuck up on those who are opposed to it. With ANWR, something should be done in advance to ensure a limited scope for such exploration and drilling.

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Old 12-16-2002, 02:12 AM   #104
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Could i borrow a tissue?
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Old 12-16-2002, 01:23 PM   #105
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Originally posted by Dreadsox
As a member of the voting public, I am impressed with the way the President has worked through the interantional community to get the resolutions passed. I am impressed with the fact that the President has the inspectors back inside Iraq.
I think this "working with the international community" stuff is just a formality for the sake of appearances. Everyone knows that if Bush wants to invade Iraq, he will do so regardless of what the international community has to say. The US made it abundantly clear that if the resolutions weren't passed, they would go it alone. And what country would be foolish enough to vote against the US anyway, risking repercussions down the line? Remember, "you're either for us or against us" there are no shades of grey...

Quote:
Whats most puzzling is this assertion that because America has saved many people over the past century that we think we are superior to anyone?!?! Since when did anyone here say that Americans were personaly superior to anyone?

We have certainly had many people come out with, chip on the shoulder attitude, to the USA. Whats really astonishing is the unobjective nature of the criticism and this false assumption of superiority that Americans have. It might be better to talk of the unwarrented insecurity of foreigners outside the USA.
Sting2, up to now this entire conversation has focussed on the military, but I think the reason that people believe that Americans think they are superior to everyone, is because we are bombarded 24/7 with movies and TV images of Americans singing "God Bless America" and chanting USA! USA! USA! and saying that they are the greatest country in the whole world, and threatening to kick people's asses etc.....

The point is, if Americans think their country is #1 in the world, then by default, they must also be the #1 people of the world. We are given the impresson that there is this sense of entitlement in being an American, like they are God's chosen people.

It's like when your team wins, or your country wins a Gold Medal there is this wonderful feeling because you associate yourself with your team and you feel like YOU are winning. Well, there's no doubt that Americans are on a winning team, and this sense of being #1 is part of their national psyche! Therefore it certainly seems that Americans feel very superior. "Humility" and "America" are not two words you find together that often.

I know I am generalizing here, but this is basically a thread about generalizations. I am not trying to insult anyone, but this is what I really percieve to be what a lot of people think. I know there are millions of Americans out there who believe they are priviledged to be part of such a wonderful country and don't feel superior....but that is not the overwhelming image Americans project through their media. I think the rest of the world is pretty sick and tired of having the US agenda be front and centre all the time.

Just on a side note, have you ever seen that show "Talking to Americans" where Rick Mercer, this Canadian comedian runs around pretending to be a news reporter and telling Americans on the streets all kinds of outrageous things about Canada that they all believe....well when Americans look in the camera and proclaim "Congratulations, Canada on legalizing the stapler!" and "Congratulations Canada on joining North America!" and "Congratulations Canada on getting 24 hour time!" you can't help but have a soft spot for their friendly enthusiasm while also being totally horrified.....Americans are certainly a demonstrative and enthusiastic bunch.....
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Old 12-16-2002, 01:55 PM   #106
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Hi Jess!

With all due respect I have some comments:

Quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. Edge

And what country would be foolish enough to vote against the US anyway, risking repercussions down the line? Remember, "you're either for us or against us" there are no shades of grey...
He said this regarding terrorism, and to nations harboring terrorists, not in regards to the Iraq war.

Quote:
Sting2, up to now this entire conversation has focussed on the military, but I think the reason that people believe that Americans think they are superior to everyone, is because we are bombarded 24/7 with movies and TV images of Americans singing "God Bless America" and chanting USA! USA! USA! and saying that they are the greatest country in the whole world, and threatening to kick people's asses etc.....

The point is, if Americans think their country is #1 in the world, then by default, they must also be the #1 people of the world. We are given the impresson that there is this sense of entitlement in being an American, like they are God's chosen people.
Great points in that first paragraph- I had been thinking the same exact thing. However because it is dramatized that way in the movies or on TV does NOT mean it reflects how Americans think (although it may affect how they think). Let's remember that Hollywood also presents images of emaciated women who have been face-lifted and tummy-tucked so much they are simply a bag of bones- does this mean this is what every American desires (for themselves or their loved ones)? No. So while they may want to look good (or be patriotic) the majority won't go to the lengths of hurting themselves or others for their cause.

Quote:
I know there are millions of Americans out there who believe they are priviledged to be part of such a wonderful country and don't feel superior....but that is not the overwhelming image Americans project through their media. I think the rest of the world is pretty sick and tired of having the US agenda be front and centre all the time.
I agree, and this becomes a media problem more so than an American "we rule you drool" issue.. Same way with the portrayal of "thinness" on the media or any other issue.

Quote:
Just on a side note, have you ever seen that show "Talking to Americans" where Rick Mercer, this Canadian comedian runs around pretending to be a news reporter and telling Americans on the streets all kinds of outrageous things about Canada that they all believe....well when Americans look in the camera and proclaim "Congratulations, Canada on legalizing the stapler!" and "Congratulations Canada on joining North America!" and "Congratulations Canada on getting 24 hour time!" you can't help but have a soft spot for their friendly enthusiasm while also being totally horrified.....Americans are certainly a demonstrative and enthusiastic bunch.....
Funny.. but there are lots of stupid people everywhere. This reminds me of Jay Leno's "Jaywalking" bits he does, stumping people over simple questions (like, "what controls the tide?" or "what's the capitol of New York?" type of things). It's wrong to say people are ignorant just in regards to Candians!
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Old 12-16-2002, 06:04 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. Edge

Sting2, up to now this entire conversation has focussed on the military, but I think the reason that people believe that Americans think they are superior to everyone, is because we are bombarded 24/7 with movies and TV images of Americans singing "God Bless America" and chanting USA! USA! USA! and saying that they are the greatest country in the whole world, and threatening to kick people's asses etc.....
Mrs. Edge,

Thank you for a respectful comment on things. It is appreciated and many of your points are valid. I have not seen anyone parading around in the streets saying USA USA and other than my children in the car, I have not seen anyone else singing "God Bless America".

That being said, I do not know what other countries put on their news....nor do I know what how they present the United States to their citizens. If it is anything like our news, I am sure they portray what they want you to see, just as our media does here in the States.

I have learned more about other people and their beliefs since I started cruising the web, and reading other materials besides the things presented by our press here.

Peace
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Old 12-16-2002, 06:34 PM   #108
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look, just the fact that the majority of the people are complainning, means that something is wrong, not that they are 'jealous' or 'against you'. this is not kindergarden. some practices are just plain wrong, and millions of people can't ALL be wrong. this is not some fairy tale where one hero rises up in an evil world to save it.

it's like when a company get loads of complaints from their employees, they can either be nice and address the problem and try to fix it, or label the employees as whiney, jealous, morons who don't know anything about management and go down the drain. not everybody is competing all the time. criticism is good because it points out your shortcomings to you so you can fix them and be better.
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Old 12-16-2002, 06:46 PM   #109
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judging some of these posts i see they will let just about anyone in FYM

thank u
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Old 12-16-2002, 06:55 PM   #110
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Dreadsox, thank you for that...the thing I admire about you and Sting2 is that you are always able to discuss things without resorting to mudslinging.

Olive, thanks for your comments too! You are probably right about that comment and terrorism, although I still think a country really has to think twice before doing something contrary to the US's plans.

Anyway, carry on.....
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Old 12-16-2002, 06:59 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. Edge
Dreadsox, thank you for that...the thing I admire about you and Sting2 is that you are always able to discuss things without resorting to mudslinging.

Olive, thanks for your comments too! You are probably right about that comment and terrorism, although I still think a country really has to think twice before doing something contrary to the US's plans.

Anyway, carry on.....
yes Dread and Sting are typical of conservatives in real life..
Im not.
Olive is very smart for a girl
Mrs Edge has potential as a Canadian.

thank u-
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Old 12-16-2002, 08:05 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. Edge

Olive, thanks for your comments too! You are probably right about that comment and terrorism, although I still think a country really has to think twice before doing something contrary to the US's plans.

Anyway, carry on.....
Thanks Mrs. Edge. I would agree on that last part . What dreadsox says brings up a great point- I know in India the media they receive of the U.S. consists of shows like Baywatch, and therefore they think the U.S. culture consists of bimbos only concerned with sex.


Quote:
Originally posted by diamond
Olive is very smart for a girl
I'm privilaged to uphold the standards for the female race, thank you Diamond. I don't know how I do it (without the help of testosterone) but I try..
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Old 12-17-2002, 03:00 PM   #113
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Originally posted by oliveu2cm
Hi Jess!

With all due respect I have some comments:

<snip>

you always know if someone starts off with that, you're screwed. I wonder if people prefix with that just so they can say whatever the hell they want and still cover their backs...

Nothing personal to your views or anything, the terminology just amuses me
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Old 12-17-2002, 05:11 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally posted by cloudimani


you always know if someone starts off with that, you're screwed. I wonder if people prefix with that just so they can say whatever the hell they want and still cover their backs...

Nothing personal to your views or anything, the terminology just amuses me
I think you're more screwed if someone starts it off without saying "with all due respect"

I only said that b/c I haven't talked to Jess in a while, and I didn't want her to think I was attacking her, since she is a friend of mine.
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Old 12-18-2002, 03:25 PM   #115
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yeah, thats fair enough As I said, it was nothing to do with your views, just amuses me that all

and yes, I am very strange...
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Old 12-19-2002, 05:05 AM   #116
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Originally posted by diamond
judging some of these posts i see they will let just about anyone in FYM

thank u
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Old 12-19-2002, 07:25 AM   #117
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Read you.
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Old 12-20-2002, 04:53 PM   #118
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. Edge
Dreadsox, thank you for that...the thing I admire about you and Sting2 is that you are always able to discuss things without resorting to mudslinging.



Anyway, carry on.....
I try....I delete a lot of my ideas before I post
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