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Old 04-23-2010, 09:10 PM   #741
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Old 04-23-2010, 10:49 PM   #742
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lol
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:22 AM   #743
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it ensures equality of opportunity for a healthy mix of the rich and the ignorant.
Are Democrats giving back their Wall Street donations from the last ten years?
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:26 AM   #744
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See how deregulation works so well?
Our current cycle seems to be to deregulate just enough to cause a problem (yet still keep out real competition) - then come back with much stronger regulations to REALLY keep out the competition.
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Old 04-24-2010, 01:08 AM   #745
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Our current cycle seems to be to deregulate just enough to cause a problem (yet still keep out real competition) - then come back with much stronger regulations to REALLY keep out the competition.
I'd comment on this if I could hear you over the noise of my absurd bills to go to a public university. Over $100,000.
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Old 04-24-2010, 01:17 AM   #746
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I'd comment on this if I could hear you over the noise of my absurd bills to go to a public university. Over $100,000.
Do you think it's possible the rising cost of tuition is connected to vast amounts of low interest, government backed loans that were put into the system the last 10 years?

If everyone in the country has $100,000 to spend on college - then all colleges will charge at least $100,000 to attend (the more select will make the cost even higher.)

Just a thought.
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Old 04-24-2010, 01:32 AM   #747
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but that's the thing, not everyone has that much money. people have to borrow it to get a degree which the vast majority of jobs require. so lower and middle class students have to incur vast amounts of debt just to get a job above minimum wage.

this doesn't even mention what can happen if you need more money than the government will loan you so you have to turn to private loans.
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Old 04-24-2010, 09:11 AM   #748
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but that's the thing, not everyone has that much money. people have to borrow it to get a degree which the vast majority of jobs require. so lower and middle class students have to incur vast amounts of debt just to get a job above minimum wage.
.
The vicious cycle of easy lending and the resulting inflation of prices for the product in which the money is leant has already pushed tuition well beyond the normal marketplace conditions. I’m hopeful that one good thing that will come from the recent downturn is that people will take on less debt, and tuition will normalize.

Our society benefits from an educated society – and we should do everything possible to encourage all economic classes to go to college. However, we also don’t want a condition were an entire generation or two of graduates are essentially slaves to the banks.
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Old 04-24-2010, 09:58 AM   #749
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The vicious cycle of easy lending and the resulting inflation of prices for the product in which the money is leant has already pushed tuition well beyond the normal marketplace conditions. I’m hopeful that one good thing that will come from the recent downturn is that people will take on less debt, and tuition will normalize.

Our society benefits from an educated society – and we should do everything possible to encourage all economic classes to go to college. However, we also don’t want a condition were an entire generation or two of graduates are essentially slaves to the banks.
I'm totally with you on this one. Banks have had it easy lending to students with the backing of the government. It basically has been an arms race akin to the housing bubble. Demand drives up price, banks lend to satisfy the demand of a "good" college education. Banks and arms dealers are the only ones who profit from that.

I think it's a safe argument to say that higher education benefits you, but it does sound suspiciously close to the mantra that was going on during the housing bubble, "Home ownership is the key to middle-class wealth." So buy a bigger, more expensive house now! What are you, a loser?

It didn't belong, but that's another reason I'm glad HCR passed with the student lending provision in it.
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Old 04-24-2010, 10:29 AM   #750
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Our society benefits from an educated society -
I should have proofread this. I meant to say society benefits from an educated population.
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Old 04-24-2010, 10:31 AM   #751
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...but it does sound suspiciously close to the mantra that was going on during the housing bubble, "Home ownership is the key to middle-class wealth." So buy a bigger, more expensive house now! What are you, a loser?
Yes, you are right on with this.
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Old 04-24-2010, 11:18 AM   #752
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I'd comment on this if I could hear you over the noise of my absurd bills to go to a public university. Over $100,000.


if taxes were lower, you'd be able to afford your public university.

right?

after all, the only reason Memphis has been paying off his student loans from his own public university for the past 10 years is because our taxes are too high.
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Old 04-24-2010, 11:32 AM   #753
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after all, the only reason Memphis has been paying off his student loans from his own public university for the past 10 years is because our taxes are too high.
10 years? That's pretty common I think.
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Old 04-24-2010, 11:36 AM   #754
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10 years? That's pretty common I think.

with a good 10 more to go.
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Old 04-24-2010, 11:40 AM   #755
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so, where do the Tea Partiers wish to begin cutting defense?
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Old 04-24-2010, 11:44 AM   #756
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so, where do the Tea Partiers wish to begin cutting defense?
I can't speak for Tea Partiers - but I certainly think we can cut defense. I am more in favor of a quicker, lighter, deadlier force (increased reliance on special forces and technology and less reliance on the huge sys admin force).
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:01 PM   #757
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with a good 10 more to go.
Public tuition does vary a lot between states. But in general I think it provides a good value to both state and student, no matter how you choose to pay off your loans.

Anyway, it's up to each state to decide how much to subsidize their public universities. I'd rather it happen at that level rather than Washington, D.C.
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:18 PM   #758
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Public tuition does vary a lot between states. But in general I think it provides a good value to both state and student, no matter how you choose to pay off your loans.

Anyway, it's up to each state to decide how much to subsidize their public universities. I'd rather it happen at that level rather than Washington, D.C.

the point i'm trying to make is that students have to incur incredible amounts of debt at even state universities in a world where a college degree is essential to making even a lower-middle class income, and simply lowering taxes -- the Tea Party raison d'etre -- is an inane approach to problems like public education. more, treating public education like a marketplace is exactly the wrong way to go about dealing with the issue, and the same with health care.
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Old 04-24-2010, 12:36 PM   #759
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I can't speak for Tea Partiers - but I certainly think we can cut defense. I am more in favor of a quicker, lighter, deadlier force (increased reliance on special forces and technology and less reliance on the huge sys admin force).
I don't know too much about how defense money is appropriated, but I'm worried that a "quicker, lighter, deadlier force" is what the branches of the military ARE going for these days; this means more expensive aircraft, stealthier machinery that costs hundreds of millions of dollars to manufacture, and massive contracts to revamp the combat uniforms of soldiers and turn them into truly 21st century/futuristic-looking warriors. Unfortunately, these expensive and pioneering programs represent much of the $$ that bloats the defense budget.

Sure, we can make strides in reducing the size of our armed forces bases around the world; there's been recent criticism of bases in unstable countries throughout Central Asia, for example. But if we want the ability to do all the things that a more effective, stealthier military ought to do, we will still need these safe havens and landing strips to accomplish our missions.

For both sides — conservatives and liberals — it seems like it's going to get really hard to separate the rhetoric that surrounds 'Defense-Speak' from what kind of serious defense spending reform we're willing to support.

I'm not looking forward to hearing this debate on Cable News/online news sites, etc...they don't seem to do a very good job of channeling emotions into good dialogue
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Old 04-24-2010, 01:52 PM   #760
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so, where do the Tea Partiers wish to begin cutting defense?
Don't ask so they won't have to tell.
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