Tell Me Your Name or Go To Jail

[nbcrusader]

Court: If police ask, you must give your name

US citizens do not enjoy a constitutional right to refuse to reveal their identity when requested by police.

In what may become a major boost to US law enforcement and antiterrorism efforts, the US Supreme Court Monday upheld a Nevada law that makes it a criminal offense for anyone suspected of wrongdoing to refuse to identify himself to police.

 

[*BOOMCHAA!*]

yeah, I read that earlier today.
scary huh.

 

[BVS]

...makes it a criminal offense for anyone suspected of wrongdoing to refuse to identify himself to police.

Apparantly Nevada only has male criminals...that explains why the hookers are let to walk the streets.

 

[Dreadsox]

Awesome!!! I agree with the law.

 

[melon]

A 5-4 ruling. About as credible as Dubya's coronation to the Presidency, when the issue should have been sent to the House of Representatives, as per the constitution.

Melon

 

[deep]

When Kerry is elected he can have people outside of Gun Shows taking names, addresses and phone numbers.

 

[nbcrusader]

A 5-4 ruling. About as credible as Dubya's coronation to the Presidency, when the issue should have been sent to the House of Representatives, as per the constitution.

Melon

Consider the number of 5-4 decisions that many cherish as the law of the land......

 

[melon]

Consider the number of 5-4 decisions that many cherish as the law of the land......

Good one.

Melon

 

[Angela Harlem]

yeah, I read that earlier today.
scary huh.

why? are americans above the law or something?

 

[oliveu2cm]

why? are americans above the law or something?

Like nbc quoted above, "US citizens do not enjoy a constitutional right to refuse to reveal their identity when requested by police." So it is their right to refuse to reveal their identity.

What defines a suspect? And what do they have to be suspect of- a certain kind of crime? Is wrongdoing limited to terrorism kind of behavior or does it include minor wrongdoings like littering?

Where does it stop? A national ID card? Something even more invasive than that? Can you imagine all the legal harm someone could do with the identity of another, nevermind financial?


In this instance, the first thing that jumped to my (paranoid?) mind is someone who may look /dress like a police officer, or even is a security guard, taking advantage of the situation to get information from people they want to hurt. Identity theft, stalking, whatever.

 

[Angela Harlem]

I guess you can call this me living in a bit of a naive backwater, as that kind of thing would hardly cross the mind of any Australian. Giving your name to the police is as standard and not thought twice of, as going to vote every year.
Maybe we dont need to worry so much about ID theft and the like, though I'm sure in time that could change. If someone wants to steal your ID, surely there'd be easier ways than going to the effort of imitating a cop?
As for the need and defining a suspect, in most cases a cop is only going to ask you for your name if they actually need it. Like you've witnessed something or reported a matter etc. And if you're on the road, a standard plate check will give them what they need anyway. If your constitution doesn't allow you to deny giving this info, then you kinda dont have a choice really, do you?

Maybe I'm just naive lol.

 

[verte76]

Yeah, this makes me paranoid as well.

 

[oliveu2cm]

I guess you can call this me living in a bit of a naive backwater, as that kind of thing would hardly cross the mind of any Australian. Giving your name to the police is as standard and not thought twice of, as going to vote every year.
Maybe we dont need to worry so much about ID theft and the like, though I'm sure in time that could change. If someone wants to steal your ID, surely there'd be easier ways than going to the effort of imitating a cop?
As for the need and defining a suspect, in most cases a cop is only going to ask you for your name if they actually need it. Like you've witnessed something or reported a matter etc. And if you're on the road, a standard plate check will give them what they need anyway. If your constitution doesn't allow you to deny giving this info, then you kinda dont have a choice really, do you?

Maybe I'm just naive lol.

to be honest I never would have considered not providing my name to a police officer. The thing that worries me though is it becoming ILLEGAL not to - punishable with jail or fines. It's sort of like needing a warrant to search your house, I guess. They shouldn't be able to have such power in collecting people's names or whatever. What if I happened to frequent a store that gets robbed a lot? If I'm on the scene a few times, just shopping, the police officer could legall get my name each time and I'd be in some database, possibly listed as a suspect? It makes me a little hesitant.

The thing that made me paranoid is if it becomes well known that you MUST provide info or risk arrest, then some people will try to use that to their advantage by tricking others into provide more information than they have to, or whatever. I just think of crazy stalkers and people who go after the eldery and try to get their info.

mebbe i'm just paranoid but between this and the patriot act I feel we're treading on thin ice between protecting citizens and intruding on them.

 

[Liesje]

Why would you care if the police knew your name? If an officer asked me my name, I doubt I'd ever even consider not giving it to him/her, as I don't see any reason not to.

 

[nbcrusader]

I guess Americans have gotten use to the luxury of quibbling over the scope of our rights. Sometimes I think we forget how free we are.

 

[joyfulgirl]

Why would you care if the police knew your name? If an officer asked me my name, I doubt I'd ever even consider not giving it to him/her, as I don't see any reason not to.

olive just gave several valid concerns why

Sometimes I think we forget how free we are.

and some of us can't forget how free we used to be

 

[Popmartijn]

to be honest I never would have considered not providing my name to a police officer. The thing that worries me though is it becoming ILLEGAL not to - punishable with jail or fines. It's sort of like needing a warrant to search your house, I guess. They shouldn't be able to have such power in collecting people's names or whatever.

So when you're a witness to a crime they should not know that you can help them in getting the criminal?

What if I happened to frequent a store that gets robbed a lot? If I'm on the scene a few times, just shopping, the police officer could legall get my name each time and I'd be in some database, possibly listed as a suspect? It makes me a little hesitant.

Could be. Could be listed as witness too. And who says they're going to put your name in a database? And who says the criminal isn't also listed in that same database, for the very same reasons you are listed?

I'd say refusing to give them your name will put you higher on a subjects list than do giving your name. Why refuse? Are you hiding something?

The thing that made me paranoid is if it becomes well known that you MUST provide info or risk arrest, then some people will try to use that to their advantage by tricking others into provide more information than they have to, or whatever. I just think of crazy stalkers and people who go after the eldery and try to get their info.

Well, those people are usually caught quite fast. Why would they rush to a suspicious scene to start demanding names? If it's suspicious, then there's a chance that the actual police is also going to that place.

C ya!

Marty

 

[wolfeden]

and some of us can't forget how free we used to be

*nods*
one more piece of evidence that this is in no way a conservative administration.

I am a conservative because I want LESS "BIG GOVERNMENT" MESSING AROUND IN MY LIFE.... this is one more action directly opposed to that.

get out of my bedroom, gun safe, and doctor's office, and LEAVE ME THE HELL ALONE when I haven't done a damn thing wrong.

 

[joyfulgirl]

In this instance, the first thing that jumped to my (paranoid?) mind is someone who may look /dress like a police officer, or even is a security guard, taking advantage of the situation to get information from people they want to hurt. Identity theft, stalking, whatever.

Either you and I have seen too many bad cop movies or we live in a scary place because I am not usually prone to paranoia but this is what first came to mind for me, too.

 

[Popmartijn]

and some of us can't forget how free we used to be

You mean when you could just shoot somebody, just because he/she was looking strange at you?

 

[BVS]

and some of us can't forget how free we used to be

This is one of the best lines in FYM that I've seen in a long time.

 

[joyfulgirl]

You mean when you could just shoot somebody, just because he/she was looking strange at you?

Oh don't be silly. We can still do that.

 

[Dreadsox]

olive just gave several valid concerns why



and some of us can't forget how free we used to be

You are no longer free how?

 

[nbcrusader]

*nods*
one more piece of evidence that this is in no way a conservative administration.

This was a court decision, not an action of the current administration.

 

[oliveu2cm]

So when you're a witness to a crime they should not know that you can help them in getting the criminal?

Oh no, I wasn't meaning (in the scenario I gave) that I don't expect people to help if they witnessed a crime. I didn't mean to assume if I was shopping i had actually /witnessed/ the crime.

Could be. Could be listed as witness too. And who says they're going to put your name in a database? And who says the criminal isn't also listed in that same database, for the very same reasons you are listed?

I'd say refusing to give them your name will put you higher on a subjects list than do giving your name. Why refuse? Are you hiding something?
[/B]

Who says they won't put my name in a database? Don't they keep track of people who loan books from libraries that are written about making bombs? Why wouldn't they keep track of this kind of thing?

Really this isn't personally about me and I don't think I'd have qualms about giving my name, but I don't like the idea that I could be ARRESTED if I just wanted to mind my own business. Again, it's like searching a house without a warrant. When arresting someone you have to have reason/suspicion of a crime and then you can bring someone in (and hold them for however long until they have to be charged or set free) - you can't just bring people in b/c they won't give you their names where someone thought they did a "wrongdoing." it's not really how our legal system worked, or how I thought it worked.

of course I'd rather fight for women's rights and all sorts of things before fighting for this , but it did catch my eye today, and I don't think getting lax about our rights to personal privacy is a good idea.