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Old 03-30-2007, 02:59 PM   #1
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Speaking up against suspicious person can get you sued?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070330/...emoved_lawsuit
Quote:
Passengers sued over imams' removal

By PATRICK CONDON, Associated Press Writer
1 hour, 27 minutes ago

MINNEAPOLIS - Six Muslim men removed from a plane last fall after being accused of suspicious behavior are suing not only the airline but the passengers who complained — a move some fear could discourage travelers from speaking up when they see something unusual.

The civil rights lawsuit, filed earlier this month, has so alarmed some lawyers that they are offering to defend the unnamed "John Doe" passengers free of charge. They say it is vital that the flying public be able to report suspicious behavior without fear of being dragged into court.

"When you drive up the road towards the airport, there's a big road sign that says, `Report suspicious behavior,'" said Gerry Nolting, a Minneapolis lawyer. "There's no disclaimer that adds, `But beware if you do that, you might get sued.'"

The six imams were taken off a Phoenix-bound US Airways flight on Nov. 20 while returning home from a conference of Islamic clerics in Minneapolis.

Other passengers had gotten nervous when the men were seen praying and chanting in Arabic as they waited to board. Some passengers also said that the men spoke of Saddam Hussein and cursed the United States; that they requested seat belt extenders with heavy buckles and stowed them under their seats; that they were moving about and conferring with each other during boarding; and that they sat separately in seats scattered through the cabin.

The plane was cleared for a security sweep, nothing was found, and the jet took off without the imams.

The Muslim clerics say they were humiliated, and are seeking unspecified damages from the airline, the Minneapolis airport and, potentially, the John Does.

Omar Mohammedi, the New York City attorney for the imams, said the intent is not to go after passengers who raise valid concerns about security. But he suggested some passengers may have acted in bad faith out of prejudice.

"As an attorney, I have seen a lot of abuse by the general public when it comes to members of the community creating stories that do not exist," Mohammedi said.

He denied the imams were talking about Saddam, and said that their seats were assigned and that they requested extenders because their seat belts didn't fit.

Some fear such lawsuits could weaken what has become the first line of defense against terrorism since Sept. 11 — an alert public. At airports and train and subway stations around the country, travelers are routinely warned to watch for unattended bags and suspicious activity and to notify authorities.

Ellen Howe, spokeswoman for the Transportation Security Administration, which oversees security at all U.S. airports, would not comment specifically on the imams' lawsuit. But she said the TSA counts on passengers to help the agency do its job.

"`See something, say something' is certainly a common mantra in this day and age," Howe said. "We would always remind passengers to be both vigilant and thoughtful."

In reaction to the imams' lawsuit, Congress has taken steps to legally protect passengers who report suspicious activity. Earlier this week, the House approved an amendment to a rail transportation security bill that would make passengers immune from such lawsuits, unless they say something they know is false.

Mohammedi said he has not yet identified any of the complaining passengers. An airport police report listed a passenger and two US Airways employees as complaining about the imams. All three had their names blacked out before the lawsuit was filed by invoking a Minnesota law that allows it, airport spokesman Pat Hogan said.

Nolting said he has been contacted by several potential John Does.

Passenger Pat Snelson, who lives in a Twin Cities suburb, said he and his wife were not among those who reported suspicious behavior. But he said his wife noticed the men praying, and he saw them moving around the cabin while others were boarding.

"These guys were up to no good," Snelson said. "We think the airport people did a real good job in taking care of it."

Bomb-sniffing dogs examined the men and their baggage. FBI agents and other federal law enforcement officers questioned the men for several hours before releasing them.

Billie Vincent, a former director of security for the Federal Aviation Administration, said he is troubled by the mere attempt to identify the passengers who raised concerns.

Airline passengers "are your eyes and your ears," said Vincent, who now owns an aviation security company. "If attorneys can get those names and sue them, you put a chilling effect on the whole system."
This to me seems ridiculous but wrong also. Yes we really can't judge a person because of their religion, but in the times we live in. But then you have to justify that you want to feel safe, so what is wrong with reporting suspicous people? If a person of any sex, religion, race was acting strange I would report him for my safety and the safety of others.
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Old 03-30-2007, 03:12 PM   #2
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'"These guys were up to no good," Snelson said.'

Praying is evil!
And they even do it five times a day!
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Old 03-30-2007, 03:32 PM   #3
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This whole incident is to furthur the agenda of CAIR and is really quite effective, the Muslim Brotherhood know how to create their battles.
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Old 03-30-2007, 04:03 PM   #4
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This will certainly be an interesting case to watch. Especially, with airlines and governmental officials urging citzens to look out for suspicous behavior. Travelers should pay close attention to this.
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Old 03-30-2007, 10:32 PM   #5
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Case isn't going anywhere.
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Old 03-31-2007, 03:10 PM   #6
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Re: Speaking up against suspicious person can get you sued?

Quote:
Originally posted by Justin24
so what is wrong with reporting suspicous people?
What is suspicious behavior? I guarantee you if I did the same exact "behavior", no one would think twice.

They should be sued.
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Old 03-31-2007, 03:25 PM   #7
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^ For being suspicious and reporting their unease?
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Old 03-31-2007, 06:04 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
^ For being suspicious and reporting their unease?
For the action taken. Last time I checked you couldn't exactly be sued for being a bigot, if so some people in here would be broke.
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Old 03-31-2007, 09:36 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


What is suspicious behavior? I guarantee you if I did the same exact "behavior", no one would think twice.
So, If I as a white male was spoke of Saddam Hussein, cursed the United States, shouted in Arabic and then asked for a seat-belt extension and stowed it under my seat, that would not be suspicious in an boarding area or an airplane?

Now if I was simply "praying' - yes...that is not suspicious...but the combo sure is. This suit is absolute B.S.

There have been quite a few articles about how the organization that these Imans are from in Arizona are related to the 9/11 terrorists in a "Kevin Bacon Six Degrees of Seperation" way. If you are dumb enough to do the things they did BEYOND the prayer in an airport, then your frivilous lawsuit has no merit.
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Old 03-31-2007, 09:52 PM   #10
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Of course it can get you sued. Anything can get you sued.

Doesn't mean it will be successful. And this one will certainly fail.
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Old 03-31-2007, 10:03 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


For the action taken. Last time I checked you couldn't exactly be sued for being a bigot, if so some people in here would be broke.
Why is everything a race issue??? What would you classify a suspicious person? So we should not tell authorities of a suspicious person due to there color or religious belief. I am sure this was not an issue to the passengers until they were hearing there conversation. Please answer the questions above.
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Old 03-31-2007, 10:39 PM   #12
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Because it IS a race issue? Fearful people (due to your fucking fear mongering media machine) saw some islamic immans (who were probably in religious dress) and were praying and immediately went 'FUCK TERORISTS!' and they were discrimminated against for small things that any other normal "non muslim" passanger who did them would not have got a second glance and missed their flight.

Its just another reason why its shit to be muslim in the US
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Old 03-31-2007, 11:33 PM   #13
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It's not a fucking Race issue. What constitutes a suspicious person? Does that person become valid once he has taken over a plane? What about if there sweating and looking around nervously, let me guess you would say oh now you attacking people with mental instability. PC BS. Let all those in guatanamo go. If you see some one leaving a suspicious package go. If you see someone acting out of place, don't report it or your a bigot. Please answer the fucking Question.


I am just guessing you don't believe there is such a word as suspicious or in your book, because suspicious today would reference you to being some one of bigotry?
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Old 04-01-2007, 02:29 AM   #14
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ok lets look at this suspicious behaviour they had

*They prayed. WOW religious people praying before flying, lets start arresting anyone who walks into those little prayer rooms at the airport!

* They asked for seat belt extensions. OMG. Every fat person, or someone who wants a bit of room on a plane is SUSPICIOUS because they asked for a seat belt extension

* they were seated all over the plane. OMG they followed the rules and sat where they were allocated by the airline- them NASTY terrorists!

* they cursed the US. Well who hasn't?

I understand the unattended luggage, or proper suspicious behaviour, but this just seems like overkill to me. Ok, they have to accept that lots of americans now equate all muslims with terrorists and stuff, but to be thrown off a plane because maw and paw retard don't like them getting seat belt extensions and praying in a foreign language (and to a dirty muslim god at that!) is over the top.

thats all.
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Old 04-01-2007, 03:12 AM   #15
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And can you guess how many drunks have been thrown off??? Many so don't give me this BS. And let's see this happened in Minnesota, so of course people in that region would be more watchful. Just like people in other countries would be watchful of anyone or anything suspicious in their country, city, town.

And don't call them Retards, that is rude. There watchful and attentive by caring for others on the planes. Look at the Israelis who watch for suspicious people, or objects, are they Maw and Paw Retards??
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Old 04-01-2007, 04:06 AM   #16
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I totally would report that type of behaviour, and the idea you could be labelled a bigot is ridiculous. If I saw someone praying just before they went on a flight (they wouldn't think that anybody would find it sus in this day and age and couldn't pick a better time?!) AND cursing the united states (Who hates the US more than a terrorist, how could you not see this as a stupid thing to do??!!), yeh i'd freak out and report it!
I'm tired of people trying sooo hard to be politcally correct that they're losing sense of reality, let's face it there are Muslim terrorists out there and it is not worth potentially another semptember 11 attack just to make a few people comfortable. I applaud the people who had the balls to speak up, and I hope passengers vigilance will preclude any terrorist attacks in the future, they should be commended not condemned.
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Old 04-01-2007, 06:20 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by dazzlingamy
Because it IS a race issue? Fearful people (due to your fucking fear mongering media machine) saw some islamic immans (who were probably in religious dress) and were praying and immediately went 'FUCK TERORISTS!' and they were discrimminated against for small things that any other normal "non muslim" passanger who did them would not have got a second glance and missed their flight.

Its just another reason why its shit to be muslim in the US
If I was sitting next to an anglo repeatedly praying under their breath to Allah on a plane I would consider it suspicious; it's not a race issue but it clearly is a religious issue.
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Old 04-01-2007, 08:00 AM   #18
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I see people praying before they get on the plane all the time. I don't see it as suspicious at all.

I understand people are testy when flying, but really, kicking people off a plane because of some unfounded silly little fears is ludicrious. If you are so concerned, spend your whole entire flight watching them like hawks and the minute they get up to use the bathroom jump on them and place them in a choke hold, proud of the fact that you saved the lives of everyone on board.

Seriously, there is no way sept 11 would ever happen again. The reason why it happened was the people on the plane didn't realised it was a total suicide mission.

I don't think people tattling on some immans as "caring" i think they are over the top hysterical people who need to think twice before opening their mouths.
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Old 04-01-2007, 12:34 PM   #19
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Just a simple question here:

When was the last time ANYONE here has seen someone MUSLIM pray at the airport?

Probably never?

I am at the airport close to 11 hours a day, five days a week. I see Christian groups praying together before a trip outside of the secure area roughly two times a week. I was raised Christian. As soon as I see them, I know what they are doing due to my knowledge/history. If I saw a group in the boarding area CHANTING (not knowing that this is prayer), I would be somewhat suspicious.

I would hope that whatever authority was notified would determine that that is their form of prayer (I could not possibly know of every religious form of prayer, and I doubt that anyone on this board would be able determine this too).

Now, add on cursing the U.S. and loudly mentioning Saddam Hussein, and I would be scared as crap to get on the plane with these individuals. If they are cursing ANYTHING in the gate area loudly, how will they handle any minor safety problem in the air? Will they accept the authority of the flight attendant yelling commands at them?

And as for the seatbelt extension issue...most of these gentlemen would not normally require a seatbelt extension just ADDING to their suspicious behavior.
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Old 04-01-2007, 01:18 PM   #20
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Did they really curse America and mention Saddam Hussein, or was it rather the impression?
Saddam and Hussein are common names in Arabic countries. If they spoke in Arabic some passenger might just heard some snippets and made a connection in his mind.

I think it's well known how Muslims preach, but I could be wrong.

I'm not against speaking up when you recognize suspicious behaviour, and I wouldn't condemn the passengers here.
But after the security searched the men and everything and couldn't find anything suspicous why did they have to question these men for hours?

What should they've done with the seatbelt extensions?

Additionally, Muslims preach five times a day, and orthodox Muslims are very strict with their praying.
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