lmjhitman said:
actually, i disagree with that.
i think, in general, men are able to overcome not being good-looking by being wealthy or powerful or athletic or, ehm, a rockstar, or even just by being funny or sweet.
for women, it's be pretty or go home. no amount of money, power, or charisma makes a woman attractive, to the general population that is.
I disagree too, although I'm not sure I fully understood, Lies, quite what you're suggesting, since to my ear your qualification that men's standards "aren't nearly as outrageous and hyper-sexualized" seems to contradict your assessment that the amount of pressure is the same.
I do think it's important though to keep in mind that we're talking about these pressures as individual men and women experience them, which isn't necessarily the same as how others (particularly of the opposite sex) imagine the pressures on said individuals to be. I know plenty of female academics who feel quite pleased with their professional achievements but regularly beat up on themselves for not being attractive enough, and I know plenty of male academics who seldom despair over their appearance but see themselves as losers compared to their (male) friends who've made much more money in other careers. I wouldn't say most in either group dwell on these things to the point where it just cripples them emotionally, but both kinds of pain are real, and both seem pretty sad and wasteful from my POV. In neither case are these self-perceptions in line with how most students and colleagues of these folks actually perceive them--I don't look at the woman whose office is next to mine and think, "Great teacher eval scores, shame about the legs," nor do I look at the man whose office is next to mine and think, "That article he just published was great, but what a loser, barely supporting his family on that pathetic 30K income." I know for a fact that they have these thoughts about themselves, though, and I also know for a fact that both have family members who lecture them for these "failings." They shouldn't listen to them, and most of the time they
do argue back, but unfortunately they've internalized these voices (and others) to the point that it melds with their own sometimes.
But again, I find it particularly upsetting when verbalizing these kinds of sentiments becomes some kind of social rite of passage--"let's all sit around bemoaning how inadequate and unworthy we are". It's good to be able to express your feelings, many men in particular don't do it enough, and if my sense in a given situation is that here's someone opening up about things that trouble them deeply and seeking advice and support, then of course I'm going to listen sympathetically and offer what help I can. But collective self-loathing isn't always therapeutic and, IMHO, sometimes it's better to encourage everyone to stop fixating on imagined inadequacies and talk about more positive things instead. We're all going to succumb to invidiously comparing ourselves to ideals from time to time, but like Lies said earlier, ultimately you DO have a choice not to drive yourself into a tailspin over it. It simply isn't true that no one will love, respect or admire you because of these "failings"--yes, some will be shallow or thoughtless or just plain blind enough to do so, and the incentives from media and elsewhere to compare yourself to the Rich and the Beautiful aren't likely to disappear anytime soon, but that doesn't mean you have to listen, and you shouldn't.
And some people have way too much confidence, baby. That's very unattractive to many people.
Then I pic-googled "hot girl" and most of the first images were anorexic looking girls or pornographic poses. It seems that the ideal for women is far more polarized and sexualized than that of men.
