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Old 05-13-2007, 08:19 PM   #1
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Sd#339

Sunday Dispatch #339


Hymn to a Good Wife

A good woman is hard to find,
and worth far more than diamonds.
Her husband trusts her without reserve,
and never has reason to regret it.
Never spiteful, she treats him generously
all her life long.
She shops around for the best yarns and cottons,
and enjoys knitting and sewing.
She's like a trading ship that sails to faraway places
and brings back exotic surprises.
She's up before dawn, preparing breakfast
for her family and organizing her day.
She looks over a field and buys it,
then, with money she's put aside, plants a garden.
First thing in the morning, she dresses for work,
rolls up her sleeves, eager to get started.
She senses the worth of her work,
is in no hurry to call it quits for the day.
She's skilled in the crafts of home and hearth,
diligent in homemaking.
She's quick to assist anyone in need,
reaches out to help the poor.
She doesn't worry about her family when it snows;
their winter clothes are all mended and ready to wear.
She makes her own clothing,
and dresses in colorful linens and silks.
Her husband is greatly respected
when he deliberates with the city fathers.
She designs gowns and sells them,
brings the sweaters she knits to the dress shops.
Her clothes are well-made and elegant,
and she always faces tomorrow with a smile.
When she speaks she has something worthwhile to say,
and she always says it kindly.
She keeps an eye on everyone in her household,
and keeps them all busy and productive.
Her children respect and bless her;
her husband joins in with words of praise:
"Many women have done wonderful things,
but you've outclassed them all!"
Charm can mislead and beauty soon fades.
The woman to be admired and praised
is the woman who lives in the Fear-of-God.
Give her everything she deserves!
Festoon her life with praises!

~Proverbs 31:10-31 (The Message)
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Old 05-13-2007, 11:43 PM   #2
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Praise God!
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Old 05-14-2007, 02:57 AM   #3
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Does anyone really believe that?
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Old 05-14-2007, 03:00 AM   #4
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Oh, is this a wonderfully traditional (read sickenly chauvinistic and grossly outdated) "dispatch" in lieu of Mothers Day? Can't quite recall when you yanks have yours.
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Old 05-14-2007, 03:58 AM   #5
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Re: Sd#339

Quote:
Originally posted by the iron horse
She's like a trading ship that sails to faraway places
and brings back exotic surprises.
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Old 05-14-2007, 06:36 AM   #6
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Angela, are you not wearing your "colourful linens and silks" today?
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Old 05-14-2007, 06:53 AM   #7
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Old 05-14-2007, 08:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by DrTeeth
Angela, are you not wearing your "colourful linens and silks" today?
Alas, there's nothing gay about my attire today. I'm wearing a black t-shirt and grey tracksuit pants. I got up to a brilliant sunny morning, rolled my (imaginary) sleeves up and thought 'today is the day I help the Husband.' I will scrub the house from top to bottom and discipline the children to be seen and not heard. I can dress more appropriately in time for the Husband to arrive home to a nice cool drink while dinner is served.

I sincerely doubt any woman worth her weight would undertake homely duties in her best attire.
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Old 05-14-2007, 09:22 PM   #9
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That, in a much less ridiculous translation, was read at my beloved sister-in-law's funeral. My husband (her brother) and I were simultaneously incensed and amused at the thought of Steve's incredible sister actually fitting that description.

Ah, patriarchy.
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Old 05-14-2007, 09:47 PM   #10
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^ Was she Jewish, by chance? I've heard that among certain sects it's common for that passage both to be sung by the husband to the wife every Sabbath, and then to be read at a woman's funeral. Personally, I've never known anyone who used it that way--the standard practice in my experience is for everyone in the family to sing it, not to "the lady of the house" but to greet Shabbat haMalka, the feminine personification of the Sabbath who is envisioned as a bride--it's part of a cycle of songs sung at Sabbath to welcome her presence, and that's been a tradition since the 14th century. I'm not sure where the custom that you sing it your wife/mother on special occasions to honor her comes from; it certainly isn't a particularly ancient one. I can only imagine how amused my father would have been at the idea that he was supposed to look my mother in the eye every Sabbath and earnestly sing all this stuff about tirelessly sewing and looking after the servants (they dropped that part from this translation) to her.

Of course obviously it was originally intended to honor some sort of composite ideal woman (and a decidely well-to-do one at that), but then we're talking 2500+-year-old presumptions about what qualities are needed to make a woman chayil (meaning someone of prowess, formidability, strength--not "good" as this rather blandly and soppily and puts it). In a few communities that may still apply--I have to imagine it's mostly understood allegorically among whoever it is that holds the custom of singing it to their wife, though.

And yes, it's a highly eccentric translation, to put it mildly.
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Old 05-14-2007, 09:49 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by yolland
^ Was she Jewish, by chance?
No. Church of Christ.
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Old 05-14-2007, 09:53 PM   #12
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Would someone be so kind as to post some other translations? I don't know what to search for myself. And is anyone willing to also post what their own interpretations are? Yours is interesting, Yolland, though like you I cannot see its relevance for today's times.
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Old 05-15-2007, 01:09 AM   #13
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אֵשֶׁת-חַיִל מִי יִמְצָא וְרָחֹק מִפְּנִינִים מִכְרָהּ
eshet chayil mi yimtza verachok mippeninim michrah
בָּטַח בָּהּ לֵב בַּעְלָהּ וְשָׁלָל לֹא יֶחְסָר
batach bah lev ba'lah veshalal lo yechsar
גְּמָלַתְהוּ טוֹב וְלֹארָע כֹּל יְמֵי חַיֶּיהָ
gemalathu tov velo-ra kol yemei chaiyeiha
דָּרְשָׁה צֶמֶר וּפִשְׁתִּים וַתַּעַשׂ בְּחֵפֶץ כַּפֶּיהָ
dareshah tzemer ufishtim vatta'as bechefetz kappeiha
הָיְתָה כָּאֳנִיּוֹת סוֹחֵר מִמֶּרְחָק תָּבִיא לַחְמָהּ
hayetah ka'oniyot socher mimmerchak tavi lachmah
וַתָּקָם בְּעוֹד לַיְלָהוַתִּתֵּן טֶרֶף לְבֵיתָהּ וְחֹק לְנַעֲרֹתֶיהָ
vattakam be'od laylah vattitten teref leveitah vechok lena'roteiha
זָמְמָה שָׂדֶה וַתִּקָּחֵהוּ מִפְּרִי כַפֶּיהָ נָטְעָה כָּרֶם
zamemah sadeh vattikkachehu mipperi chappeiha nate'ah karem
חָגְרָה בְעוֹז מָתְנֶיהָ וַתְּאַמֵּץ זְרוֹעֹתֶיהָ
chagerah ve'oz mateneiha vatte'ammetz zero'oteiha
טָעֲמָה כִּי-טוֹב סַחְרָהּ לֹא-יִכְבֶּה בַלַּיְלָה נֵרָהּ
ta'amah ki-tov sachrah lo-yichbeh vallaylah nerah
יָדֶיהָ שִׁלְּחָה בַכִּישׁוֹר וְכַפֶּיהָ תָּמְכוּ פָלֶךְ
yadeiha shillechah vakkishor vechappeiha tamechu falech
כַּפָּהּ פָּרְשָׂה לֶעָנִי וְיָדֶיהָ שִׁלְּחָה לָאֶבְיוֹן
kappah paresah le'ani veyadeiha shillechah la'evyon
לֹאתִירָא לְבֵיתָהּ מִשָּׁלֶג כִּי כָלבֵּיתָהּ לָבֻשׁ שָׁנִים
lo-tira leveitah mishaleg ki chol-beitah lavush shanim
מַרְבַדִּים עָשְׂתָהלָּהּ שֵׁשׁ וְאַרְגָּמָן לְבוּשָׁהּ
marvaddim asetah-lah shesh ve'argaman levushah
נוֹדָע בַּשְּׁעָרִים בַּעְלָהּ בְּשִׁבְתּוֹ עִםזִקְנֵיאָרֶץ
noda bashe'arim ba'lah beshivto imzik nei-aretz
סָדִין עָשְׂתָה וַתִּמְכֹּר וַחֲגוֹר נָתְנָה לַכְּנַעֲנִי
sadin asetah vattimkor vachagor natenah lakkena'ani
עֹזוְהָדָר לְבוּשָׁהּ וַתִּשְׂחַק לְיוֹם אַחֲרוֹן
oz-vehadar levushah vattischak leyom acharon
פִּיהָ פָּתְחָה בְחָכְמָה וְתוֹרַת חֶסֶד עַללְשׁוֹנָהּ
piha patechah vechachemah vetorat chesed al-leshonah
צוֹפִיָּה הֲלִיכוֹת בֵּיתָהּ וְלֶחֶם עַצְלוּת לֹא תֹאכֵל
tzofiyah halichot beitah velechem atzlut lo tochel
קָמוּ בָנֶיהָ וַיְאַשְּׁרוּהָ בַּעְלָהּ וַיְהַלְלָהּ
kamu vaneiha vay'asheruha ba'lah vayhallah
רַבּוֹת בָּנוֹת עָשׂוּ חָיִל וְאַתְּ עָלִית עַלכֻּלָּנָה
rabbot banot asu chayil ve'atte alit al-kullanah
שֶׁקֶר הַחֵן וְהֶבֶל הַיֹּפִי אִשָּׁה יִרְאַתיְהוָה הִיא תִתְהַלָּל
sheker hachen vehevel haiyofi ishah yir'at-hashem hi tithallal
תְּנוּלָהּ מִפְּרִי יָדֶיהָ וִיהַלְלוּהָ בַשְּׁעָרִים מַעֲשֶׂיהָ
tenu-lah mipperi yadeiha vihalluha vashe'arim ma'aseiha




The Hebrew is kind of cool because it's written in the form of an acrostic. Honestly I don't know much about the various translations out there as I don't use one, but without spending a lot of time on it, this is roughly how I'd translate it (this is fairly literal, BTW):


A woman of prowess is priceless, her worth far beyond rubies.
Her husband trusts her with all his heart, and wants for nothing.
She requites him good, never evil, all the days of her life.
She seeks out wool and flax, and sets her hand to them with a will.
Like the merchants' ships, she brings in the bread from afar.
She rises before dawn to provide meat for her household, and a share for the servants.
She considers an estate and buys it; with the fruit of her labors she plants a vineyard.
She clothes herself in strength, and exerts herself vigorously.
She sees that her yield is good; her lamp burns into the night.
She keeps one hand to the spinning-staff; the other works the spindle.
Her palm is open to the poor, her hand extended to the needy.
She fears not for her household in the snow, for they are clothed in twice-dipped scarlet.
She makes quilts of tapestry, and for herself clothes of fine linen and purple.
Her husband is distinguished in the city, and sits among the elders of the land.
She makes fine cloth and sells it, and waist-belts for the merchants.
Strength and honor are her clothing; she rejoices for the future.
Her words are full of wisdom, the teaching of kindness her tongue.
She looks to the goings of her household, and eats not the bread of idleness.
Her children call her blessed, and her husband praises her:
"Many women are accomplished, but you surpass them all."
Charm is deceptive, beauty a vain illusion, but the woman who reveres God shall be praised.
Let her savor the fruits of her labors; let her works be praised throughout the land.



The passage is preceded, within the same chapter, by an obscure exhortation attributed to the mother of Lemuel, king of a (non-Hebrew) north Arabian tribe. Apparently Lemuel had both a drinking problem and a chasing-after-women (the wrong kind) problem; his mother chides him that he is abdicating his responsibilities as a king, and exhorts him to devote his energies to championing the poor, the needy and the persecuted. The passage which follows it could thus be seen as a coda of sorts illustrating the sort of woman a wise man ought to desire, although in fact it was almost certainly a later addition.

In the Talmud there are various interpretations offered for the passage, ranging from the prosaic (it describes the ideal wife, and by extension the ideal lifestyle) to the allegorical (it depicts how the relationship between God and the people of Israel ought to be) to the whimsical (it's a puzzle of sorts in which each sentence refers to some particular woman in Jewish history, and the reader is meant to deduce who each is). But the former is doubtless the most 'realistic'; it perfectly fits the plain meaning of the text, which makes sense as a description of what the composite ideal woman of the day would have been like. It couldn't possibly ever have been very 'representative' though, as it lists too many behaviors which the average woman wouldn't have had the resources to engage in...purchasing real estate, having servants, producing fine fabrics and running a brisk business selling them, etc.--clearly it depicts, among other things, a wealthy businesswoman with sharp business sense. To that extent, perhaps there's also a do-good-and-you-will-do-well-(financially) message intended. In any case, ultimately the 'main point' seems to be something roughly along the lines of: The ideal woman is hardworking and ambitious, but also wise, kind, and devout. Pretty much what the rest of the book of Proverbs describes the ideal man as being.

But, as far as anyone today trying to treat the passage literally as some laundry list of expectations for what any "good woman" (apparently as opposed to any "good man") ought to be skilled in--sewing, cooking, "gardening" etc.--then yes, obviously in our culture that much is pretty irrelevant, or at least should be. Although it wouldn't be a bad thing if more people, male and female alike, knew how to cook and to select basic necessities like clothing and food wisely and economically...
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Old 05-15-2007, 06:17 AM   #14
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Well, I think Yolland covered that one pretty nicely. . .

I will add that The Message--the paraphrase (NOT the translation--there is a difference. The Message is bascially Eugene Peterson, the author, writing the Bible in his own words) from which the orignal SD was taken from is not really one of my favorites.

It's written in a sort of conversational style, that while admittedly easy to read also comes across--at least to me--as overly wordy and a bit corny.

I also think that trying to rewrite Proverbs 31 in a "modern" context is a bit of a fool's errand--at least the way it was done here. You're taking something written in a particular cultural context and removing that context so that you're left with a lady that likes to knit sweaters. . .
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Old 05-15-2007, 08:54 AM   #15
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^ While I certainly didn't think it was a bad translation of the passage--just 'highly eccentric,' as I said earlier--one thing I quite disliked about it was that it struck me at several points as crossing the line between paraphrasing for clarity and force of meaning's sake, on the one hand, and projecting contemporary notions and attitudes onto the text so as to make it seem falsely and contrivedly familiar, on the other. Obviously there's a place for suggesting applications of scripturally derived principles and ideas to present-day circumstances--but IMHO, that's what sermons, commentaries and popular religious literature are for. If you really believe some scripture(s) has great value in its own right, then I don't understand why you wouldn't be willing to make the effort to give it a close reading in a translation that approximates the original language reasonably well, and if there are footnotes and interpretive overviews and so forth to help you better appreciate some of the layers of nuance and meaning inevitably lost in the translation process, so much the better. To me, that doesn't make the text frozen in amber or hopelessly and alienatingly irrelevant-seeming; on the contrary, it makes it far more powerful, poignant, and rich with meaning, and actually puts you in a better position to appreciate what's timeless and enduring and alive in it in a way that inspires much more profoundly than some zingily catchy and easy-to-swallow "paraphrase" can. This doesn't just apply to scriptural study; I would say the same about literature as well.

I Googled for a little info about him, and ironically (I mean with regard to the apparent intent of the translation, not the quality of it) Peterson himself holds a Master's in Hebrew and studied New Testament Greek in seminary school as well. So I'm sure his determination to "make it real" is, for him, firmly anchored in a deep appreciation of the language and historic context of the original, which is wonderful. But for many more years than that he was also a pastor, so perhaps it's his sermonizing instincts more than anything else coming to the fore here. Nothing wrong with those, no doubt he was a great pastor, but that kind of work is usually much more about outreach and immersion in community and nurturing a particular type of lifestyle and ethos than it is about leading people in study, and coming to know and love the world these texts grew out of--even though, IMHO, that's what's needed to fully and profoundly appreciate them. That said, especially as a teacher, I can sympathize with his desire to reach an audience who may lack the motivation to really grapple with the text; but, I'm skeptical as to how much capacity "paraphrasing" (again, especially when it strays into projecting) ultimately has to make up for what motivation can't supply.

I will say, though, that the line between "translation" and "paraphrasing" is a very fuzzy and murky one--all translation is paraphrasing to some extent, and while for example I played it fairly conservative with how I translated that passage, there were a couple instances where I substituted an English idiom for a Hebrew one because I felt it conveyed the sense of the original better, and a couple others where I hesitated before rendering it more or less directly, because there were nuances obvious to me in the Hebrew that I knew would get lost...yet would yield something both clunky and misleading if I tried too hard to spell it out. Most of all, what I wanted to get across was that it's clear in the original that this ideal woman is chayil, formidable, a "woman of prowess" who literally brings (and manages) profit, as well as wisdom and kindness, into her household...not simply a proverbial--to us--'happy homemaker' whose sole joy is to wait on her husband and children and make pretty "sweaters" and tasty "breakfasts". Hopefully I succeeded in that...
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Old 05-15-2007, 03:55 PM   #16
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I'm sure most of you know that for many years, Bono has been promoting Eugene and the Message as his 'paraphrase' of choice. He is a big fan...

http://www.atu2.com/news/connections/peterson/

Quote:
U2 Connections: Eugene Peterson

by Angela Pancella

What can I give back to God for the blessings he's poured out on me? I'll lift high the cup of salvation -- A toast to God! I'll pray in the name of God; I'll complete what I promised God I'd do, And I'll do it together with his people.


Sound familiar? Bono recited these lines, or some variation on them, before "Where the Streets Have No Name" throughout the Elevation tour. U2-watchers online quickly traced them to Psalm 116. You'd be hard-pressed to find an expression like "a toast to God!" in the Bible on the family bookshelf, however. Most fans, if they gave the matter any thought, probably assumed Bono had done a little creative paraphrasing. Bono putting an ear-catching spin on Biblical passages is, after all, nothing new. (He once described Jesus summing the law into "Love God and love your neighbor as you love yourself," then saying "That's what I'm about! That's my Greatest Hits!") But just like all those uncredited lyrics from other people's songs that end up sung during U2 concerts, this translation of Psalm 116 was not a Bono original. It is the work of Eugene Peterson, poet, Professor Emeritus at Regent College in Vancouver, and for 35 years a pastor.


Does the name sound familiar? Bono's been dropping it in interviews for the last several years, even mentioning that he'd been reading Peterson's translation of the New Testament to his dying father. However, the fact that he swiped Peterson's Psalm 116 for the introduction to Streets hasn't come up.


Peterson's complete American English translation of the Christian Scriptures, The Message Bible, hits bookshelves in July. In the promotional materials heralding this, a story is told of Peterson and U2: "Once, while teaching in Vancouver, some of Peterson's students became very excited because Bono of the rock band U2 said The Message was the most important book he'd read in his whole life. The students thought this a great triumph. Eugene didn't recognize either Bono or U2."


So when interviewing Peterson for @U2 (a project which went through most communications media: I emailed the questions to NavPress, publisher of The Message, and they mailed me the answers Peterson faxed back to them), I asked first if he had learned any more about the band. "Yes, I am familiar with Bono and U-2 [sic]. A year or so ago (maybe less) their chaplain/pastor who was traveling with them at the time, called and asked me to come to Chicago to meet them. I wasn't able to get away at the time but I had a lovely conversation with him. And many of my younger friends and ex-students keep me posted on the latest from U-2. When the Rolling Stones [sic] interview with them came out a few months ago, I got clippings sent to me from all over the world!"


(Presumably he's referring here to the Rolling Stone interview in December of 2001, where Bono was asked about his favorite reading materials: "...there's a translation of Scriptures -- the New Testament and the Books of Wisdom -- that this guy Eugene Peterson has undertaken. It has been a great strength to me. He's a poet and a scholar, and he's brought the text back to the tone in which the books were written.")


What did he think about having a quote from his work recited, uncredited, in front of 20,000 concertgoers at a time?


"My reaction? Pleased, very pleased. Bono is singing to the very people I did this work for. I feel that we are allies in this. He is helping get me and The Message into the company of the very people Jesus spent much of his time with."


The seed for The Message was planted during his pastoral work, Peterson says in a press release. He was trying to get across the fire and wild words of Paul's letter to the Galatians in a Bible study class, but his parishioners were paying more attention to the pot of coffee in the church basement. "It was just awful. They'd fill up their coffee cups and stir in sugar and cream and look at their cups and they weren't getting it. It was just really bad. I went home after the third week and said to my wife that I was going to teach them Greek. If they could read it in Greek they would get it, they'd understand what a revolutionary text it is and couldn't just keep living in their ruts. She agreed that would empty the class out fast."


Instead, Peterson translated Galatians himself. In the interview with @U2 he explains his approach to this and other books of the Bible: "The largest influence on the work of The Message, after the Greek and Hebrew text itself, was 35 years working as a pastor, listening, listening, listening to people, trying to get these original texts in their idiom, their imaginations, the way they talked. I always felt I was on the border of two countries where they spoke different languages -- the bible language and the American language. I kept asking myself, if Isaiah or John were writing what they wrote for these people I am living with, how would they say it?"


Here's an example of that approach, from the sixth chapter of Galatians: "Make a careful exploration of who you are and the work you have been given, and then sink yourself into that. Don't be impressed with yourself. Don't compare yourself with others. Each of you must take responsibility for doing the creative best you can with your own life."


All of Paul's letters have this vibrancy in Peterson's translation. How did working these (which, being letters, have a built-in immediacy) into contemporary language compare to working on the other books, with their variety of moods and tones?


"Paul is an extravagant, inventive poet. His syntax is sometimes wild. It's an adventure to enter into his imagination and get the same sounds and meanings in American. The gospels were very different, much more difficult because there is a simplicity and directness that is a real challenge to get across into American English. By the time I got to the Old Testament I was prepared for the variations in style and the long stretches of poetry."


It would be interesting to find out from Bono just why he has been so impressed by this translation. Peterson can't speak to that, but he can talk about reactions from people in similar circumstance to Bono's. "When I started this, I really had in mind people who had never read the Bible before," he says. "What took me by surprise and continues to please me is how many speak or write to me as 'having read the Bible all my life and now, finally, I get it.'"


Bono's familiarity with the Bible is evident through his lyrics, but he doesn't seem to have been calcified by custom into the "my Bible is the only Bible" syndrome. This can happen when someone is brought up to read the Bible, or certain passages, so many times that the word choices of a given translation are confused with the Holy Writ itself. Bono's unusual religious upbringing and allergic reaction to fundamentalism may have helped keep him from thinking that Jesus spoke in, say, King James English. A similar trap, which I confess colors my ability to fully appreciate The Message Bible, opens up because most translations have been made in the best and most literary writing possible. One can come to love the language so much, the meaning becomes secondary. For example, there is a passage in the twelfth chapter of Hebrews which is rendered in exquisite prose in "my" Bible:


"You have not approached that which could be touched and a blazing fire and gloomy darkness and storm and a trumpet blast and a voice speaking words such that those who heard begged that no message be further addressed to them..."


The Message Bible's take on the same words seems flat by comparison:
"Unlike your ancestors, you didn't come to Mount Sinai -- all that volcanic blaze and earthshaking rumble -- to hear God speak."


When asked, Peterson says he has received very few complaints that he tinkered with well-loved language. "I was prepared for an all-out assault but I have received very little opposition or criticism. Maybe there has been a shift in our population from a bible reading people who know their bibles well and have no reason to want something different, to a non-bible reading country with a huge population of people who go to U-2 concerts who didn't know that anything like this bible even existed. And when they learn about it they are ready to read."


(For more information about The Message Bible, visit www.messagebible.com. To order online, visit Amazon.com.)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Postscript: In June 2002 the Navigators, the ministry group behind "The Message"'s publication, held a celebration which included showing videotaped testimonials from various fans of the book. Bono sent this greeting:

"Hi Mr. Peterson, Eugene. My name is Bono. I'm a singer with the group U2. I wanted to sort of video message you my thanks, and our thanks in the band, for this remarkable work you've done translating the Scriptures. Really, really a remarkable work."

"As a songwriter, it was very clear to me that you were a poet as well as a scholar. You brought the musicality to God's Word that I'm sure was there, was always there in intention.

"There have been some great translations, some very literary translations, but no translations that I've read that speaks to me in my own language. So I want to thank you for that."

"And it's been ten years, that's a long time, so take a rest now, won't you? Bye."
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Old 05-15-2007, 10:13 PM   #17
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I had no idea. I don't really follow much of what Bono says, though.
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Old 05-15-2007, 10:56 PM   #18
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Someone who can't read the original isn't in a position to comment as to how well a given translation conveys "the tone in which the books were written" or whether it "[brings] the musicality to God's Word that I'm sure was there." If he feels it "speaks to me in my own language," fine, but that's something totally different. Why should the Bible have to say exactly what Bono wants it to say?

I don't claim to have any special skill as a translator. But being able to read Proverbs 31 in both the original and Peterson's translation, I feel confident saying there's no profound revelation of what the "tone" of the Hebrew is like in his version; on the contrary, there were lines I would never have been able to recognize out of context, as they were outright fabrications. If you have to wholly make up lines in order to make the text speak your audience's "own language," then IMO that's crossing the line, and makes me doubt whether they really care about knowing the text at all.
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Old 05-15-2007, 11:27 PM   #19
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Well, that's nice that Bono digs The Message.

I'm not saying The Message is bad.

I just don't care for it all that much. There are other modern-day language paraphrases/translations that I personally prefer.

To each their own. . .

But I would say the things Yolland pointed out might be cause for caution. . . I mean, "outright fabrications". . .that's pretty heavy stuff.
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Old 05-16-2007, 12:59 AM   #20
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paraphrases put text in your own words but try to keep the essence of the text intact. I have The Message and do like the modernization of times of the text. I read both it and the NIV and find that the modern idioms help me think about the text in a different way. I suppose this is what sets The Message apart, it paraphrases by adapting the idioms to modern times.
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