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Old 07-22-2007, 05:17 PM   #141
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Your rebellion is piffle. Give up now.

(Brought to you by the dairy farmers of America.)
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Old 07-22-2007, 05:20 PM   #142
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I do think I bring up a good point.
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Old 07-22-2007, 05:39 PM   #143
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No, I think the whole "milk from another species" point is a valid one. Me? I love my dairy, so I can overlook the oddness of it.

But you shrouded your point in a veil of "tits."
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Old 07-22-2007, 05:59 PM   #144
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liesje

I am against ear and tail cropping and docking, but it is not/was not done for show.
Perhaps not originally, but on dogs that are only being shown or used as pets it is purely for looks.
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Old 07-22-2007, 07:58 PM   #145
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Quote:
Originally posted by indra


Perhaps not originally, but on dogs that are only being shown or used as pets it is purely for looks.
Right, which is why I am opposed to both and am glad it is banned in many countries, because most dogs are just pets. However, the purpose of most dogs is not to be a pet, and most dogs that are shown are also titled in their respective lines of work (or at least they should be!). Dobes have cropped ears and docked tails b/c they are working dogs meant for protection and ringsport so the floppy ears and long tail are dangerous. Erect ears also give the dog a more accurate "cone" for determining the source of a sound. Pointers' tails are so long and thin, if left undocked, they would always be injured while doing fieldwork. I'm less concerned with tail docking than ear cropping, since tail docking is not really a surgery and is done as soon as the pups are born, before they even fully develop their nerves (same for removing dew claws).

I have always wondered how Aussie people defend tail docking by saying the dog's longer hair and low carriage makes it easy for the tail to get snagged during work, when Border Collies to the same jobs at an ever lower carriage and always have tails. But whatever the reasons, they are functional, assuming the dog is performing it's function, and not solely a pet.

I like bushy tails and I like prick ears, so I stick to tailed breeds with naturally erect ears.


Oh, and I also think cow's milk is nasty and won't even eat cereal with milk.
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Old 07-22-2007, 10:16 PM   #146
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Quote:
Originally posted by corianderstem

But you shrouded your point in a veil of "tits."
Sorry. Bad habit of mine.
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Old 07-24-2007, 08:27 AM   #147
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Getting back to boiling cows in water. Can you honestly imagine
a) how big the tanks would have to be
b) The costs involved in keeping the tanks boiling
c) How slow a process it would be

All things considered, i think that would make leather on a par with gold cost wise!
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Old 07-24-2007, 07:27 PM   #148
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In America, nine times out of ten, it's for show, and for show /only/. Very rarely, you'll run across one that had it done for medical reasons.

I brought it up for a specific reason - cruelty to animals isn't limited to food production. It's sad, but true. I've seen plenty done to domestic animals, yet I see so many people running around protesting food animals being harmed.

I'm also curious as to what people propose to do with these animals after they cease to become money to ranchers and farmers? Realistically speaking, they will not maintain these animals. At best, they'll be turned loose to wreak havoc on ecosystems or just slaughtered. I hesitate to think what the worst may be.
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Old 07-24-2007, 07:46 PM   #149
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Quote:
Originally posted by gman
Getting back to boiling cows in water. Can you honestly imagine
a) how big the tanks would have to be
b) The costs involved in keeping the tanks boiling
c) How slow a process it would be

All things considered, i think that would make leather on a par with gold cost wise!
Keep this info away from Bush, Cheney & their rancher friends. I can see the $ $ in their eyes already.
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Old 07-28-2007, 03:32 AM   #150
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Isn't it cruel that we chop chickens' heads off, tear them limb from limb, deep fry them and eat them?

I don't hear many of you complaining about that.
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Old 07-28-2007, 06:06 PM   #151
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This thread makes me glad I don't eat red meat.
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Old 07-29-2007, 03:35 PM   #152
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Quote:
Originally posted by shart1780
Isn't it cruel that we chop chickens' heads off, tear them limb from limb, deep fry them and eat them?

I don't hear many of you complaining about that.
You're right - I don't generally complain about that. But then, I don't have any use for a chicken except to eat it. This doesn't mean I want the thing to be treated cruelly before it's killed and eaten, though. If you're going to kill it, do it cleanly or not at all. That's my only reason for considering vegetarianism. Cruelty is just unnecessary, no matter what's being killed. My only point is that in all of this emotional up-in-arms-ism, there's no real answer for the question of what to do with all those animals that would suddenly have no monetary value to the people who have been using them as food animals.

What do you do with them? Answer that one for me, would ya?
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Old 07-30-2007, 09:45 PM   #153
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hinder


My only point is that in all of this emotional up-in-arms-ism, there's no real answer for the question of what to do with all those animals that would suddenly have no monetary value to the people who have been using them as food animals.

What do you do with them? Answer that one for me, would ya?
But in the case everybody becomes vegetarian, the meat producers can just stop breeding the animals so then there would be no problem of too many animals.
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Old 07-31-2007, 04:51 PM   #154
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Quote:
Originally posted by shart1780
Isn't it cruel that we chop chickens' heads off, tear them limb from limb, deep fry them and eat them?

I don't hear many of you complaining about that.

I do find it cruel. I don't eat them either.
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Old 07-31-2007, 05:06 PM   #155
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Quote:
Originally posted by Infinitum98

But in the case everybody becomes vegetarian, the meat producers can just stop breeding the animals so then there would be no problem of too many animals.
Yep. No demand would mean no supply.

Certainly no one thinks these animals just appear out of the ether without any planning at all.
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Old 07-31-2007, 08:37 PM   #156
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Egads. Just - egads...
I can't believe I just read that.

Please, please, Infinitum: take a biology class. Seriously, I don't mean to be cruel, but the statement is so idiotic I begin to wonder if you know that animals continue to breed whether you like it or not unless you castrate or otherwise sterilize them all.

Been a long time since I've seen the old 'hear no evil, speak no evil, see no evil LA!' attitude.
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Old 08-01-2007, 08:46 AM   #157
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Do you seriously believe that every human being is going to go vegetarian over night???

Of course not, it will take decades to achieve this and as it does less and less livestock will be needed and therefore less and less livestock will be produced.

When and if there is no more consumption of meat then yes, we will be responsible for maintaining the population of the remaining animals. It's a sad fact that we humans have domesticated and bread them into something that does not have a place in nature anymore (whatever that is).

I like how your basic argument is that we have created this system of slaughter and while you admit it's cruel, it's just easier to continue the way it is...

This tends to be the general argument I hear from most people; "We've always done it this way, what are we supposed to do?"

Sad.
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Old 08-02-2007, 01:25 AM   #158
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hinder
Egads. Just - egads...
I can't believe I just read that.

Please, please, Infinitum: take a biology class. Seriously, I don't mean to be cruel, but the statement is so idiotic I begin to wonder if you know that animals continue to breed whether you like it or not unless you castrate or otherwise sterilize them all.

Been a long time since I've seen the old 'hear no evil, speak no evil, see no evil LA!' attitude.
I think I am going to go to the eye doctor becuase I can't convince myself that I just read that.

I don't want to make you look dumb, but have you ever heard of breeding animals just for meat? Do you seriously believe that all the cows, pigs, chickens, ducks, turkeys and eggs that humans consume come from nature and not from a breeding farm? Are you really that oblivious or were you joking with your post?
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