Poll: If Election were today, would you vote Bush? (merged)

[anitram]

I believe the laws in this country allow each citizen to vote at most once.

I am not in "this country."

 

[deep]

In what sense?

You'd better bring your A-game if you want to argue probability with a mathematician...

We do not elect Presidents on one man one vote.

A candidate needs 270 electoral votes of the 538 to be elected President.

A vote from a person voting in V. P. Cheney?s state of Wyoming has over almost times the value of nbcrudsader?s vote in California.

 

[speedracer]

We do not elect Presidents on one man one vote.

A candidate needs 270 electoral votes of the 538 to be elected President.

A vote from a person voting in V. P. Cheney?s state of Wyoming has over almost times the value of nbcrudsader?s vote in California.

I think you left out the number 18 in your post, 18 being the ratio of California's electoral college (54) to Wyoming's (3).

So a voter in Wyoming has 18x the power of a voter in California to influence his state's electoral college. But that's exactly cancelled out because the Wyoming electoral college is 1/18th the size of California's.

Actually, what I wrote isn't quite true. California has 52 representatives and Wyoming 1 because Wyoming has roughly 1/52 the population of California. (Actually, looking at population figures it's closer to 1/72.) So it is true, a voter in Wyoming has 72/18 = 4 times the power of a voter in California. I doubt that's what you meant though.

The other point that could be raised is that in a state dominated by one party (say, Democrats in Massachusetts), a voter of the other party is almost powerless. I would counter by saying that (1) it's entirely possible that a bunch of voters who feel that way are staying at home and that there are enough of them to swing the electoral college vote in the other direction; and (2) I think that most voters' opinions are actually much more pliable than we realize and that they could be persuaded to change their votes if only the candidates and campaigners were more eloquent and persuasive.

Anyway, the electoral college is clearly a dinosaur and should be revoked. People say that without it, candidates will campaign only in densely populated areas, but I say that with the explosion of media in recent years, anybody who cares enough about voting can educate him or herself about the candidates.

 

[STING2]

14 against Bush : 5 for Bush

 

[STING2]

Ahhh, Thanks Melon! Bush is doing a little better in this poll too, so far.

 

[deep]

Originally posted by speedracer


I think you left out the number 18 in your post, 18 being the ratio of California's electoral college (54) to Wyoming's (3).

not correct

So a voter in Wyoming has 18x the power of a voter in California to influence his state's electoral college. But that's exactly cancelled out because the Wyoming electoral college is 1/18th the size of California's.

Actually, what I wrote isn't quite true. California has 52 representatives and Wyoming 1 because Wyoming has roughly 1/52 the population of California. (Actually, looking at population figures it's closer to 1/72.) So it is true, a voter in Wyoming has 72/18 = 4 times the power of a voter in California. I doubt that's what you meant though.

Wyoming has three electral votes CA has 54
1 delegate per 160,333 people, each vote has 3.77 the value of a vote in California. Wyoming has .1779% of the U S population and .5576% of electoral college, 538 total.)


The other point that could be raised is that in a state dominated by one party (say, Democrats in Massachusetts), a voter of the other party is almost powerless. I would counter by saying that (1) it's entirely possible that a bunch of voters who feel that way are staying at home and that there are enough of them to swing the electoral college vote in the other direction; and (2) I think that most voters' opinions are actually much more pliable than we realize and that they could be persuaded to change their votes if only the candidates and campaigners were more eloquent and persuasive.

all that does not matter, i am talking about the value of a vote if one chooses to vote.

Anyway, the electoral college is clearly a dinosaur and should be revoked. People say that without it, candidates will campaign only in densely populated areas, but I say that with the explosion of media in recent years, anybody who cares enough about voting can educate him or herself about the candidates.

I agree completly with you here. The GOP traditionally wrote off WV with only one campaign office. Karl Rove staffed 14 offices in 2000, even though it had only 5? votes.

 

[tiny dancer]

Without hesitation-no.

 

[tiny dancer]

I voted no.

Angela

So did I.

 

[IWasBored]

aol has stripped my voting preiveleges until i figure out how to adjust something so i can accept cookies...or something like that...


i would not vote for bush today, tomorrow, or anytime in the future.

 

[FizzingWhizzbees]

No way.

 

[Popmartijn]

I'm not participating in this poll. As I cannot vote for the US presidential elections it is of no use to vote in this poll. That said, I do hope the US citizens choose a better president next time...

C ya!

Marty

 

[Angela Harlem]

These 2 threads have now been merged. If anyone wishes to vote, it might give a more reflective look at FYM's preferences. I would have put it in the merge, but dont want to fiddle with ballots etc.



Good poll idea STING and melon

 

[speedracer]

This discussion clearly is begging for another poll:

If you don't want Bush back in office, which non-Republican candidate do you want?

I may be voting for Bush, but I hope Howard Dean wins the Democratic nomination.

 

[Flaming Friar Sr]

i definitely say

 

[Dreadsox]

I may be voting for Bush, but I hope Howard Dean wins the Democratic nomination.

If Dean wins the nomination, Bush is a two term president. That is of course barring any unforseen scandal.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

No

And I think Dean better get his temper under control before it becomes a liability. I don't know much about him, but I'd like to find out more.

I'm waiting for some Democratic candidate to knock my socks off something tells me I'll be waiting quite a while

 

[speedracer]

MrsSpringsteen, you have to vote for someone, you know. Unless you vote for no one.

Dreadsox, I haven't been living in Massachusetts for that long, but our esteemed Senator Kerry strikes me as a self-important two-faced windbag. And I think Gephardt completely disgraced himself with his "when I'm president, we'll issue executive orders to overturn any wrong decision the Supreme Court makes" comment.

 

[sulawesigirl4]

I'd vote for Dean. And I don't buy the "he's too liberal" argument. We don't need Bush Lite. (not the beer, nor the president. )

 

[Dreadsox]

I'd vote for Dean. And I don't buy the "he's too liberal" argument. We don't need Bush Lite. (not the beer, nor the president. )

He is not centrist enough for me to NOT vote for Bush. I think there are many like me.

 

[Dreadsox]

Dreadsox, I haven't been living in Massachusetts for that long, but our esteemed Senator Kerry strikes me as a self-important two-faced windbag.

Kerry, just does nothing for me right now. I think he will be one of the top three. He is much less liberal than Kennedy but there is something about his personality that I am not drawn to.

Peace

 

[speedracer]

Dreadsox,

I implicitly raised a question that I will now make explicit: which Democratic candidate do you prefer? Kerry? Gephardt? Lieberman? Kucinich? Edwards? someone else?

 

[Dreadsox]

Dreadsox,

I implicitly raised a question that I will now make explicit: which Democratic candidate do you prefer? Kerry? Gephardt? Lieberman? Kucinich? Edwards? someone else?

I think that everyone can tell that Al SHarpton is my man!!!!!!!

Seriously, I am probably more in line with Lieberman and Kerry than anyone else in that field right now. I am hoping General Wesley Clark announces which party he belongs to and that he is running for President.

I am still at that waiting to see what happens though, it really too early to tell. I just know that there are things about the administration that bother me, and I am leaning towards change.

Have I somewhat answered your question?

 

[sulawesigirl4]

I think that everyone can tell that Al SHarpton is my man!!!!!!!

 

[speedracer]

I think that everyone can tell that Al SHarpton is my man!!!!!!!

Ah, so you're one of the cranks who's promoting Al Sharpton so that the Democrats can get whupped by Bush. Nice.

 

[Dreadsox]

Ah, so you're one of the cranks who's promoting Al Sharpton so that the Democrats can get whupped by Bush. Nice.

You do know I am kidding right?

Karl Rove wants Dean for that very reason though!

 

[speedracer]

You do know I am kidding right?

Karl Rove wants Dean for that very reason though!

My sarcasm detector is in working order, thanks.

I don't know why Rove thinks that Dean would be the easiest candidate to defeat. Presumably because of his opposition to the war before the fact?

Now that Dean appears convinced that we need to carry out the mission in Iraq and the greater war on terror that we've started, I think it's better to have him in charge than Kerry. Kerry's attempts at backtracking over his earlier support for the war in Iraq are kind of pathetic--he never ceases to tell us how his service in Vietnam makes him the most qualified candidate to be commander in chief, but then he goes back and tells us how Bush sold him, the rest of Congress and the American people a barrel of lies in order to garner support for the war in Iraq.

 

[Dreadsox]

My sarcasm detector is in working order, thanks.

I don't know why Rove thinks that Dean would be the easiest candidate to defeat. Presumably because of his opposition to the war before the fact?

I still think he is too left of center to pull the center to their side.

 

[oliveu2cm]

No

 

[STING2]

Popmartijn,

I think you and everyone that is not a US citizen should vote in the poll. This Poll is designed to look at how people here at FYM view Bush. FYM is an international place, and I hope everyone will vote and voice their opinion on the topic.

 

[joyfulgirl]

Under no circumstances.